Police and bad driving

[mph1977]

smegmore said:

vonhosen said:

He was charged with death by dangerous driving. A jury (having all the evidence before them) acquitted him of that, but found him guilty of the alternate charge of careless driving.

No st.

Pension entitlement in mind, no doubt.

A jury of 12 ordinary people in a criminal court, double .

if you were to suggest that aobut a military person being acquitted in a courts martial where the 'jury' is made up of Warrant Officers and Commissioned Officers ... therem ight just be a tiny ttiny tiny amount of truth , but to suggest it with regard to a police officer being tried in a Crown court ... jog on .

[Cliftonite]

Tribal Chestnut said:

I went past a Police van earlier doing an indicated 70 or so whilst plonked squarely in the middle lane. Lane 1 was empty. Naughty boy.

.
This is what headlamp flashers are for.

Seriously.

[aw51 121565]

vonhosen said:

Cooperman said:

simoid said:

Not sure what the legal definition is, but to a layman, that looks awfully like someone was:

Driving dangerously, and;
Causing death.

Yes, many who live in this area were disgusted by the decision not to find him guilty of 'causing Death by D.D.' and the instructor for 'aiding & abetting'.
They got less than someone who names the 'wrong' person on an S.172.
Funny old World!

You do appear to know rather less about the case than the jury did though.

You possibly overestimate juries ( ) but a serious thanks - as ever - for bringing some facts to this thread .

I absolutely acknowledge that it is extremely sad that someone died in this incident .

[vonhosen]

smegmore said:

vonhosen said:

He was charged with death by dangerous driving. A jury (having all the evidence before them) acquitted him of that, but found him guilty of the alternate charge of careless driving.

No st.

Pension entitlement in mind, no doubt.

What, that was in the mind of the jury?

[vonhosen]

mph1977 said:

vonhosen said:

simoid said:

Cooperman said:

Some may remember the Met.trainee driver, when doing 'pursuit training' up the A10 towards Cambridge from Royston and when they were doing 110 mph+, crashed into the back of the rear car in a queue at Harston. A young nurse was killed, but the trainee driver did not go to prison. In fact I believe there was no further action - accidental death being the verdict of the Coroner.

Not sure what the legal definition is, but to a layman, that looks awfully like someone was:

Driving dangerously, and;
Causing death.

He was charged with death by dangerous driving. A jury (having all the evidence before them) acquitted him of that, but found him guilty of the alternate charge of careless driving.

I presume this was before the charge of Causing Death by Careless Driving was available ?

It was, long before.
(1995 IIRC).

[vonhosen]

aw51 121565 said:

vonhosen said:

Cooperman said:

simoid said:

Not sure what the legal definition is, but to a layman, that looks awfully like someone was:

Driving dangerously, and;
Causing death.

Yes, many who live in this area were disgusted by the decision not to find him guilty of 'causing Death by D.D.' and the instructor for 'aiding & abetting'.
They got less than someone who names the 'wrong' person on an S.172.
Funny old World!

You do appear to know rather less about the case than the jury did though.

You possibly overestimate juries ( ) but a serious thanks - as ever - for bringing some facts to this thread .

I absolutely acknowledge that it is extremely sad that someone died in this incident .

As do I.

[Eclassy]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/inquiry-urged-in...

Juries eh....

Can a jury in Liverpool find Steven Gerrard guilty of assault if he is the aggressor?

[JumboBeef]

Ki3r said:

I'm guessing there where keep left signs coming onto the roundabout? In which case they have an exemption for them.

You cannot claim exemption to dangerous driving.....

[fushion julz]

Cliftonite said:

.
This is what headlamp flashers are for.

Seriously.

Bwahhahahah....

Seriously, what do you think will happen if you flash a marked police vehicle?

A few years ago I was going down (IIRC) the M4 and I was cruising at 70-75mph...came upon a car in the outside lane doing, perhaps, 60mph at best...inner 2 lanes were quiet...
I flashed my lights and was greeted by a lot of flashing blue lights and police signs (it was an unmarked car...dark Volvo, IIRC...was pulled over and given a proper grilling with the car being inspected thoroughly...

Was sent on my way after 30mins or so with a proper telling-off...

[Mr Trophy]

OP, quick question... Wasn't a BMW X5 by chance was it?

[mph1977]

vonhosen said:

It was, long before.
(1995 IIRC).

so while not a direct cause of bringing about ofthe offence of causing death by careless driving , it;s the sort of scenario which thecharge was brought in to cover. rather than the previous situation of if it wasn;'t dangerous/ reckless ( depending on date) causing death didn't feature .

If a similar incident to the one discussed were to happen today I presume causing death by careless would be the 'lesser' charge convicted if dangerous driving couldn't be proved.

[Zod]

Mk3Spitfire said:

Might not have been that bad. People often go off on one seeing a police car on the wrong side of the road. In response training you are taught to use the other side of the road to give a better view of the road ahead.

Not when there is traffic!

[mph1977]

Zod said:

Mk3Spitfire said:

Might not have been that bad. People often go off on one seeing a police car on the wrong side of the road. In response training you are taught to use the other side of the road to give a better view of the road ahead.

Not when there is traffic!

offsiding standing traffic and offsiding into Junctions is something which county mounties are taught now not just the Met ... there are some ambulance staff who offisde junctions as well but the wrong ones ... (YAS people in North Kirklees you knwo who you are and which junction i mean - although since the pub got demolished the sightlines are slightly better)

[Mk3Spitfire]

Zod said:

Not when there is traffic!

Well, the idea is that being in that position allows you to see the traffic and act accordingly.

[Cliftonite]

fushion julz said:

Bwahhahahah....

Seriously, what do you think will happen if you flash a marked police vehicle?

A few years ago I was going down (IIRC) the M4 and I was cruising at 70-75mph...came upon a car in the outside lane doing, perhaps, 60mph at best...inner 2 lanes were quiet...
I flashed my lights and was greeted by a lot of flashing blue lights and police signs (it was an unmarked car...dark Volvo, IIRC...was pulled over and given a proper grilling with the car being inspected thoroughly...

Was sent on my way after 30mins or so with a proper telling-off...

.

I have, on several occasions, flashed my headlights at marked police vehicles blocking my progress in overtaking lanes.

If what you describe is what really happened you should have given the police driver words of advice at the roadside. If these weren't accepted, then make a formal complaint re entrapment.

Police officers are not fools. If they know they are in a hole, they will stop digging. MTFU!

(And get a couple of dash cams! )

[Zod]

Mk3Spitfire said:

Zod said:

Not when there is traffic!

Well, the idea is that being in that position allows you to see the traffic and act accordingly.

Yes, I get that. I've done enough advanced training and I always position for visibility on country roads.

[Ki3r]

JumboBeef said:

You cannot claim exemption to dangerous driving.....

Where did I saw that?

[Sheepshanks]

Cliftonite said:

I have, on several occasions, flashed my headlights at marked police vehicles blocking my progress in overtaking lanes.

If what you describe is what really happened you should have given the police driver words of advice at the roadside. If these weren't accepted, then make a formal complaint re entrapment.

You're bonkers! That's not what flashing headlamps is for and I can't believe you've done that several times and not been stopped. I did it once to an marked car in the distance at night (so it was only obvious it was marked when everything reflected back at me ) and got stopped.


I did give "words of advice" to a traffic cop who looked about 12 a couple of years ago - but I think you need to be a certain age and to look like a powerfully built company director to be able to get away with that.

[Mk3Spitfire]

[Cliftonite]

Sheepshanks said:

Cliftonite said:

.

I have, on several occasions, flashed my headlights at marked police vehicles blocking my progress in overtaking lanes.

If what you describe is what really happened you should have given the police driver words of advice at the roadside. If these weren't accepted, then make a formal complaint re entrapment.

You're bonkers! That's not what flashing headlamps is for and I can't believe you've done that several times and not been stopped. I did it once to an marked car in the distance at night (so it was only obvious it was marked when everything reflected back at me ) and got stopped.

It's also an offence to stop on the motorway so expect to get done for that too.

It is exactly what a headlamp flash is for!! Warning of approach so the muppets can sort themselves out.

It can also be an offence not to stop on the hard shoulder of a motorway when invited to do so by a police officer. (Athough I would seek to find somewhere safer, but that is a thread for another day!).