A risky undertake on the A11. Any opinions?

[deltashad]

Mave said:

Retroman said:

And if more people join the queue it could easily be a few miles long where the inside lane only has 1 car, several miles ahead.
Kind of defeats the purpose of the overtaking lane if it gets to the stage you can make more progress in the inside lane.

But you can't, can you? Unless you undertake into someone's braking space and push to the front of the queue. Capacity of the road is set by progress through the bottleneck, not by what goes on behind it.

How much braking space do you need?

[Blakewater]

There's something taught in advanced driving known as the Diagonal Rule where, if you're in traffic moving in lanes, you keep clear space around you and at a diagonal angle to the traffic in the other lanes.



Just because someone has a space to his left it doesn't mean he should move over as he's maintaining a safe following distance behind the cars around him until he has a safe space ahead of the car to his left to move into. If he moves left all the people who "keep up with the traffic" by humping the car in front will refuse to make space for him to move out. If someone does some sterling PHer will nip round that driver on the inside accusing him of being a lane hogger.

Maintain this formation and there will be room for people to dodge round the cars within a gnat's pubic hair of them, as the Focus driver did, but that doesn't mean anyone is lane hogging.

Edited by Blakewater on Wednesday 29th October 20:04

[Mave]

deltashad said:

How much braking space do you need?

About 2 seconds? How much do you think?

[jmorgan]

Mave said:

deltashad said:

How many of you pull to the inside lane when a faster vehicle approaches from behind and you 'know' he will be passed before you can over take the car ahead of you staying at the same speed?

Passed by who?

Really is not the end of the world. I am out of the inside lane if passing, someone hoons up quicker they can wait for me to complete my manoeuvre.

[Retroman]

Mave said:

But you can't, can you? Unless you undertake into someone's braking space and push to the front of the queue. Capacity of the road is set by progress through the bottleneck, not by what goes on behind it.

If the queue of traffic in the right hand side lane is 3 miles long and the inside lane is clear with your junction / cut off 2 miles ahead you certainly can.

Edited by Retroman on Wednesday 29th October 20:35

[whyohwhy]

Retroman said:

If thw queue of traffic in the right hand side lane is 3 miles long and the inside lane is clear with your junction / cut off 2 miles ahead you certain can.

You don't live in the real world.

Why are people making up excuses for what is in anyone with any sense an abysmal piece of driving.

Is this what pistonheads has come to.

[deltashad]

whyohwhy said:

Retroman said:

If thw queue of traffic in the right hand side lane is 3 miles long and the inside lane is clear with your junction / cut off 2 miles ahead you certain can.

You don't live in the real world.

Why are people making up excuses for what is in anyone with any sense an abysmal piece of driving.

Is this what pistonheads has come to.

It was bad driving by the Focus, nearly a serious incident. But the problem with hogging the outside lane is ongoing and getting worse.

[fatboy18]

whyohwhy said:

Retroman said:

If thw queue of traffic in the right hand side lane is 3 miles long and the inside lane is clear with your junction / cut off 2 miles ahead you certain can.

You don't live in the real world.

Why are people making up excuses for what is in anyone with any sense an abysmal piece of driving.

Is this what pistonheads has come to.

You do realise its Half Term

[silentbrown]

Mave said:

About 2 seconds? How much do you think?

Unless, of course, there's some arse-sniffing Focus behind you intent on "making progress" when traffic conditions simply don't allow it.

THEN you have to increase your gap in front, to avoid getting rear-ended by him when the Citroen stuck up the tractor's chuff makes the inevitable kamikaze dive into your lane.

[Pit Pony]

Mave said:

KingNothing said:

instead of saying move back over when it's safe to allow him to pass as he wants to go faster.

What makes you think the camera car didn't want to go faster?

Nah. He looked in his mirror at the fast approaching focus and thought "Feck it, I can't be arsed to move lanes as there's a tractor coming up and he'll have to wait.

It was a st undertake though.

[Jazzer]

Focus man was probably the best driver on display, skilfully undertaking Dashy and leaving all the numpties in his wake.

Can we please end this thread??

[Pit Pony]

fatboy18 said:

You do realise its Half Term

I'm not sure that explains anything.

[Red Devil]

LucreLout said:

Mave said:

So where should the focus be?

In jail.

No, that's the driver (I doubt you could get a car through the cell door anyway).
The Focus should be in a secure compound. Or, better still, in a dismantler's yard awaiting the crusher.

whyohwhy said:

Retroman said:

If thw queue of traffic in the right hand side lane is 3 miles long and the inside lane is clear with your junction / cut off 2 miles ahead you certain can.

You don't live in the real world.

I disagree. Substitute 1 for 3 and 3/4 for 2 and it is an exact parallel with what happened to me on a d/c about 2 weeks ago. I was doing 70 in lane 1 with several cars behind me when we caught up with traffic in lane 2 which was travelling at around 55. I had to slow down by 15mph just in case some numpty who hadn't been paying attention decided to make a last minute dive for the same exit I was about to take. For that mile the road capacity was reduced by 50%. It's certainly not the first time I have experienced this situation and I have little doubt that similar instances occur all across the country on a regular basis.

It happens on 3 lane motorways as well. It's one of the contributing factors to the 'wave' effect which causes bunching, and sometimes traffic is brought to complete halt. Then everyone rushes off again and the same phenomenon is repeated further down the road.

Edited by Red Devil on Thursday 30th October 04:41

[Mave]

Red Devil said:

It happens on 3 lane motorways as well. It's one of the contributing factors to the 'wave' effect which causes bunching, and sometimes traffic is brought to complete halt. Then everyone rushes off again and the same phenomenon is repeated further down the road.

The main cause of the "wave" is tailgating where there's not enough space for minor speed and separation differences to be washed out, not travelling at a constant speed.

[jmorgan]

Mave said:

Red Devil said:

It happens on 3 lane motorways as well. It's one of the contributing factors to the 'wave' effect which causes bunching, and sometimes traffic is brought to complete halt. Then everyone rushes off again and the same phenomenon is repeated further down the road.

The main cause of the "wave" is tailgating where there's not enough space for minor speed and separation differences to be washed out, not travelling at a constant speed.

Interesting observing this in action. When there is a jam I head for the inside lane, the wagons seem to be able to move along at a constant speed without bunching this way, in the real world though not much time is saved, if at all, but it is less stop start.

[Red Devil]

Mave said:

Red Devil said:

It happens on 3 lane motorways as well. It's one of the contributing factors to the 'wave' effect which causes bunching, and sometimes traffic is brought to complete halt. Then everyone rushes off again and the same phenomenon is repeated further down the road.

The main cause of the "wave" is tailgating where there's not enough space for minor speed and separation differences to be washed out, not travelling at a constant speed.

Agreed. However, cramming the same number of vehicles into two lanes rather than three, as in my example, is one of the factors which leads to bunching/tailgating. Quarts in pint pots.

jmorgan said:

Interesting observing this in action. When there is a jam I head for the inside lane, the wagons seem to be able to move along at a constant speed without bunching this way, in the real world though not much time is saved, if at all, but it is less stop start.

Seconded. If you have the stomach for mixing it with the trucks it can sometimes be quicker. I can still remember one memorable journey many years ago. I was driving in convoy with a mate of mine from London to visit a mutual friend in West Yorkshire at the start of the Easter Bank Holiday weekend. My mate was in front but we got separated on the exit of the car park at Scratchwood services. By the time I reached the motorway he had vanished. The traffic was horrendous: so bad in fact that for over 150 miles (out of 175) I never left lane 1! I clocked my mate briefly up ahead in lane 3 between Hemel and Luton but he didn't see me as I trundled past because his view was blocked by a van in lane 2. After that I never saw him again. On reaching our destination he was gobsmacked to find I had arrived nearly 30 minutes before him.