A risky undertake on the A11. Any opinions?
Discussion
The camera driver was sat in a lane of traffic that was gradually passing those on the left.
He had actually left less than 2 seconds between him and the car in front.
A car on the left then pulled out in front of the camera car owing to a tractor being in front in L1, decreasing camera car's gap considerably.
Camera car was now in L2, with well under 2 seconds gap, rapidly catching up with a tractor in L1.
Why the shuddering f
k should he have pulled into the left?
This place amazes me sometimes...
He had actually left less than 2 seconds between him and the car in front.
A car on the left then pulled out in front of the camera car owing to a tractor being in front in L1, decreasing camera car's gap considerably.
Camera car was now in L2, with well under 2 seconds gap, rapidly catching up with a tractor in L1.
Why the shuddering f
k should he have pulled into the left?This place amazes me sometimes...
Looking again after reading the views of others, I feel I might have been unduly harsh in describing the camera owner as being asleep. He could have been in lane one earlier, but I suspect that the Focus's closing speed, even though camera car had slowed significantly by the time it appeared, was such that what seemed to be a distant car behind that would need consideration soon, was in fact in vicinity immediately after that assessment had been made. I cannot put hand on heart and say that I would have acted very differently based on the limited evidence we have: poor definition video, and too little lead-in footage prior to the event in question.
Blue Oval84 said:
The camera driver was sat in a lane of traffic that was gradually passing those on the left.
He had actually left less than 2 seconds between him and the car in front.
A car on the left then pulled out in front of the camera car owing to a tractor being in front in L1, decreasing camera car's gap considerably.
Camera car was now in L2, with well under 2 seconds gap, rapidly catching up with a tractor in L1.
Why the shuddering fk should he have pulled into the left?
This place amazes me sometimes...
He was in lane 2 for over 20 seconds without passing anything. That's pushing it a bit.He had actually left less than 2 seconds between him and the car in front.
A car on the left then pulled out in front of the camera car owing to a tractor being in front in L1, decreasing camera car's gap considerably.
Camera car was now in L2, with well under 2 seconds gap, rapidly catching up with a tractor in L1.
Why the shuddering f
k should he have pulled into the left?This place amazes me sometimes...
Not that this excuses the Focus driver in any way.
Dr Jekyll said:
He was in lane 2 for over 20 seconds without passing anything. That's pushing it a bit.
Not that this excuses the Focus driver in any way.
But the point I'm making is that Lane 2 was (very gradually) passing Lane 1. He was simply leaving a safe gap (and it was still less than 2 seconds).Not that this excuses the Focus driver in any way.
Just before he reached the tractor, one of the cars that he was going to overtake pulled out into L2 (because of the tractor).
If I'd been driving that car I would have stayed in Lane 2 as well, and quite correctly too.
Blue Oval84 said:
Dr Jekyll said:
He was in lane 2 for over 20 seconds without passing anything. That's pushing it a bit.
Not that this excuses the Focus driver in any way.
But the point I'm making is that Lane 2 was (very gradually) passing Lane 1. He was simply leaving a safe gap (and it was still less than 2 seconds).Not that this excuses the Focus driver in any way.
Just before he reached the tractor, one of the cars that he was going to overtake pulled out into L2 (because of the tractor).
If I'd been driving that car I would have stayed in Lane 2 as well, and quite correctly too.
The assumption seems to be that the camera car was the last in line. Only a computer numpties would move into L1 approaching a slow moving tractor and a garage with a slip leading onto the carriageway.
It amazes me that some people on here try and in some way excuse what is an abysmal piece of driving and then sign off with "Crap driving by the Focus though"
The camera car is in a line of traffic passing slower traffic in L1 and I'm guessing by the fact that he hasn't jumped over has a line of cars behind him as well who are doing the same as him. He saw the tractor and adjusted his speed twice, once to accommodate the 4x4 that pulled in front of him and once to allow the car that was behind the tractor out.
And then the numptie in the Focus does the dirty.
See this a lot on the A14. Traffic runs past a drank or tractor and gets in L2 in plenty of time to pass and Mr impatient tanks it down L1 and the creates a shock wave as he cuts in.
Totally unnecessary and poor driving. No excuses just an example of the reason why dash cams exist.
It amazes me that some people on here try and in some way excuse what is an abysmal piece of driving and then sign off with "Crap driving by the Focus though"
The camera car is in a line of traffic passing slower traffic in L1 and I'm guessing by the fact that he hasn't jumped over has a line of cars behind him as well who are doing the same as him. He saw the tractor and adjusted his speed twice, once to accommodate the 4x4 that pulled in front of him and once to allow the car that was behind the tractor out.
And then the numptie in the Focus does the dirty.
See this a lot on the A14. Traffic runs past a drank or tractor and gets in L2 in plenty of time to pass and Mr impatient tanks it down L1 and the creates a shock wave as he cuts in.
Totally unnecessary and poor driving. No excuses just an example of the reason why dash cams exist.
heebeegeetee said:
mybrainhurts said:
If he'd been in lane 1 long ago, the situation wouldn't have arisen.
We don't know that.heebeegeetee said:
One problem in the uk imo is the propensity of many to baulk others in. As we know, there is a slow moving tractor ahead and a services where no doubt people pull out regardless. The camera car has preserved his speed largely and helped avoid what could have been a big shunt. I have no problem with his driving at all.
Well, I do. There was no need to be in lane 2 for so long. See this every day.Again and again on here I hear people claiming if someone wants to go fast than them they pull over and let them past, or stating that's what other people should do if they're being tailgated.
If we assume the Focus was in a hurry - which seems reasonable given the driving we do see - why didn't carcam man move over at the start of the video? Notwithstanding the tractor and garage up the road, there was plenty of time.
If we assume the Focus was in a hurry - which seems reasonable given the driving we do see - why didn't carcam man move over at the start of the video? Notwithstanding the tractor and garage up the road, there was plenty of time.
9mm said:
Again and again on here I hear people claiming if someone wants to go fast than them they pull over and let them past, or stating that's what other people should do if they're being tailgated.
If we assume the Focus was in a hurry - which seems reasonable given the driving we do see - why didn't carcam man move over at the start of the video? Notwithstanding the tractor and garage up the road, there was plenty of time.
How do you the Focus came up behind the camcar If we assume the Focus was in a hurry - which seems reasonable given the driving we do see - why didn't carcam man move over at the start of the video? Notwithstanding the tractor and garage up the road, there was plenty of time.
9mm said:
Again and again on here I hear people claiming if someone wants to go fast than them they pull over and let them past, or stating that's what other people should do if they're being tailgated.
If we assume the Focus was in a hurry - which seems reasonable given the driving we do see - why didn't carcam man move over at the start of the video? Notwithstanding the tractor and garage up the road, there was plenty of time.
Because carcam man is, in other circumstances, a natural born middle lane cruiser, aka tosser.If we assume the Focus was in a hurry - which seems reasonable given the driving we do see - why didn't carcam man move over at the start of the video? Notwithstanding the tractor and garage up the road, there was plenty of time.
whyohwhy said:
9mm said:
Again and again on here I hear people claiming if someone wants to go fast than them they pull over and let them past, or stating that's what other people should do if they're being tailgated.
If we assume the Focus was in a hurry - which seems reasonable given the driving we do see - why didn't carcam man move over at the start of the video? Notwithstanding the tractor and garage up the road, there was plenty of time.
How do you the Focus came up behind the camcar If we assume the Focus was in a hurry - which seems reasonable given the driving we do see - why didn't carcam man move over at the start of the video? Notwithstanding the tractor and garage up the road, there was plenty of time.
What we do know is that there was definitely time to pull over and let a faster vehicle past at the start of the video.
9mm said:
whyohwhy said:
9mm said:
Again and again on here I hear people claiming if someone wants to go fast than them they pull over and let them past, or stating that's what other people should do if they're being tailgated.
If we assume the Focus was in a hurry - which seems reasonable given the driving we do see - why didn't carcam man move over at the start of the video? Notwithstanding the tractor and garage up the road, there was plenty of time.
How do you the Focus came up behind the camcar If we assume the Focus was in a hurry - which seems reasonable given the driving we do see - why didn't carcam man move over at the start of the video? Notwithstanding the tractor and garage up the road, there was plenty of time.
What we do know is that there was definitely time to pull over and let a faster vehicle past at the start of the video.
9mm said:
I don't, any more than you know what he did. That's why I said let's assume.
What we do know is that there was definitely time to pull over and let a faster vehicle past at the start of the video.
Not if there were cars behind the camcar and the Focus was bowling up the inside What we do know is that there was definitely time to pull over and let a faster vehicle past at the start of the video.
If the camcar had moved over he would have moved into the way of the speeding Focus
Watch the way the camcar drives He is paying attention to what's going on ahead which would indicate he is comfortable that he isn't holding anyone up.
He's not dawdling but slows to allow space or cars to pull out.
Not the actions of a middle lane half asleep sitter.
whyohwhy said:
9mm said:
I don't, any more than you know what he did. That's why I said let's assume.
What we do know is that there was definitely time to pull over and let a faster vehicle past at the start of the video.
Not if there were cars behind the camcar and the Focus was bowling up the inside What we do know is that there was definitely time to pull over and let a faster vehicle past at the start of the video.
If the camcar had moved over he would have moved into the way of the speeding Focus
Watch the way the camcar drives He is paying attention to what's going on ahead which would indicate he is comfortable that he isn't holding anyone up.
He's not dawdling but slows to allow space or cars to pull out.
Not the actions of a middle lane half asleep sitter.
Therefore he did not know what was going on behind him.
Middle lane cruiser.
I'll happily admit that I drive like bit of a knobber sometimes, I'll push people out of the way if they're lane hogging for too long or just undertake them to make a point, it's how most people drive around here (East London/A13/M25)
There's no defence for the driving of that Focus, it's the driving style of an teenage chav who thinks that they're indestructible. Too close, too forceful and little to no planning. In a word, dangerous.
There's no defence for the driving of that Focus, it's the driving style of an teenage chav who thinks that they're indestructible. Too close, too forceful and little to no planning. In a word, dangerous.
He might have meant he was surprised seeing a car suddenly appear on his left. I would be.
The stretch of road he's just come off is a fast sweeping downhill left-hand bend; I would put money on the Focus driver giving it the beans at the start of the descent at the top of the hill, at that point out of sight of the camcar. There is also a slip road onto the A11 not too far back, so camcar driver could have been on empty road with nothing behind him or beside him for a while. He passes the slip road; he still hasn't seen another car, and carries on down the hill. Meanwhile, the Focus joins from the slip road, drives enthusiastically and quickly catches up.
As well as the slip road off the services, the Focus overtakes pretty much right where the slip road into the services ends. He might have been attempting to enter, realised he was going too fast and darts back onto the carriageway.
The Focus driver is une coq for placing himself in that position in the first place. He doesn't attempt to brake and barely waits until the other car has moved over before pressing on. The camera driver only slows down when he is gaining on what's in front of him.
The stretch of road he's just come off is a fast sweeping downhill left-hand bend; I would put money on the Focus driver giving it the beans at the start of the descent at the top of the hill, at that point out of sight of the camcar. There is also a slip road onto the A11 not too far back, so camcar driver could have been on empty road with nothing behind him or beside him for a while. He passes the slip road; he still hasn't seen another car, and carries on down the hill. Meanwhile, the Focus joins from the slip road, drives enthusiastically and quickly catches up.
As well as the slip road off the services, the Focus overtakes pretty much right where the slip road into the services ends. He might have been attempting to enter, realised he was going too fast and darts back onto the carriageway.
The Focus driver is une coq for placing himself in that position in the first place. He doesn't attempt to brake and barely waits until the other car has moved over before pressing on. The camera driver only slows down when he is gaining on what's in front of him.
Edited by Phil303 on Monday 27th October 21:27
Blue Oval84 said:
The camera driver was sat in a lane of traffic that was gradually passing those on the left.
He had actually left less than 2 seconds between him and the car in front.
A car on the left then pulled out in front of the camera car owing to a tractor being in front in L1, decreasing camera car's gap considerably.
Camera car was now in L2, with well under 2 seconds gap, rapidly catching up with a tractor in L1.
Why the shuddering fk should he have pulled into the left?
This place amazes me sometimes...
100% this.He had actually left less than 2 seconds between him and the car in front.
A car on the left then pulled out in front of the camera car owing to a tractor being in front in L1, decreasing camera car's gap considerably.
Camera car was now in L2, with well under 2 seconds gap, rapidly catching up with a tractor in L1.
Why the shuddering f
k should he have pulled into the left?This place amazes me sometimes...
The camera car was keeping up with the traffic in the outside lane leaving a safe distance to the car in front. Just because he's not tailgating the car in front doesn't mean he's lane hogging.
Without a rear facing camera we don't have a complete picture of the lead up to the event. However whether the camera car was 'lane hogging' is utterly irrelevant. On the basis of what we can see, it is very clear that the Focus driver performed an extremely hazardous manoeuvre. He was very lucky not to have either run into the back of the tractor or sideswiped the camera car. A pity no charge could be brought.
If he/she carries on like that, the probability of becoming a statistic is quite likely. When it happens, hopefully nobody else will be seriously hurt.
Is that some Norfolk dialect term?
If he/she carries on like that, the probability of becoming a statistic is quite likely. When it happens, hopefully nobody else will be seriously hurt.
whyohwhy said:
See this a lot on the A14. Traffic runs past a drank or tractor and gets in L2 in plenty of time to pass and Mr impatient tanks it down L1 and the creates a shock wave as he cuts in.
Is that some Norfolk dialect term? Pit Pony said:
Dash cam man, was in "the fast lane" too fking long. That don't excuse the very late undertake of the focus, but fk me, I bet focus man must have been pissed off for miles before that.
Utter dribble. king long. That don't excuse the very late undertake of the focus, but fk me, I bet focus man must have been pissed off for miles before that. From the start of the video it's approx just 8 seconds before he starts to gain on the car in the left lane and would be in a position to carry on at his current speed and overtake or hang back and let the driver pull out. Why not write to the EDP with the times you'd allow for all road manoeuvres, and maybe a graph showing the penalties you'd apply for every extra second that someone exceeds your suggested limits by?
As he's spotted the tractor and knows that other drivers will be wanting to pull out PLUS is probably aware of potential traffic entering from the services slip, he slows slightly and lets everyone pass the tractor. Absolutely the right thing to do.
IF the Focus driver was on this guy's tail 'for miles' then his reaction time is glacial. He waited until he was in a really, really stupid place to undertake. There would have been ample chances to get past (on the inside if he felt that strongly about it) prior to choosing a spot level with a services slip road exit and a slow moving tractor. Fact is Focus driver is a speeding, impatient fool.
When I drive down this stretch I'm usually doing my best to try and get somewhere near the NSL and if there is nothing that I will hold up behind me, I will often move into the outside lane pretty much where the chap on the video is as there is nearly always something coming off the services exit. I'm not hogging the road, I'm pre-empting the road ahead. Rather drive in the outside lane for a few seconds than pull blindly across at the last minute, or brake heavily in the inside lane.
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