Someone hit our car in a car park, but...
Discussion
At the end of October, someone collided with our vehicle in a public car park. They failed to stop, however two witnesses saw it happen and reported it to us together with the alleged vehicle registration number.
We reported it straight away to the police.
They got in contact with the alleged party.
Yesterday, we received a letter from the police stating that the alleged have admitted that they were in the car park at the time, but say that they were unaware of any collision with our vehicle.
It then goes on to say: "Parking bays in car parks are not deemed to be a road or public place for the purposes of the Road Traffic Act, although thoroughfare parts of the car park are. As this collision took place within the parking bays, the alleged party has not committed any offences under that act. Therefore your insurance company will investigate in a civil capacity and claim the repairs to your vehicle from the alleged party's insurance company".
Is this correct? Our car was in a parking bay, but theirs wasn't, as they were leaving.
Didn't really want to go through the insurance company to get it repaired (I'm guessing it's caused around £500-£700 worth of damage to a £3k car). However, it seems we have no option.
What worries me, is the fact that they are denying any involvement and we've only got one/two independent witnesses at this moment in time.
The car park is watched over by CCTV, but we are unable to get any footage, as we aren't the police or an insurance company. Oh, and we've only got 5 days left to obtain it, until it gets deleted.
What should we do?
We reported it straight away to the police.
They got in contact with the alleged party.
Yesterday, we received a letter from the police stating that the alleged have admitted that they were in the car park at the time, but say that they were unaware of any collision with our vehicle.
It then goes on to say: "Parking bays in car parks are not deemed to be a road or public place for the purposes of the Road Traffic Act, although thoroughfare parts of the car park are. As this collision took place within the parking bays, the alleged party has not committed any offences under that act. Therefore your insurance company will investigate in a civil capacity and claim the repairs to your vehicle from the alleged party's insurance company".
Is this correct? Our car was in a parking bay, but theirs wasn't, as they were leaving.
Didn't really want to go through the insurance company to get it repaired (I'm guessing it's caused around £500-£700 worth of damage to a £3k car). However, it seems we have no option.
What worries me, is the fact that they are denying any involvement and we've only got one/two independent witnesses at this moment in time.
The car park is watched over by CCTV, but we are unable to get any footage, as we aren't the police or an insurance company. Oh, and we've only got 5 days left to obtain it, until it gets deleted.
What should we do?
Woody3 said:
At the end of October, someone collided with our vehicle in a public car park. They failed to stop, however two witnesses saw it happen and reported it to us together with the alleged vehicle registration number.
We reported it straight away to the police.
They got in contact with the alleged party.
Yesterday, we received a letter from the police stating that the alleged have admitted that they were in the car park at the time, but say that they were unaware of any collision with our vehicle.
It then goes on to say: "Parking bays in car parks are not deemed to be a road or public place for the purposes of the Road Traffic Act, although thoroughfare parts of the car park are. As this collision took place within the parking bays, the alleged party has not committed any offences under that act. Therefore your insurance company will investigate in a civil capacity and claim the repairs to your vehicle from the alleged party's insurance company".
Is this correct? Our car was in a parking bay, but theirs wasn't, as they were leaving.
Didn't really want to go through the insurance company to get it repaired (I'm guessing it's caused around £500-£700 worth of damage to a £3k car). However, it seems we have no option.
What worries me, is the fact that they are denying any involvement and we've only got one/two independent witnesses at this moment in time.
The car park is watched over by CCTV, but we are unable to get any footage, as we aren't the police or an insurance company. Oh, and we've only got 5 days left to obtain it, until it gets deleted.
What should we do?
That Police thing sounds nonsense. I bet they wouldn't wait a nanosecond if you were caught handbraking in the parking bays of Maccy D's rather than the thoroughfare. You'd be section 59'd all day long.We reported it straight away to the police.
They got in contact with the alleged party.
Yesterday, we received a letter from the police stating that the alleged have admitted that they were in the car park at the time, but say that they were unaware of any collision with our vehicle.
It then goes on to say: "Parking bays in car parks are not deemed to be a road or public place for the purposes of the Road Traffic Act, although thoroughfare parts of the car park are. As this collision took place within the parking bays, the alleged party has not committed any offences under that act. Therefore your insurance company will investigate in a civil capacity and claim the repairs to your vehicle from the alleged party's insurance company".
Is this correct? Our car was in a parking bay, but theirs wasn't, as they were leaving.
Didn't really want to go through the insurance company to get it repaired (I'm guessing it's caused around £500-£700 worth of damage to a £3k car). However, it seems we have no option.
What worries me, is the fact that they are denying any involvement and we've only got one/two independent witnesses at this moment in time.
The car park is watched over by CCTV, but we are unable to get any footage, as we aren't the police or an insurance company. Oh, and we've only got 5 days left to obtain it, until it gets deleted.
What should we do?
andygo said:
That Police thing sounds nonsense. I bet they wouldn't wait a nanosecond if you were caught handbraking in the parking bays of Maccy D's rather than the thoroughfare. You'd be section 59'd all day long.
Yes because handbraking in a car park is not parked and you would be out of the parking bays therefor the road traffic act would apply.It's similar in that you cannot have an untaxed car on the road as the RTA applies but you can in a private numbered parking bay.
t. Go through insurance. With two witnesses, even if the insurance company don't manage to get CCTV footage of the incident, then it will certainly go down as a no fault incident and the third party's insurance company will pick up the costs. Although your insurance company may load your next premiums as you are now considered a 'higher risk' (a scam if ever there was one) the additional premiums, even over a couple of years, are unlikely to come anywhere near the repair costs. This option involves minimum hassle.
Other options are dependent on having the third party's details (which, hopefully the police will pass on) and involve increasing amounts of hassle.
The next option is to make a claim directly against the third party's insurance company stating you have witnesses to the incident. With two witness statements they will likely settle quickly. This option involves a modicum of hassle.
The next option, which involves maximum hassle, is to obtain the witnesses' written statements and get the police to state in writing that the third party admitted being in the car park at the time. Then get quotes for the repair and send them to the third party asking for payment. If no joy then get the car repaired (you have to keep costs reasonable so no hiring a Bugatti Veyron as a hire car whilst yours is being repaired) and then send them the bill asking for settlement within a reasonable time or you will proceed with legal action to recover the costs. If still no joy (although at this point in time any sensible individual would send the correspondence to their insurance company to deal with who will almost certainly settle) the small claims court is your friend. With good witness statements and an admission already made to the police that the third party was in the car park at the time you have a very high probability of success. This success, however, only requires the defendent to pay up - actually getting the money out of them can be a whole lot more hassle if the defendent is not worried about CCJs and the like.
Other options are dependent on having the third party's details (which, hopefully the police will pass on) and involve increasing amounts of hassle.
The next option is to make a claim directly against the third party's insurance company stating you have witnesses to the incident. With two witness statements they will likely settle quickly. This option involves a modicum of hassle.
The next option, which involves maximum hassle, is to obtain the witnesses' written statements and get the police to state in writing that the third party admitted being in the car park at the time. Then get quotes for the repair and send them to the third party asking for payment. If no joy then get the car repaired (you have to keep costs reasonable so no hiring a Bugatti Veyron as a hire car whilst yours is being repaired) and then send them the bill asking for settlement within a reasonable time or you will proceed with legal action to recover the costs. If still no joy (although at this point in time any sensible individual would send the correspondence to their insurance company to deal with who will almost certainly settle) the small claims court is your friend. With good witness statements and an admission already made to the police that the third party was in the car park at the time you have a very high probability of success. This success, however, only requires the defendent to pay up - actually getting the money out of them can be a whole lot more hassle if the defendent is not worried about CCJs and the like.
Woody3 said:
At the end of October, someone collided with our vehicle in a public car park. They failed to stop, however two witnesses saw it happen and reported it to us together with the alleged vehicle registration number.
We reported it straight away to the police.
They got in contact with the alleged party.
Yesterday, we received a letter from the police stating that the alleged have admitted that they were in the car park at the time, but say that they were unaware of any collision with our vehicle.
It then goes on to say: "Parking bays in car parks are not deemed to be a road or public place for the purposes of the Road Traffic Act, although thoroughfare parts of the car park are. As this collision took place within the parking bays, the alleged party has not committed any offences under that act. Therefore your insurance company will investigate in a civil capacity and claim the repairs to your vehicle from the alleged party's insurance company".
Is this correct? Our car was in a parking bay, but theirs wasn't, as they were leaving.
Didn't really want to go through the insurance company to get it repaired (I'm guessing it's caused around £500-£700 worth of damage to a £3k car). However, it seems we have no option.
What worries me, is the fact that they are denying any involvement and we've only got one/two independent witnesses at this moment in time.
The car park is watched over by CCTV, but we are unable to get any footage, as we aren't the police or an insurance company. Oh, and we've only got 5 days left to obtain it, until it gets deleted.
What should we do?
Get shifting and obtain the CCTV asap no point in waiting, if there's only 5 days left and you report to your insurer tonight it'll take them a few days just to get the claim assessed and you could very well lose that footage.We reported it straight away to the police.
They got in contact with the alleged party.
Yesterday, we received a letter from the police stating that the alleged have admitted that they were in the car park at the time, but say that they were unaware of any collision with our vehicle.
It then goes on to say: "Parking bays in car parks are not deemed to be a road or public place for the purposes of the Road Traffic Act, although thoroughfare parts of the car park are. As this collision took place within the parking bays, the alleged party has not committed any offences under that act. Therefore your insurance company will investigate in a civil capacity and claim the repairs to your vehicle from the alleged party's insurance company".
Is this correct? Our car was in a parking bay, but theirs wasn't, as they were leaving.
Didn't really want to go through the insurance company to get it repaired (I'm guessing it's caused around £500-£700 worth of damage to a £3k car). However, it seems we have no option.
What worries me, is the fact that they are denying any involvement and we've only got one/two independent witnesses at this moment in time.
The car park is watched over by CCTV, but we are unable to get any footage, as we aren't the police or an insurance company. Oh, and we've only got 5 days left to obtain it, until it gets deleted.
What should we do?
Woody3 said:
At the end of October, someone collided with our vehicle in a public car park. They failed to stop, however two witnesses saw it happen and reported it to us together with the alleged vehicle registration number.
We reported it straight away to the police.
They got in contact with the alleged party.
Yesterday, we received a letter from the police stating that the alleged have admitted that they were in the car park at the time, but say that they were unaware of any collision with our vehicle.
It then goes on to say: "Parking bays in car parks are not deemed to be a road or public place for the purposes of the Road Traffic Act, although thoroughfare parts of the car park are. As this collision took place within the parking bays, the alleged party has not committed any offences under that act. Therefore your insurance company will investigate in a civil capacity and claim the repairs to your vehicle from the alleged party's insurance company".
Is this correct? Our car was in a parking bay, but theirs wasn't, as they were leaving.
Didn't really want to go through the insurance company to get it repaired (I'm guessing it's caused around £500-£700 worth of damage to a £3k car). However, it seems we have no option.
What worries me, is the fact that they are denying any involvement and we've only got one/two independent witnesses at this moment in time.
The car park is watched over by CCTV, but we are unable to get any footage, as we aren't the police or an insurance company. Oh, and we've only got 5 days left to obtain it, until it gets deleted.
What should we do?
The author of the letter is largely incorrect. We reported it straight away to the police.
They got in contact with the alleged party.
Yesterday, we received a letter from the police stating that the alleged have admitted that they were in the car park at the time, but say that they were unaware of any collision with our vehicle.
It then goes on to say: "Parking bays in car parks are not deemed to be a road or public place for the purposes of the Road Traffic Act, although thoroughfare parts of the car park are. As this collision took place within the parking bays, the alleged party has not committed any offences under that act. Therefore your insurance company will investigate in a civil capacity and claim the repairs to your vehicle from the alleged party's insurance company".
Is this correct? Our car was in a parking bay, but theirs wasn't, as they were leaving.
Didn't really want to go through the insurance company to get it repaired (I'm guessing it's caused around £500-£700 worth of damage to a £3k car). However, it seems we have no option.
What worries me, is the fact that they are denying any involvement and we've only got one/two independent witnesses at this moment in time.
The car park is watched over by CCTV, but we are unable to get any footage, as we aren't the police or an insurance company. Oh, and we've only got 5 days left to obtain it, until it gets deleted.
What should we do?
A car park is not, except for exceptional cases, "a road" - see Clarke, Kato (1998)
A public car park is generally an - "other public place".
You're right to point out that the other driver wasn't in a parking bay. He appears to say that you were in a parking bay so the RTA doesn't apply to the other driver (who wasn't). Frankly, that's ludicrous.
Sections 3 (careless driving) and 170 RTA 1988 (fail to stop/report) are committed "on a road or other public place."
The author appears to have read the Court of Appeal decision in Clarke/Kato but not the House of Lords decision. He should also read May v DPP (2005).
I had a similar event. I parked up in what I thought was a safer area of a car park. I returned about 20 minutes later and was about to drive off when a lady stopped me and told me that my car had been hit.
She pointed out some damage to the back corner of my car. She gave me the number of the van and caravan combo(!) and also her details as she was willing to be a witness.
Eventually,6 months later I got a reply from the police. No such number plate.
Damn it.
Ed Balls meanwhile in a similar situation (a driveway) damaged a parked car and drove off without reporting it. He got fined £1075 and 5 points. That was after it was reported to the police.
She pointed out some damage to the back corner of my car. She gave me the number of the van and caravan combo(!) and also her details as she was willing to be a witness.
Eventually,6 months later I got a reply from the police. No such number plate.
Damn it.
Ed Balls meanwhile in a similar situation (a driveway) damaged a parked car and drove off without reporting it. He got fined £1075 and 5 points. That was after it was reported to the police.
agtlaw said:
Woody3 said:
At the end of October, someone collided with our vehicle in a public car park. They failed to stop, however two witnesses saw it happen and reported it to us together with the alleged vehicle registration number.
We reported it straight away to the police.
They got in contact with the alleged party.
Yesterday, we received a letter from the police stating that the alleged have admitted that they were in the car park at the time, but say that they were unaware of any collision with our vehicle.
It then goes on to say: "Parking bays in car parks are not deemed to be a road or public place for the purposes of the Road Traffic Act, although thoroughfare parts of the car park are. As this collision took place within the parking bays, the alleged party has not committed any offences under that act. Therefore your insurance company will investigate in a civil capacity and claim the repairs to your vehicle from the alleged party's insurance company".
Is this correct? Our car was in a parking bay, but theirs wasn't, as they were leaving.
Didn't really want to go through the insurance company to get it repaired (I'm guessing it's caused around £500-£700 worth of damage to a £3k car). However, it seems we have no option.
What worries me, is the fact that they are denying any involvement and we've only got one/two independent witnesses at this moment in time.
The car park is watched over by CCTV, but we are unable to get any footage, as we aren't the police or an insurance company. Oh, and we've only got 5 days left to obtain it, until it gets deleted.
What should we do?
The author of the letter is largely incorrect. We reported it straight away to the police.
They got in contact with the alleged party.
Yesterday, we received a letter from the police stating that the alleged have admitted that they were in the car park at the time, but say that they were unaware of any collision with our vehicle.
It then goes on to say: "Parking bays in car parks are not deemed to be a road or public place for the purposes of the Road Traffic Act, although thoroughfare parts of the car park are. As this collision took place within the parking bays, the alleged party has not committed any offences under that act. Therefore your insurance company will investigate in a civil capacity and claim the repairs to your vehicle from the alleged party's insurance company".
Is this correct? Our car was in a parking bay, but theirs wasn't, as they were leaving.
Didn't really want to go through the insurance company to get it repaired (I'm guessing it's caused around £500-£700 worth of damage to a £3k car). However, it seems we have no option.
What worries me, is the fact that they are denying any involvement and we've only got one/two independent witnesses at this moment in time.
The car park is watched over by CCTV, but we are unable to get any footage, as we aren't the police or an insurance company. Oh, and we've only got 5 days left to obtain it, until it gets deleted.
What should we do?
A car park is not, except for exceptional cases, "a road" - see Clarke, Kato (1998)
A public car park is generally an - "other public place".
You're right to point out that the other driver wasn't in a parking bay. He appears to say that you were in a parking bay so the RTA doesn't apply to the other driver (who wasn't). Frankly, that's ludicrous.
Sections 3 (careless driving) and 170 RTA 1988 (fail to stop/report) are committed "on a road or other public place."
The author appears to have read the Court of Appeal decision in Clarke/Kato but not the House of Lords decision. He should also read May v DPP (2005).
. I'd suggest to the OP a complaint to the local chief of police about a renegade occifer writing legal nonsense.
My wife`s car was damaged in a similar situation - didn`t even realise until a PC was on the doorstep having been alerted to the event by 2 witnesses. Some of the paperwork was a bit of a pain but damage was repaired perfectly & we even had a hire car - this meant I didn`t have to pay up front as it was in the hands of `accident management`.
None of this would have been necessary if the woman driver responsible had forked out maybe £80 to have a scuff repaired. Initial denial & then threat of prosecution with evidence was enough. We sincerely hope her premium has increased a lot.
Hope it goes well.
I used to park in the most remote bays to try & avoid this sort of event, now try & get next to a curb to cut chances by 50% & park even further away. I`m thinking of surrounding the car with pillows next!
None of this would have been necessary if the woman driver responsible had forked out maybe £80 to have a scuff repaired. Initial denial & then threat of prosecution with evidence was enough. We sincerely hope her premium has increased a lot.
Hope it goes well.
I used to park in the most remote bays to try & avoid this sort of event, now try & get next to a curb to cut chances by 50% & park even further away. I`m thinking of surrounding the car with pillows next!
Once went to a show where you had to leave your car parked up in a field - when we came back there was a Land Rover (Freelander from memory) parked in the next row which had impact absorbing foam mounted on magnetic pads strategically mounted all down both sides of the car! That made my day 
Adrian E said:
Once went to a show where you had to leave your car parked up in a field - when we came back there was a Land Rover (Freelander from memory) parked in the next row which had impact absorbing foam mounted on magnetic pads strategically mounted all down both sides of the car! That made my day
Genius. There's a pistonheads shop idea right there.mehball said:
andygo said:
That Police thing sounds nonsense. I bet they wouldn't wait a nanosecond if you were caught handbraking in the parking bays of Maccy D's rather than the thoroughfare. You'd be section 59'd all day long.
Yes because handbraking in a car park is not parked and you would be out of the parking bays therefor the road traffic act would apply.It's similar in that you cannot have an untaxed car on the road as the RTA applies but you can in a private numbered parking bay.
Its ok to use a mobile phone whilst driving forward the back 10 inches as long as you are in the lines of a bay.
What about drunk people sleeping in cars with the keys in the barrel. - ok in a bay?
Woody3 said:
"Parking bays in car parks are not deemed to be a road or public place for the purposes of the Road Traffic Act, although thoroughfare parts of the car park are. As this collision took place within the parking bays, the alleged party has not committed any offences under that act.
Interesting...So if they'd gone one better and ram-raided the front door of ASDA they could have driven away without reporting it too?
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