3 points and 100 fine for tyre on 1.5.7
Discussion
Greendubber said:
But you can ignore the advice of a car dealership can't you?
Yes, but they refused to issue the MOT saying all tyres <1.6mm so it was either spunk £800 on new tyres or challenge them. Whilst not exactly the same scenario you could go to & MOT test centre and get a report on the tyre and use this to challenge the fine for the bald tyre in court? shep1001 said:
Yes, but they refused to issue the MOT saying all tyres <1.6mm so it was either spunk £800 on new tyres or challenge them. Whilst not exactly the same scenario you could go to & MOT test centre and get a report on the tyre and use this to challenge the fine for the bald tyre in court?
Did you complain to VOSA?shep1001 said:
You make a good point but surely plod would have to do the same i.e. make/size & DOT number on the ticket or they would have no evidence to offer either to challange the charge?
I'm fairly sure they've sorted out the procedure for proving a tyre is illegal and will record everything they need to to satisfy a magistrate/court.ModernAndy said:
I'm fairly sure they've sorted out the procedure for proving a tyre is illegal and will record everything they need to to satisfy a magistrate/court.
We always used to copy all of the tyre wall markings into the process book together with sketch of the tread pattern plus defective areas having rolled the car forwards by a few feet to check whether the tread was dud for the full circumferenceGreendubber said:
Make it impossible to do any kind of proactive policing work, crime falls as a result, close yet more stations so crime falls even more, cut numbers based on above and back home for high fives and medals for all the money that's been saved. Whilst all along destroying any sort of service that was once offered.
Then offer contracts to mates such as G4S, brilliant.
All for not being able to pull a car without good reason other than 'because I can'Then offer contracts to mates such as G4S, brilliant.
How will this drop crime figures and shut stations?
Bigends said:
We always used to copy all of the tyre wall markings into the process book together with sketch of the tread pattern plus defective areas having rolled the car forwards by a few feet to check whether the tread was dud for the full circumference
Photograph these days including dot code.mygoldfishbowl said:
Paul Dishman said:
WinstonWolf said:
I'd say your biggest problem was failing the attitude test. The correct answer is "Yes Sir, no Sir, three bags full" etc.
Absolutely, the OP has talked himself into a ticket
ks. Treat the officer with respect, yes, but don't get down on your hands knees crying like a little liberal. Have some dignity people. shep1001 said:
Yes to a point. I had BMW try and bend me over on an MOT for 4 new tyres. After a bit of verbal with the service manager we went in the workshop and re-measured all 4 tyres and could not find a single point under 2mm.......... still waiting for an official response from them as to what happened.
VW dealer told me my tyres had to be changed as they were "below the EU limit". Just fkoff.I wouldn't mind but they're all easily 4mm, never mind 3.
Bigends said:
All for not being able to pull a car without good reason other than 'because I can'
How will this drop crime figures and shut stations?
Once again...do you REALLY need to ask this?How will this drop crime figures and shut stations?
Drug dealers and thugs don't go around with signs on their cars informing the police they have prohibited articles on board. In your time as a serving officer, did you never pull someone over for a "routine check" and its led to something bigger? If you aren't stopping cars and finding the drugs, knives etc, then the crime won't be recorded and figures will fall.
Mk3Spitfire said:
Bigends said:
All for not being able to pull a car without good reason other than 'because I can'
How will this drop crime figures and shut stations?
Once again...do you REALLY need to ask this?How will this drop crime figures and shut stations?
Drug dealers and thugs don't go around with signs on their cars informing the police they have prohibited articles on board. In your time as a serving officer, did you never pull someone over for a "routine check" and its led to something bigger? If you aren't stopping cars and finding the drugs, knives etc, then the crime won't be recorded and figures will fall.
If youre searching for weapons/drugs - presumably that would be your reason for the stop in the first place
I carried out more stop searches using more bull^^it excuses than you can possibly imagine and had some good results. Doesnt make it right though does it? Home office have clearly had complaints over misuse of the stop power = only pointing it out. No such thing as a 'routine' check - there should always be a reason for the stop
Anyway - how will restricting this power shut stations and drop crime. I see a handful of crimes a day resulting from stops-hardly going to impact much on the figures which most forces are grossly underecording at the moment already
Not my words
 There is evidence that traffic stops are being misapplied and abused, with individuals
being subjected to Section163 stops for matters wholly unrelated to road traffic
purposes.
 There is concern that Section163 stops are being utilised to circumvent the
requirements and safeguards applicable to alternative powers of stop and search
such as the right not to give your name and address, and to enable officers to compel
engagement with an individual, with a view to provoking behaviours sufficient to
provide the requisite basis for the subsequent exercise of stop and search powers.
 Section 163 stops are not recorded and are therefore absent of accountability. There
are no checks and balances to ensure that the power is being used lawfully and
appropriately.
The reviews all here - use the powers properly or lose them
http://www.stop-watch.org/uploads/documents/StopWa...
Edited by Bigends on Tuesday 9th December 17:29
Edited by Bigends on Tuesday 9th December 17:36
Edited by Bigends on Tuesday 9th December 18:12
Bigends said:
All for not being able to pull a car without good reason other than 'because I can'
How will this drop crime figures and shut stations?
Where did I say that?How will this drop crime figures and shut stations?
'Because I can'
I replied to YOU stating they were looking at traffic stops. So brilliant, you won't be able to stop a car to check documentation which in turn will result in less proactive work leading to less arrests for things like drugs or picking up people who come back WM as a result of a body and DL check.
You remember the stuff you stumble upon off the back of a stop? It can't be that long ago.
Edited by Greendubber on Tuesday 9th December 18:28
Sheepshanks said:
VW dealer told me my tyres had to be changed as they were "below the EU limit". Just fkoff.
I wouldn't mind but they're all easily 4mm, never mind 3.
BMW dealer my bro went to chop his car in for another new car was refused the part-ex as there was less than 3mm tread on the back tyres. He laughed told them what he thought and left. Went and spent his 80k on two new cars at another BMW dealer then posted a copy of the invoices on the offending dealers social media pages explaining what they had just missed out on and why!koff.I wouldn't mind but they're all easily 4mm, never mind 3.
Bigends said:
HMIC found that a third of all stop searches last year were unlawful.
This figure included incorrectly filled out forms, which were suddenly became 'unlawful' stops Such as the wrong date being filled in (easy to do after midnight), or something being put in the wrong box (easy to do at night, in the rain, when you're keeping an eye on a group surrounding you). So not quite the figure you're trying to suggest.As for not knowing why crime falls if cars aren't stopped or Officers available, then once again I ask, you did 30 years???? Some of the things you come out with are mind boggling. Walter Mitty would have more knowledge
Elroy Blue said:
This figure included incorrectly filled out forms, which were suddenly became 'unlawful' stops Such as the wrong date being filled in (easy to do after midnight), or something being put in the wrong box (easy to do at night, in the rain, when you're keeping an eye on a group surrounding you). So not quite the figure you're trying to suggest.
As for not knowing why crime falls if cars aren't stopped or Officers available, then once again I ask, you did 30 years???? Some of the things you come out with are mind boggling. Walter Mitty would have more knowledge
Really Elroy - where in the HMIC report does it mention the above then. Training and knowledge of powers is poor.
HMIC says
Of the 8,783 stop and search records we examined, 27% did not include
sufficient grounds to justify the lawful use of the power. The reasons for this
include low levels of understanding of what constitutes reasonable grounds,
poor supervision, and an absence of oversight by senior officers. Training
should be improved so that officers better understand: what constitutes
reasonable grounds; the impact upon people stopped and searched; and how
the tactic can be used to contribute to the prevention and detection of crime.
Cops need to learn their powers- basic stuff really isnt it.
How much crime do you think is found and reported by patrolling cops - very little in my daily experience - mainly traffic matters which arent notifiable and therefore dont hit the figures.
As for not knowing why crime falls if cars aren't stopped or Officers available, then once again I ask, you did 30 years???? Some of the things you come out with are mind boggling. Walter Mitty would have more knowledge
Really Elroy - where in the HMIC report does it mention the above then. Training and knowledge of powers is poor.
HMIC says
Of the 8,783 stop and search records we examined, 27% did not include
sufficient grounds to justify the lawful use of the power. The reasons for this
include low levels of understanding of what constitutes reasonable grounds,
poor supervision, and an absence of oversight by senior officers. Training
should be improved so that officers better understand: what constitutes
reasonable grounds; the impact upon people stopped and searched; and how
the tactic can be used to contribute to the prevention and detection of crime.
Cops need to learn their powers- basic stuff really isnt it.
How much crime do you think is found and reported by patrolling cops - very little in my daily experience - mainly traffic matters which arent notifiable and therefore dont hit the figures.
Edited by Bigends on Tuesday 9th December 20:29
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