Fine for a dirty number plate?
Discussion
SK425 said:
Dammit said:
It might strike you as absurd, but if your attitude became widespread then the usefulness of the number plate as a means to identify a vehicle would become seriously degraded - which would give a nice justification to always-on GPS telemetry logging where your car is at all times.
i.e. you are choosing to ignore the social contract that enables policing by consent, and inviting a more "forceful" method of ensuring compliance with the rules.
I'm not sure where that reasoning takes us. So I should keep my number plate clean for fear of an escalation of oppression if I don't?i.e. you are choosing to ignore the social contract that enables policing by consent, and inviting a more "forceful" method of ensuring compliance with the rules.
If this attitude became widespread, it might tell you something about most people's feelings towards the rule in question. In this eventuality (which I appreciate is hypothetical) where huge numbers of people allow their number plates to become illegibly dirty, can I not trust the state to consider whether, if so many people seem to want to evade it, the level of monitoring might be too much for most people's liking? That the state's rules have become out of kilter with people's views on the costs and benefits of requiring drivers to have number plates and to keep them clean? Can I not trust the state to consider that the right thing to do then might be to scale back its monitoring and/or remove the requirement for everybody to broadcast their identity? Or should I expect that the inevitable response of the state to such widespread disobedience will just be to reach for a bigger stick to hit everybody with?
that'll sort it.TX.
TooMany2cvs said:
Monkeylegend said:
I always keep my number plates clean,I wouldn't want people thinking my car is older than it is.
But what if the plate had the lease company's logo on it?
What was I thinking of.
anonymous said:
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Similarly you oughtn't have an obscured plate, a point on which both ethics and the law are crystal clear. You're simply not in a position to pass judgement.anonymous said:
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And report who? A car with an obscured plate, or should I clean it first so I know which reg to give?anonymous said:
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Methinks the lady doth protest too much. Just give your plate a clean, its not hard and it doesn't hurt. LucreLout said:
SK425 said:
Do you genuinely only see the possibility of a self-serving motivation for those who have taken a different view to you in this thread? There are extremely good reasons why it's in everybody's interest for people to be discouraged from going round dobbing each other in for minor regulatory transgressions.
Again, no dobbing in, just a two second wipe with a tissue.So do you also carry some Mr Muscle and a pair of pink Marigolds for those stubborn, dirty plates?
anonymous said:
[redacted]
You're wasting your time cmooseThe story about the hit and run never happened as it make no sense.
The driver of the car was never traced, so there could be no proof whatsoever that the person responsible made a conscious effort to keep the number plates dirty to avoid detection from anything, let alone a hit and run.
Lucrelout bangs on about ethics and morals, but is quite clearly telling a lie or is deluded.
don'tbesilly said:
The story about the hit and run never happened as it make no sense.
The driver of the car was never traced, so there could be no proof whatsoever that the person responsible made a conscious effort to keep the number plates dirty to avoid detection from anything, let alone a hit and run.
I've deleted the rest of the hormonal garbage your post was comprised of. The driver of the car was never traced, so there could be no proof whatsoever that the person responsible made a conscious effort to keep the number plates dirty to avoid detection from anything, let alone a hit and run.
I wish what you say was true more than you'll ever realise.
There's no proof of why the car didn't stop, and none that the driver was drunk either. What there is, is a witness who heard a bang, heard a car accelerate away, and upon looking out at the road could see the plate blacked out. The car was never traced and my mate wasn't visible to the witness and so wasn't found until early the next morning. He died a few days later in hospital when his parents had to turn off the life support.
I really don't care too much if you believe me it not. You're just another no mark keyboard warrior. Seen plenty of them before, so you're nothing new.
9mm said:
Impossible on a dry dirty car, filthy enough to obscure a plate.
Not so. It's been working fine for 20 years. It needs to be clean enough to be readable, not spotless. Since plates are shinny smooth plastic, they have an excellent non-stick quality. LucreLout said:
Not so. It's been working fine for 20 years. It needs to be clean enough to be readable, not spotless. Since plates are shinny smooth plastic, they have an excellent non-stick quality.
Yes so. Cannot be done in a couple of seconds, let alone with a dry, dirty plate.I think you're making it up but if you're not I really hope someone sees you messing about with their car and gives you a good kicking.
What do you do about cars with missing plates or cars with dirty lights and windows?
LucreLout said:
don'tbesilly said:
The story about the hit and run never happened as it make no sense.
The driver of the car was never traced, so there could be no proof whatsoever that the person responsible made a conscious effort to keep the number plates dirty to avoid detection from anything, let alone a hit and run.
I've deleted the rest of the hormonal garbage your post was comprised of. The driver of the car was never traced, so there could be no proof whatsoever that the person responsible made a conscious effort to keep the number plates dirty to avoid detection from anything, let alone a hit and run.
I wish what you say was true more than you'll ever realise.
There's no proof of why the car didn't stop, and none that the driver was drunk either. What there is, is a witness who heard a bang, heard a car accelerate away, and upon looking out at the road could see the plate blacked out. The car was never traced and my mate wasn't visible to the witness and so wasn't found until early the next morning. He died a few days later in hospital when his parents had to turn off the life support.
I really don't care too much if you believe me it not. You're just another no mark keyboard warrior. Seen plenty of them before, so you're nothing new.
So the plate was blacked out you say, not dirty.
Seems strange that the driver involved in a hit and run had the foresight to make sure his plate was unreadable prior to the unfortunate and I'll assume unplanned accident.
The driver was clearly a scrote of the highest order to always drive around with an indistinguishable number plate.
It doesn't ring true does it?
Keyboard warrior - Moi, coming from you a master at the craft, I'm not sure whether I should be flattered or insulted.
Funnily enough, on Friday an Audi A4 estate pulled out in front of me, not overly dangerously and I would have paid it no attention but noticed that the rear of the car was filthy.
Later on, we were stationary in a queue and I could not read the number plate at all. Bit after that he joined a lane to turn right, and whilst I wouldn't say the rest of the car was spotless, it was a lot cleaner. The difference was "I just drove through a soggy field" and "I only drive on the road and washed it a month ago".
There's probably a lot more at stake than simple "don't touch my stuff". It's not an argument that trumps what is being put forward here. Going around cleaning number plates is probably beyond what the situation calls for.
Later on, we were stationary in a queue and I could not read the number plate at all. Bit after that he joined a lane to turn right, and whilst I wouldn't say the rest of the car was spotless, it was a lot cleaner. The difference was "I just drove through a soggy field" and "I only drive on the road and washed it a month ago".
There's probably a lot more at stake than simple "don't touch my stuff". It's not an argument that trumps what is being put forward here. Going around cleaning number plates is probably beyond what the situation calls for.
Edited by Ahimoth on Tuesday 3rd February 12:11
9mm said:
Yes so. Cannot be done in a couple of seconds, let alone with a dry, dirty plate.
I think you're making it up but if you're not I really hope someone sees you messing about with their car and gives you a good kicking.
What do you do about cars with missing plates or cars with dirty lights and windows?
Lets be honest, the real issue here is that you and others don't agree with the automated enforcement of speed limits using cameras. I'd bet money that this is the real route of your anger.I think you're making it up but if you're not I really hope someone sees you messing about with their car and gives you a good kicking.
What do you do about cars with missing plates or cars with dirty lights and windows?
If you saw a car driving down the road with dirty lights that reduced the drivers ability to see and be seen would you point this out to them given the chance?
Would you think that it was negligent in any way for someone to drive like this?
If you did give the lights a wipe what do you think the drivers objection would be? Do you think that someone touching your car would actually be grounds for a kicking? I'd suggest that response would mark you out as having a screw loose.
Like it or not, getting behind the wheel of a car comes with responsibilites. You may think that it's no one elses business but that's just your opinion. A car driving in the dark with inadequate lights is everyones business and a car not displaying a registration is also everyones business.
You don't just get to opt out of the rules that you don't like, or at least if you try too then you shouldn't be supprised if people object.
Devil2575 said:
9mm said:
Yes so. Cannot be done in a couple of seconds, let alone with a dry, dirty plate.
I think you're making it up but if you're not I really hope someone sees you messing about with their car and gives you a good kicking.
What do you do about cars with missing plates or cars with dirty lights and windows?
Lets be honest, the real issue here is that you and others don't agree with the automated enforcement of speed limits using cameras. I'd bet money that this is the real route of your anger.I think you're making it up but if you're not I really hope someone sees you messing about with their car and gives you a good kicking.
What do you do about cars with missing plates or cars with dirty lights and windows?
If you saw a car driving down the road with dirty lights that reduced the drivers ability to see and be seen would you point this out to them given the chance?
Would you think that it was negligent in any way for someone to drive like this?
If you did give the lights a wipe what do you think the drivers objection would be? Do you think that someone touching your car would actually be grounds for a kicking? I'd suggest that response would mark you out as having a screw loose.
Like it or not, getting behind the wheel of a car comes with responsibilites. You may think that it's no one elses business but that's just your opinion. A car driving in the dark with inadequate lights is everyones business and a car not displaying a registration is also everyones business.
You don't just get to opt out of the rules that you don't like, or at least if you try too then you shouldn't be supprised if people object.
I note the complete avoidance of my questions regarding whether these wipers extend their cleaning regime to lights and glass. Surely they would, given that these are directly related to road safety.
I agree with the thrust of your argument. I do.
The intention of someone who would object to their number plate being cleaned is pretty clear. As I said, "don't touch my stuff" is a poor argument in response, particularly if an obscured number plate allows people to evade the consequences of their actions, when those actions directly harm others.
However, you aren't going to win an argument with the self-righteous "don't touch my stuff".
In my younger days, after hammering on the door of a neighbour's flat at 2am for over 20mins to get them to turn down their music and getting no response, I entered. What I was met with was not a reasonable discussion over neighbourly-ness, but irate self-righteous drunks shouting at me about trespass.
Anything that they perceive as a wrong directed at them will trump any wrong they have done or intend. You won't win.
The intention of someone who would object to their number plate being cleaned is pretty clear. As I said, "don't touch my stuff" is a poor argument in response, particularly if an obscured number plate allows people to evade the consequences of their actions, when those actions directly harm others.
However, you aren't going to win an argument with the self-righteous "don't touch my stuff".
In my younger days, after hammering on the door of a neighbour's flat at 2am for over 20mins to get them to turn down their music and getting no response, I entered. What I was met with was not a reasonable discussion over neighbourly-ness, but irate self-righteous drunks shouting at me about trespass.
Anything that they perceive as a wrong directed at them will trump any wrong they have done or intend. You won't win.
9mm said:
Your last sentence is interesting. Members of the public have no right to interfere with someone else's property and therefore shouldn't be surprised if someone smacks them in the teeth if they do.
I note the complete avoidance of my questions regarding whether these wipers extend their cleaning regime to lights and glass. Surely they would, given that these are directly related to road safety.
So you're the kind of person who smacks people in the teeth for touching his car?I note the complete avoidance of my questions regarding whether these wipers extend their cleaning regime to lights and glass. Surely they would, given that these are directly related to road safety.
I wouldn't go as far was wiping a number plate, but if I saw the driver i'd point it out. I'd do the same if I saw an idiot driving with dirty lights too.
Ahimoth said:
I agree with the thrust of your argument. I do.
The intention of someone who would object to their number plate being cleaned is pretty clear. As I said, "don't touch my stuff" is a poor argument in response, particularly if an obscured number plate allows people to evade the consequences of their actions, when those actions directly harm others.
However, you aren't going to win an argument with the self-righteous "don't touch my stuff".
In my younger days, after hammering on the door of a neighbour's flat at 2am for over 20mins to get them to turn down their music and getting no response, I entered. What I was met with was not a reasonable discussion over neighbourly-ness, but irate self-righteous drunks shouting at me about trespass.
Anything that they perceive as a wrong directed at them will trump any wrong they have done or intend. You won't win.
It's the same kind of person who uses the word 'grass' and threatens violence when someone complains to the police about their unacceptable behaviour.The intention of someone who would object to their number plate being cleaned is pretty clear. As I said, "don't touch my stuff" is a poor argument in response, particularly if an obscured number plate allows people to evade the consequences of their actions, when those actions directly harm others.
However, you aren't going to win an argument with the self-righteous "don't touch my stuff".
In my younger days, after hammering on the door of a neighbour's flat at 2am for over 20mins to get them to turn down their music and getting no response, I entered. What I was met with was not a reasonable discussion over neighbourly-ness, but irate self-righteous drunks shouting at me about trespass.
Anything that they perceive as a wrong directed at them will trump any wrong they have done or intend. You won't win.
don'tbesilly said:
Tragic story although it gets more embellished the more you expand on it.
Hasn't changed a bit. But as I'm dealing with a simpleton, I anticipated that comprehension might be beyond your abilities.don'tbesilly said:
So the plate was blacked out you say, not dirty.
Blacked out is just another term for dirty in this case. I could also have used obscured, filthy, minging, manky, mucky etc etc...don'tbesilly said:
The driver was clearly a scrote of the highest order to always drive around with an indistinguishable number plate.
Yes, yes he was. Or she. Nobody knows.don'tbesilly said:
It doesn't ring true does it?
Only because your desperately looking for something that isn't there.Looks like you'll be going on the ignore list along with cmoose.
Yes. And the same argument that says that such minor issues such as loud music or dirty number plates should be left to the police. "If you've got a problem with it, call the police".
The person proposing this knows full well the police very likely are not going to do anything about them.
Again though, if you are met with someone who intends evading the consequence of serious actions and you are in the middle of thwarting them, you're not about to have a reasonable conversation. I wouldn't do it.
The person proposing this knows full well the police very likely are not going to do anything about them.
Again though, if you are met with someone who intends evading the consequence of serious actions and you are in the middle of thwarting them, you're not about to have a reasonable conversation. I wouldn't do it.
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