New flat - off street parking - no dropped kerb

[carpmaster]

Hi all. Have recently moved into a rented flat, which was advertised with off street parking. All good as I need to keep the pride and joy safely tucked away.

Anyway, moved in (in a hurry over xmas) and noticed that the kerb in front of the drive isn't actually dropped. Not really sure how I missed it when viewing, but when I did notice I didn't really think it would be a problem. There was a car parked on driveway when I viewed etc.

Fast forward a few months and it's become a bit of a sore point. People kept parking in front while my car was there (which I realise is legal but not something I'd do to someone else) so I left a few polite notes explaining that if I keep being blocked in, I'd have to park on the road taking up a space anyway, so please be considerate, and left my phone number / house number inviting them to pop in for a chat anytime etc. Most people stopped parking there after this note, but a few have carried on regardless. They seem to do it deliberately now. I did have stern words with one of them recently (15 other spaces but they chose the one spot that blocks my car in) along the lines of yes it's legal, but why not be a decent neighbour and park over there (points finger) which is 5 paces away and doesn't block a car in. Cue a blank face and comments about sometimes having to carry shopping.

Really need to get this sorted as my car has been scratched up parked "out in the wild" probably by one of these kind yet slightly dim neighbours.

Obviously I could nuke any car that parks there - or the owner - but at the end of the day it is a legal space, my cars are worth more than their heaps, and I can't be manning the sniper scope 24/7. So it seems the only mature option available is to try and get the landlord to sort the dropped kerb through the council.

So as stated, the flat was advertised with off street parking. Does this mean I'm entitled to a reduction in rent, or a dropped kerb installed so I actually have legal off street parking? Any pointers how to proceed would be most grateful. The landlady is actually quite nice - but I'm not sure she would cough up the likely £1500 costs without a better reason than future resale value & my current level of happiness.

There are 50+ other houses in the street which are the same - park on drive - no dropped kerb - but they all have the kerb directly next to the drive / car. Mine is the only corner house so my car is parked 3m away from the road. Which seems to invite temptation.

Few more things to note:

1) Neighbour next door has a dropped kerb - and struggles to get out when someone is parked in front of mine. So he's very keen to get the council involved / that kerb dropped as it would help him out
2) It's a maisonette - there are people underneath me - they also have a drive - which they don't use because they get blocked in. So they are keen to get it sorted out also. We would "share" the pavement / kerb access that has been dropped / paved.

Any advice would be great. Thanks

[Rovinghawk]

carpmaster said:

I did have stern words with one of them recently

As they're acting within the law & you're not, you might want to rethink the tone you use with them.

carpmaster said:

slightly dim neighbours.

In keeping with my first comment, you might want to rethink your opinion of them.

carpmaster said:

my cars are worth more than their heaps

You really won't win hearts & minds with an attitude like that.

carpmaster said:

So it seems the only mature option available is to try and get the landlord to sort the dropped kerb through the council.

now we're getting somewhere.

carpmaster said:

The landlady is actually quite nice - but I'm not sure she would cough up the likely £1500 costs without a better reason than future resale value & my current level of happiness.

A better reason is that she has to provide what she advertised. Proceed on this.

carpmaster said:

There are 50+ other houses in the street which are the same

What happens elsewhere isn't relevant to your situation- stick to the facts of your rental agreement.

[PV7998]

Unless you're going to live there for a long time that isn't likely to be cost effective. As Rovinghawk says, if it's in the contract somewhere then she should be providing it - however she's unlikely to be too keen to spend £1500 plus the associated paperwork.
I think (IMHO) that if you push it with her she's more likely to simply offer a reduction in rent based on what the rental value would be without off street parking - which may not be that much of a reduction anyway.
It wouldn't solve the parking problem, but it's better than nothing.

[carpmaster]

Rovinghawk said:

As they're acting within the law & you're not, you might want to rethink the tone you use with them.

Rovinghawk said:

In keeping with my first comment, you might want to rethink your opinion of them.

Rovinghawk said:

You really won't win hearts & minds with an attitude like that.

Rovinghawk said:

A better reason is that she has to provide what she advertised. Proceed on this.

You seem to have missed the bit about several polite notes being left. Inviting them up for coffee and to say hi etc. Most people have been completely fine. I have BBQ's with some of them. All is good with this lot.

The person I had words with..... they park there repeatedly after having several polite notes, when they could choose so many other spots that are as close and don't block someone in. You'd have said nothing? They are making a conscious decision to be an arse. Legality aside - in my book it's a stty thing to do when you have an option not to. It deserved a stern word.

I do have a copy of the online advertisement for the flat. I have saved it. I'm not sure what's actually in the tenancy agreement relating to this - but from experience it will all be generic guff and not really related to this place anyway. My questions are more around whether I have a "right" to legal off street parking, or a rental reduction. I'm not sure what the situation would be if I asked for it and she refuses.

[ging84]

Rovinghawk said:

As they're acting within the law & you're not, you might want to rethink the tone you use with them.

how is driving over the pavement to gain lawful access to a property made unlawful by the lack of a dropped kerb?

[don'tbesilly]

ging84 said:

Rovinghawk said:

As they're acting within the law & you're not, you might want to rethink the tone you use with them.

how is driving over the pavement to gain lawful access to a property made unlawful by the lack of a dropped kerb?

Driving across a pavement that doesn't have a dropped kerb to cross that pavement is unlawful.

The landlord can of course make driving across the pavement lawful by paying for a dropped kerb.

[Rovinghawk]

carpmaster said:

It deserved a stern word.

Did the stern word work or was it counter-productive?

[Rovinghawk]

ging84 said:

how is driving over the pavement to gain lawful access to a property made unlawful by the lack of a dropped kerb?

This information is available by means of a brief internet search:

http://www.findlaw.co.uk/law/government/local_gove...

[4rephill]

ging84 said:

how is driving over the pavement to gain lawful access to a property made unlawful by the lack of a dropped kerb?

.

Your post makes no sense! - Without a dropped kerb, there is no "lawful (vehicle) access to a property"

A simple Google search on the subject will explain it all to you!

Try this for a start (From: http://www.enfield.gov.uk/info/1000000625/pavement... )

Vehicle Crossover/Dropped Kerb

"It is an offence to drive over the pavement to park on a private property without a legally constructed vehicle crossover."

(And "Legally constructed" means planned and constructed by the local council only!)

Honestly, it's not that hard to find this st out for yourself!

As for the OP: Write as many nice notes as you like! - You're the one breaking the Law, not those parking in front of your car!

You don't like it? - That's just tough st basically!

[don'tbesilly]

4rephill said:

As for the OP: Write as many nice notes as you like! - You're the one breaking the Law, not those parking in front of your car!

You don't like it? - That's just tough st basically!

Are you angry all the time, or do you reserve that side of your character for just your online persona?

[willis1337]

Speaking from experience,arrange and pay for the dropped kerb yourself,this will solve your parking issues and stress. If you want to try to recoup some of the cost,send receipts to your landlord with a covering letter and copy of your contract (highlighting the parking included within your rental agreement) asking for a contribution of x% or full reimbursement. Fight with landlord if necessary/ you consider it worth your time.

Give up on polite or angry notes for anyone who blocks you in as this will not work all the time. Dropped kerbs vary in cost depending on your council's requirements (can be £800 ) but then it's legally enforceable, anyone blocking you in (not out) can be towed (have local parking enforcement on speed dial), although the tow truck turning up usually results in the offending driver appearing quite quickly and moving car.

Good luck.

[Type R Tom]

For reference, section 184 of the Highways Act 1980 makes what you are doing illegal. Each council is different but as a rough guide they will have set criteria, regarding site lines etc. Here is KCC’s version.

http://www.kent.gov.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0004...

They will then charge you anywhere from £1k to £2k depending on the size, you may find they will “consult” neighbours / parking department due to the effective loss of on street parking. Also expect to wait at least 6 weeks.

[Monty Python]

Just a quick thought - was this space pointed out to you when you looked at the flat? Could your "off-road" parking be somewhere else?

[andburg]

To counter your point that his parking is legal...

I believe it is illegal to knowingly prevent the use of someone elses vehicle in this manner. If you are not parked there then he can block you getting on all he likes but if your car is there, clearly visible and he is blocking you it does not matter whether you are legally parked or not.

next time he does it, call the council / local non emergency plod.

[carpmaster]

andburg said:

To counter your point that his parking is legal...

I believe it is illegal to knowingly prevent the use of someone elses vehicle in this manner. If you are not parked there then he can block you getting on all he likes but if your car is there, clearly visible and he is blocking you it does not matter whether you are legally parked or not.

next time he does it, call the council / local non emergency plod.

This is where the confusion occurs. I've got a friend who's a policeman & he said the same thing. But it was just something he'd "heard" and couldn't be sure. From what I can find myself - most advice is that without a dropped kerb there's nothing that can be done even if you can't get out onto the highway. But nobody really knows for sure. I will try the landlord route - but I can't see it happening. I was planning a car upgrade soon (V6 biturbo Noggy Blue ) but no chance I will do this without proper accessible off street parking!!

[andburg]

This seems to make sense

[PAULJ5555]

They must be low curbs on your street to get the cars up or does eveyone use bits of wood.

[wolves_wanderer]

willis1337 said:

Speaking from experience,arrange and pay for the dropped kerb yourself,this will solve your parking issues and stress. If you want to try to recoup some of the cost,send receipts to your landlord with a covering letter and copy of your contract (highlighting the parking included within your rental agreement) asking for a contribution of x% or full reimbursement. Fight with landlord if necessary/ you consider it worth your time.

Or better still just move if the landlord isn't amenable to providing what she promised in the first place. Quite why you would go to trouble and expense to improve the landlord's property with no realistic chance of being reimbursed I don't know.

[Six Fiend]

It may not be as simple as paying for a dropped kerb. The council won't allow it if the parking area doesn't meet recent environmental standards for draining of water etc. So whole new parking area needed. Quite a chunk on top of the £1000 or s for the kerb.

Had the same thing at my house trying to get an extra space sorted.

[James P]

Six Fiend said:

It may not be as simple as paying for a dropped kerb. The council won't allow it if the parking area doesn't meet recent environmental standards for draining of water etc. So whole new parking area needed. Quite a chunk on top of the £1000 or s for the kerb.

Had the same thing at my house trying to get an extra space sorted.

Similar rules locally here. I paid for a dropped kerb to gain access to an existing driveway without the council raising any problems - cost around £500.

If there had not been a driveway, I would have had to apply for planning permission as well as paying for the hardstanding to be constructed.