paying for a will?
Discussion
Forget to say that the bank first drafted the will with them as executor, the key phrase being that charges " would be those in force at the time the will came to be executed" . Thus no advance notice to my MIL if likely costs.
The will was then sold by the bank to a specialist organisation dealing in probate matters. So a simple case of just waiting for the inevitable and then cashing in. Absolutely horrendous. A simple Google will reveal horror stories.
By contrast my sister and I dealt with my mums estate which was very similar and found it easy, cheap and quick.
The will was then sold by the bank to a specialist organisation dealing in probate matters. So a simple case of just waiting for the inevitable and then cashing in. Absolutely horrendous. A simple Google will reveal horror stories.
By contrast my sister and I dealt with my mums estate which was very similar and found it easy, cheap and quick.
Never ever usa Bank as aill writing service or as executors. They charge a % of the Estate and will rip you off.
I would avoid the DIY ill forms at WH Smith etc. Will writing is something that must be done right, it muct reflect what you want to happen on your death - explicitly. If it doesn't, and there is a contest to the Will, the loopholes will have ot be defended (costs money) and you may not win.
Third lesson. Unless you have a special situation where you need an independent Executor, DO NOT appoint a professional Executor such as a law firm or a solicitor or an accountant. Having a professional Executor ties you down to that person and you will be severely restricted shopping arounf to get the death sorted such as Grant of Probate, Estate Valuation etc. Better to choose someone frommthe open market after talking to a few people and asking for prices - go for a fixed price wherever possible.
The traditional avenue of using a solicitor to draft your ill is now being eroded by the opening up of the Will & Probate practices to the Chartered Accountants (ICAEW). Many of these used to do the Estate Valuation work, liaising with the HMRC to settle taxes as sub-cntractors to legal firms. Many now have a licece to provide this service at far better prices and you know you are dealing with the right person to advise on Estate Valuation and Tax - two big bug bears on a death.
The accoutnants can only operate in what are termed "uncontested" Estates.
That is where there isn't someone coming along to contest the Will or someone appears from out of the blue claiming to be past child of an illegitimate affair or a previor spouse or partner, or that previous partners kids, ho may all come along like hyenas making a claim on the Estate of the deceased.
If you fall into the uncontested Estate category (an Accountant will identify if you do) in my opinion, the Accountant is the better person. He is more likely to work to fixed fees (most solicitors on adminsistering an Estate will charge by time claiming they do not know how much work there will be). The accountant is better placed at Asset Valuation, Tax liabilities and managing the HMRC for you than a solicitor.
My tip would b to talk to an accoutnant who is on the ICAEW list as offering legal services for Estate and Will Writing. The fee for s imple Will (not involving a NRB Discretionary Trusst) is around £150 - £200.
An accountant will charge the same for a Will incorporating a NRB Trust.
A solicitor will charge around £400 - £800 per person for a NRB Discretionary Trust built into the Will. Quite why this is I don't know other than the legal profession like to rip off people. Becasue the TRust doesn't cut in till you die! There is no additonal work in wriitng a Trust Will apart from one or two straightforard clauses.
What's the difference between the legal professions Park and Jurassic Park?
One's a theme park, the other is full of dinosaurs.Avoid Banks!
I would avoid the DIY ill forms at WH Smith etc. Will writing is something that must be done right, it muct reflect what you want to happen on your death - explicitly. If it doesn't, and there is a contest to the Will, the loopholes will have ot be defended (costs money) and you may not win.
Third lesson. Unless you have a special situation where you need an independent Executor, DO NOT appoint a professional Executor such as a law firm or a solicitor or an accountant. Having a professional Executor ties you down to that person and you will be severely restricted shopping arounf to get the death sorted such as Grant of Probate, Estate Valuation etc. Better to choose someone frommthe open market after talking to a few people and asking for prices - go for a fixed price wherever possible.
The traditional avenue of using a solicitor to draft your ill is now being eroded by the opening up of the Will & Probate practices to the Chartered Accountants (ICAEW). Many of these used to do the Estate Valuation work, liaising with the HMRC to settle taxes as sub-cntractors to legal firms. Many now have a licece to provide this service at far better prices and you know you are dealing with the right person to advise on Estate Valuation and Tax - two big bug bears on a death.
The accoutnants can only operate in what are termed "uncontested" Estates.
That is where there isn't someone coming along to contest the Will or someone appears from out of the blue claiming to be past child of an illegitimate affair or a previor spouse or partner, or that previous partners kids, ho may all come along like hyenas making a claim on the Estate of the deceased.
If you fall into the uncontested Estate category (an Accountant will identify if you do) in my opinion, the Accountant is the better person. He is more likely to work to fixed fees (most solicitors on adminsistering an Estate will charge by time claiming they do not know how much work there will be). The accountant is better placed at Asset Valuation, Tax liabilities and managing the HMRC for you than a solicitor.
My tip would b to talk to an accoutnant who is on the ICAEW list as offering legal services for Estate and Will Writing. The fee for s imple Will (not involving a NRB Discretionary Trusst) is around £150 - £200.
An accountant will charge the same for a Will incorporating a NRB Trust.
A solicitor will charge around £400 - £800 per person for a NRB Discretionary Trust built into the Will. Quite why this is I don't know other than the legal profession like to rip off people. Becasue the TRust doesn't cut in till you die! There is no additonal work in wriitng a Trust Will apart from one or two straightforard clauses.
What's the difference between the legal professions Park and Jurassic Park?
One's a theme park, the other is full of dinosaurs.Avoid Banks!
Also be wary of appointing your trusted local solicitor as executor, as my father did. Unfortunately, by the time he died the trusted solicitor had long retired and sold out to some national chain who were utterly useless at everything except finding ways to charge as much as possible.
Me and the wife paid £100 each at a local solicitor for ours about 3 years ago. It made me realise how little I own, everything is in the wife's name, the only thing of value I own is my car! It was more for who we want to look after the kids if we both kick the bucket though and things like that.
cheshire911 said:
A solicitor will charge around £400 - £800 per person for a NRB Discretionary Trust built into the Will. Quite why this is I don't know other than the legal profession like to rip off people. Becasue the TRust doesn't cut in till you die! There is no additonal work in wriitng a Trust Will apart from one or two straightforard clauses.
What's the difference between the legal professions Park and Jurassic Park?
One's a theme park, the other is full of dinosaurs.Avoid Banks!
Harsh (leaping to the defence of my legal brethren and sistren)What's the difference between the legal professions Park and Jurassic Park?
One's a theme park, the other is full of dinosaurs.Avoid Banks!
"one or two straightforward clauses" - and a hell of a lot of knowledge and experience to decide exactly what works and what does not.
When I did my probate course we were shown the text of the world's shortest will: "All to mum".
It turned out that "mum" was the guys wife (which raises some interesting questions about familial relationshps) but once that was clarified the will was entirely valid and suited the family.
But it would be rubbish for just about everyone else.
The length and complexity of a document bears little relationship to the cost as the price reflects the work required to decide if it is appropriate and adequate, not the word count.
I am lining up wills for me and Mrs Bills shortly and expect to pay £750 per will. I think that is good value as we have three properties to cover already and are targeting a fourth this year, two children (one over 18 and one under) whose interests have to be taken care of, protection so that the estate does not end up with a second husband/wife should one of us peg out and the other remarry and IHT to take into account. I could get it done at half the price but I would not feel confident that everything had been taken care of.
The only worry is that it will probably be the drummer from our band doing it. He is a good drummer though.
Billsnemesis said:
cheshire911 said:
A solicitor will charge around £400 - £800 per person for a NRB Discretionary Trust built into the Will. Quite why this is I don't know other than the legal profession like to rip off people. Becasue the TRust doesn't cut in till you die! There is no additonal work in wriitng a Trust Will apart from one or two straightforard clauses.
What's the difference between the legal professions Park and Jurassic Park?
One's a theme park, the other is full of dinosaurs.Avoid Banks!
Harsh (leaping to the defence of my legal brethren and sistren)What's the difference between the legal professions Park and Jurassic Park?
One's a theme park, the other is full of dinosaurs.Avoid Banks!
"one or two straightforward clauses" - and a hell of a lot of knowledge and experience to decide exactly what works and what does not.
I thought (maybe incorrectly?) that writing a Trust document was something that only Solicitors could do - and not something that accountants / IFAs were legally allowed to do?
I'd recommend looking for a STEP member to write Will etc if you're wanting security of a job well done.
cheshire911 said:
Never ever usa Bank as aill writing service or as executors. They charge a % of the Estate and will rip you off.
I would avoid the DIY ill forms at WH Smith etc. Will writing is something that must be done right, it muct reflect what you want to happen on your death - explicitly. If it doesn't, and there is a contest to the Will, the loopholes will have ot be defended (costs money) and you may not win.
Third lesson. Unless you have a special situation where you need an independent Executor, DO NOT appoint a professional Executor such as a law firm or a solicitor or an accountant. Having a professional Executor ties you down to that person and you will be severely restricted shopping arounf to get the death sorted such as Grant of Probate, Estate Valuation etc. Better to choose someone frommthe open market after talking to a few people and asking for prices - go for a fixed price wherever possible.
The traditional avenue of using a solicitor to draft your ill is now being eroded by the opening up of the Will & Probate practices to the Chartered Accountants (ICAEW). Many of these used to do the Estate Valuation work, liaising with the HMRC to settle taxes as sub-cntractors to legal firms. Many now have a licece to provide this service at far better prices and you know you are dealing with the right person to advise on Estate Valuation and Tax - two big bug bears on a death.
The accoutnants can only operate in what are termed "uncontested" Estates.
That is where there isn't someone coming along to contest the Will or someone appears from out of the blue claiming to be past child of an illegitimate affair or a previor spouse or partner, or that previous partners kids, ho may all come along like hyenas making a claim on the Estate of the deceased.
If you fall into the uncontested Estate category (an Accountant will identify if you do) in my opinion, the Accountant is the better person. He is more likely to work to fixed fees (most solicitors on adminsistering an Estate will charge by time claiming they do not know how much work there will be). The accountant is better placed at Asset Valuation, Tax liabilities and managing the HMRC for you than a solicitor.
My tip would b to talk to an accoutnant who is on the ICAEW list as offering legal services for Estate and Will Writing. The fee for s imple Will (not involving a NRB Discretionary Trusst) is around £150 - £200.
An accountant will charge the same for a Will incorporating a NRB Trust.
A solicitor will charge around £400 - £800 per person for a NRB Discretionary Trust built into the Will. Quite why this is I don't know other than the legal profession like to rip off people. Becasue the TRust doesn't cut in till you die! There is no additonal work in wriitng a Trust Will apart from one or two straightforard clauses.
What's the difference between the legal professions Park and Jurassic Park?
One's a theme park, the other is full of dinosaurs.Avoid Banks!
so you would recommend using an accountant if they identify it as (in their opinion likely) an uncontested matter (which they can then work on) in order for them to draft a will to be robust enough to carry out your wishes and survive the possibility of being contested... despite them having no experience of dealing with contested matters?I would avoid the DIY ill forms at WH Smith etc. Will writing is something that must be done right, it muct reflect what you want to happen on your death - explicitly. If it doesn't, and there is a contest to the Will, the loopholes will have ot be defended (costs money) and you may not win.
Third lesson. Unless you have a special situation where you need an independent Executor, DO NOT appoint a professional Executor such as a law firm or a solicitor or an accountant. Having a professional Executor ties you down to that person and you will be severely restricted shopping arounf to get the death sorted such as Grant of Probate, Estate Valuation etc. Better to choose someone frommthe open market after talking to a few people and asking for prices - go for a fixed price wherever possible.
The traditional avenue of using a solicitor to draft your ill is now being eroded by the opening up of the Will & Probate practices to the Chartered Accountants (ICAEW). Many of these used to do the Estate Valuation work, liaising with the HMRC to settle taxes as sub-cntractors to legal firms. Many now have a licece to provide this service at far better prices and you know you are dealing with the right person to advise on Estate Valuation and Tax - two big bug bears on a death.
The accoutnants can only operate in what are termed "uncontested" Estates.
That is where there isn't someone coming along to contest the Will or someone appears from out of the blue claiming to be past child of an illegitimate affair or a previor spouse or partner, or that previous partners kids, ho may all come along like hyenas making a claim on the Estate of the deceased.
If you fall into the uncontested Estate category (an Accountant will identify if you do) in my opinion, the Accountant is the better person. He is more likely to work to fixed fees (most solicitors on adminsistering an Estate will charge by time claiming they do not know how much work there will be). The accountant is better placed at Asset Valuation, Tax liabilities and managing the HMRC for you than a solicitor.
My tip would b to talk to an accoutnant who is on the ICAEW list as offering legal services for Estate and Will Writing. The fee for s imple Will (not involving a NRB Discretionary Trusst) is around £150 - £200.
An accountant will charge the same for a Will incorporating a NRB Trust.
A solicitor will charge around £400 - £800 per person for a NRB Discretionary Trust built into the Will. Quite why this is I don't know other than the legal profession like to rip off people. Becasue the TRust doesn't cut in till you die! There is no additonal work in wriitng a Trust Will apart from one or two straightforard clauses.
What's the difference between the legal professions Park and Jurassic Park?
One's a theme park, the other is full of dinosaurs.Avoid Banks!
hmmmmmmmmm
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