Carrying fuel question
Discussion
Seems its changed since I last checked: http://www.hse.gov.uk/fireandexplosion/petroleum-r...
30 litres if I read that correctly, in max two containers.
Ferry's probably depends on the company involved.
30 litres if I read that correctly, in max two containers.
Ferry's probably depends on the company involved.
GrumpyTwig said:
Seems its changed since I last checked: http://www.hse.gov.uk/fireandexplosion/petroleum-r...
30 litres if I read that correctly, in max two containers.
That's storage at home - not carriage in/on a vehicle. 30 litres if I read that correctly, in max two containers.
This : http://www.hse.gov.uk/cdg/manual/commonproblems/pe... suggests up to 333 litres!
Carriage is covered, I think, by this bit of legislation : http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2009/1348/conte...
Edited by marshalla on Monday 25th May 01:02
marshalla said:
GrumpyTwig said:
Seems its changed since I last checked: http://www.hse.gov.uk/fireandexplosion/petroleum-r...
30 litres if I read that correctly, in max two containers.
That's storage at home - not carriage in/on a vehicle. 30 litres if I read that correctly, in max two containers.
This : http://www.hse.gov.uk/cdg/manual/commonproblems/pe... suggests up to 333 litres!
Carriage is covered, I think, by this bit of legislation : http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2009/1348/conte...
Edited by marshalla on Monday 25th May 01:02
GrumpyTwig said:
Seems its changed since I last checked: http://www.hse.gov.uk/fireandexplosion/petroleum-r...
30 litres if I read that correctly, in max two containers.
Ferry's probably depends on the company involved.
The HSE document is guidance. For the actual S.I. see30 litres if I read that correctly, in max two containers.
Ferry's probably depends on the company involved.
The Petroleum (Consolidation) Regulations 2014 Schedule 2.1
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2014/1637/sched...
GrumpyTwig said:
marshalla said:
GrumpyTwig said:
Seems its changed since I last checked: http://www.hse.gov.uk/fireandexplosion/petroleum-r...
30 litres if I read that correctly, in max two containers.
That's storage at home - not carriage in/on a vehicle. 30 litres if I read that correctly, in max two containers.
This : http://www.hse.gov.uk/cdg/manual/commonproblems/pe... suggests up to 333 litres!
Carriage is covered, I think, by this bit of legislation : http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2009/1348/conte...
Edited by marshalla on Monday 25th May 01:02
ADR exemption said:
1.1.3.3 Exemptions related to the carriage of liquid fuels
The provisions laid down in ADR do not apply to the carriage of:
(a) Fuel contained in the tanks of a vehicle performing a transport operation and destined
for its propulsion or for the operation of any of its equipment.
The fuel may be carried in fixed fuel tanks, directly connected to the vehicle’s engine
and/or auxiliary equipment, which comply with the pertinent legal provisions, or may
be carried in portable fuel containers (such as jerricans).
See - http://cep.mdcr.cz/dok2/PDF/ADR/2009/001_ADR_2009_...The provisions laid down in ADR do not apply to the carriage of:
(a) Fuel contained in the tanks of a vehicle performing a transport operation and destined
for its propulsion or for the operation of any of its equipment.
The fuel may be carried in fixed fuel tanks, directly connected to the vehicle’s engine
and/or auxiliary equipment, which comply with the pertinent legal provisions, or may
be carried in portable fuel containers (such as jerricans).
The HSE document also said:
There are now limits on the total quantity that may be carried under this exemption.
Note that other legislation may limit carriage of petrol etc.
My take on it is:Note that other legislation may limit carriage of petrol etc.
- a jerrican is a storage vessel per Schedule 2.1(a)(iii).
- the car is a storage place per Schedule 2.1(b)(iv)
So whether the car is stationary or in motion makes no difference whatever. You're limited to 30 litres.
No idea, but E85 (bioenthanol) is pretty much unobtainable in the UK since Morrisons stopped selling it several years ago. Biodiesel is a different fuel. The legislation only mentions petrol.
I'm guessing you mean race fuel - http://www.aaoil.co.uk/products/racing-fuels/chemi...
As it still has a petrol content and is inflammable I would imagine it still comes within the scope of the Regulations.
I'm guessing you mean race fuel - http://www.aaoil.co.uk/products/racing-fuels/chemi...
As it still has a petrol content and is inflammable I would imagine it still comes within the scope of the Regulations.
Red Devil said:
No idea, but E85 (bioenthanol) is pretty much unobtainable in the UK since Morrisons stopped selling it several years ago. Biodiesel is a different fuel. The legislation only mentions petrol.
I'm guessing you mean race fuel - http://www.aaoil.co.uk/products/racing-fuels/chemi...
As it still has a petrol content and is inflammable I would imagine it still comes within the scope of the Regulations.
Thanks dude, no I do mean E85 in particular!I'm guessing you mean race fuel - http://www.aaoil.co.uk/products/racing-fuels/chemi...
As it still has a petrol content and is inflammable I would imagine it still comes within the scope of the Regulations.
One of the attendants at the only Shell station for miles around here refuses to let us fill more than one jerry can when we go rallying. No-one there has batted an eyelid in the last ten years until this prat was employed. We just distributed the jerry cans between the various service crew, filled them all at different pumps and then put them back in the transit service van 
Mr2Mike said:
One of the attendants at the only Shell station for miles around here refuses to let us fill more than one jerry can when we go rallying. No-one there has batted an eyelid in the last ten years until this prat was employed. We just distributed the jerry cans between the various service crew, filled them all at different pumps and then put them back in the transit service van
Some filling stations enforce the rules, some don't. We have to, as management check up on us. There is also the possibility that the local fire brigade chap or a mystery shopper will check. If we break the rules, we risk a disciplinary, maybe prosecution, even loss of the site's petroleum licence.Our rules are max 2 cans per transaction, 5l plastic or 10l metal, although we are OK with boat tanks that the local fishing guys bring in, and proper metal jerry cans. Still max 2 per transaction though.
What people do with them after they have paid is up to them.
clockworks said:
Some filling stations enforce the rules, some don't. We have to, as management check up on us. There is also the possibility that the local fire brigade chap or a mystery shopper will check. If we break the rules, we risk a disciplinary, maybe prosecution, even loss of the site's petroleum licence.
Our rules are max 2 cans per transaction, 5l plastic or 10l metal, although we are OK with boat tanks that the local fishing guys bring in, and proper metal jerry cans. Still max 2 per transaction though.
What people do with them after they have paid is up to them.
No issue with only 2 containers.Our rules are max 2 cans per transaction, 5l plastic or 10l metal, although we are OK with boat tanks that the local fishing guys bring in, and proper metal jerry cans. Still max 2 per transaction though.
What people do with them after they have paid is up to them.
The Red Guide said:
FILLING OF MORE THAN TWO PETROL CONTAINERS
15) In considering the numbers of suitable containers that can be filled at one
time you need to take into account the risks to the person filling the
container and also to other people who may be using or working on the
forecourt at the time. You also have duty of care to your customers to
enable them to comply with the legal requirements for any subsequent
carriage or storage of the petrol.
16) A limit of two containers is generally accepted as providing a reasonable
level of safety on the forecourt and also allows for compliance with the
majority of storage conditions applicable to petrol supplied to the general
public for their private/domestic use. This does not mean that greater
numbers of containers cannot be legally filled but it will be for you to decide
on the appropriate numbers based on a risk assessment and a review of
your hazardous area classification; as is required of you by the Dangerous
Substances & Explosive Atmospheres Regulations 2002 (DSEAR).
15) In considering the numbers of suitable containers that can be filled at one
time you need to take into account the risks to the person filling the
container and also to other people who may be using or working on the
forecourt at the time. You also have duty of care to your customers to
enable them to comply with the legal requirements for any subsequent
carriage or storage of the petrol.
16) A limit of two containers is generally accepted as providing a reasonable
level of safety on the forecourt and also allows for compliance with the
majority of storage conditions applicable to petrol supplied to the general
public for their private/domestic use. This does not mean that greater
numbers of containers cannot be legally filled but it will be for you to decide
on the appropriate numbers based on a risk assessment and a review of
your hazardous area classification; as is required of you by the Dangerous
Substances & Explosive Atmospheres Regulations 2002 (DSEAR).
https://www.energyinst.org/documents/1317
However your container capacity rules are out of date as they are based on the pre 2014 Regs.
I reckon they need to be reviewed in case an aggrieved customer were to take the matter further.
http://www.hse.gov.uk/fireandexplosion/design-manu...
http://www.hse.gov.uk/fireandexplosion/portabable-...
http://www.hse.gov.uk/fireandexplosion/owner-petro...
I've heard that my employer is currently reviewing the allowable sizes, but it's a big company, and these things take time. Might speed the process up if people start complaining to head office, rather than just taking it out on us.
They will have to retrain all of us to account for the new rules (no, really - we have to go through fully documented refresher training every 6 months), and that's a big undertaking with 6000+ staff.
They will have to retrain all of us to account for the new rules (no, really - we have to go through fully documented refresher training every 6 months), and that's a big undertaking with 6000+ staff.
I vaguely remember from when I worked at a petrol station about 7 years ago that we could only let people fill one jerry can plus their own vehicle and there was a chart with what types of cans were OK.Then again it was yonks ago and I might not be remember it correctly. That was an Esso branded station run by a fairly large company.
I once filled up four 20 litre jerry cans plus a fill up for the road car at the same time.
The chap (spoke like he was from India) behind the till asked me how I had bought so much petrol. I told him I had the optional Honda Civic Type R long range fuel tank fitted....
He seemed quite impressed as he had never heard of that before.
The chap (spoke like he was from India) behind the till asked me how I had bought so much petrol. I told him I had the optional Honda Civic Type R long range fuel tank fitted....
He seemed quite impressed as he had never heard of that before.
I work in a boat dealership and regularly take in boats with 400+ litre tanks. Is fine when they're new and still on a trailer, but our marina hasn't got petrol at the Quay side, so we regularly put 5, and sometimes more Jerry cans in the back of the van and fill them up and I've never had an issue filling them up. But I do tend to go the far side of the forecourt and fill them through the side door of the van. My dad did once get speed from filling his boat up during the fuel strike 15yrs ago tho.
I tried to fill up my track car while it was on the trailer. Attendant wouldn't switch on the pump as it was 'against the law' - he did let me fill up a Jerry can though. Then stood by silently watching as I filled the track car from the Jerry can using a funnel. Still not sure whether it was against some internal regulation or not but common sense really should prevail in a situation like that. Can't believe the law would differentiate between a type approved fuel tank depending on whether the wheels are on the tarmac or not.
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