Rejecting a new 2015 BMW M5 CP - advice please
Discussion
eccles said:
daemon said:
eccles said:
And some people have no backbone...;)
So you're supporting the compensation culture britain has got then?And for the record, my dad liked the car and was happy with it and didnt want to give up on it. Nothing to do with backbone.
From your posts it appears that you are happy to spend your money on a premium product, and when it goes wrong, you're quite happy to keep paying for that product even though you can't use it. You (or your father) also seem happy to spend your time making endless trips to the dealer to get this premium product repaired, and seem to enjoy sitting by the side of the road after it's broken down.
Where do you draw the line? If your new car was in the garage awaiting new parts that were on back order, how long do you think it would be reasonable before you thought you were entitled to some recompense? one week? 3 weeks? 2 months? or would you just say bless the manufacturer, s
t happens, I'm sure they're doing their best!eccles said:
Where did I say I was supporting com-pen-say-shun culture?
Well you drew the "logical" conclusion that my father had no backbone because he hadnt demanded com-pen-say-shun, did you not?eccles said:
From your posts it appears that you are happy to spend your money on a premium product, and when it goes wrong, you're quite happy to keep paying for that product even though you can't use it.
When it is reasonable to do so, yes, and as you are required to do by the SOGA.If I were to buy a new 4K TV and i brought it home and it wouldnt work, it would be reasonable to expect an instant replacement or an instant refund. If i had it a week and that happened, i'd probably still expect a replacement. After a month, well probably they're going to send someone out to repair it.
With a car, where its a complex mechanical item and supplied with a three year warranty under which the manufacturer warrants the parts are fault free or will replace them, then IF theres a minor fault it is entirely reasonable to allow the dealer to fix it. I would probably ensure the manufacturer is involved if it wasnt fixed first time. By attempt three, i'd be considering "options".
I dont think its reasonable (and not having a go at the O/P here, as hes now more happy with the outcome and hopefully that will be soon), to buy a new car, have a minor issue and expect the dealer / manufacturer to replace the car. Quite frankly, thats unreasonable and a bit daft.
And i think ALL of the above is supported within the SOGA
eccles said:
You (or your father) also seem happy to spend your time making endless trips to the dealer to get this premium product repaired, and seem to enjoy sitting by the side of the road after it's broken down.
Nope. And again, you're making assumptions to continue your argument.There was an engine rattle at startup, the car drove perfectly after that. The manufacturer replaced the engine as soon as they heard it (via a video clip recording), rather than strip it down and attempt a repair.
Second failure, was plain embarassing for the dealer. New engine losing water, and again rather than attempt to strip it, the manufacturer replaced the engine.
Granted, several trips to the dealer. Dealer very helpful. My father loved the car, didnt want to give up on it so was happy to let them. Had that engine failed we'd have looked at our options. I would have expected the dealer and manufacturer by that point to be supportive of a replacement car, so there'd have been no legal wranglings to be done.
So no breakdowns, no endless trips to the dealers, no lack of backbone, no "i simply must have com-pen-say-shun for the stress / loss of use / lack of confidence in the product". Just plain pragmatism.
eccles said:
Where do you draw the line? If your new car was in the garage awaiting new parts that were on back order, how long do you think it would be reasonable before you thought you were entitled to some recompense? one week? 3 weeks? 2 months? or would you just say bless the manufacturer, st happens, I'm sure they're doing their best!
I think there has to be a controlled timeframe associated with it. That would be reasonable. t happens, I'm sure they're doing their best!As when happened with my wifes alloy wheel, which was OOS in Germany and on back order from the manufacturer, we were told it would be 2-3 weeks. It turned out to be less than two.
If it were an extended period with no sign of the part being made, then i'd be looking at options - however there is no evidence - yet - that thats the case.
Garvin said:
I agree that the OP, or anyone else for that matter, shouldn't have to continue to pay for something that can't do the job. In this case BMW will fix the car, have halved one months payment (equivalent to 2 weeks or so of not having use of the car), have provided a courtesy car, a Mini, which they will replace with a 5 series until the OP's car is fixed. I think BMW also agree with compensating the OP and have done a damn fine job.
Rejection, on the other hand, is not 'on the cards'. It may be a BMW but it is an electro-mechanical piece of kit and there ain't no such beast that can never go wrong - even from brand, spanking new. That is what the warranty is for and BMW appear to be standing up to the terms of their warranty in full.
Mildly annoying and a bit inconvenient for the OP, but that's about it. I'm sure most of us have suffered some more annoying/inconvenient things in our lives, even the OP. We just get on with things, same here.
Yes, particularly given its a very upgraded, almost totally "bespoke" car. Unfortunately things go wrong. Doesnt mean you've the right to a replacement every time.Rejection, on the other hand, is not 'on the cards'. It may be a BMW but it is an electro-mechanical piece of kit and there ain't no such beast that can never go wrong - even from brand, spanking new. That is what the warranty is for and BMW appear to be standing up to the terms of their warranty in full.
Mildly annoying and a bit inconvenient for the OP, but that's about it. I'm sure most of us have suffered some more annoying/inconvenient things in our lives, even the OP. We just get on with things, same here.
eccles said:
daemon said:
If it were an extended period with no sign of the part being made, then i'd be looking at options - however there is no evidence - yet - that thats the case.
So would your options include compensation?To draw some sort of parallel, i bought a 3 year old "approved used" 535d M Sport some years ago from a main dealer. Car had, and under the approved used scheme sign off, a FBMWSH. After owning the car a year, i asked them to stamp up the service book as it had a couple of stamps missing - no biggie given they're usually on the computer. Turns out they couldnt trace the full history, and it was missing two services. I gave them time to "repair", ie, find the missing details via BMW UK or BMW Ireland (i live in the north so theres a chance it was done by a southern dealer) and they (i was dealing with the dealer principal directly by this stage) couldnt so i asked the dealer to replace the car with one that had the FBMWSH that i had paid for through the Approved Used Scheme or refund. As they didnt have another they refunded me the (agreed) value of a car with a FBMWSH at that time, and thry took the car back.
I think that was entirely reasonable under repair, refund or replace.
No com-pen-say-shun.
eccles said:
daemon said:
If it were an extended period with no sign of the part being made, then i'd be looking at options - however there is no evidence - yet - that thats the case.
So would your options include compensation?I don't get the vitriol towards OP. Neither do I get all the self-congratulating, mostly irrelevant, stories of what I, my dad, my dog did in similar circumstances. Just because you do ( or pretend to do ) things certain way, it doesn't it make it the only valid way. There were some useful posts explaining that rejection on grounds mentioned is not an option. Op, from what I've read, took that info, said thanks and that was that.
Typing compensation in that weird way doesn't make you clever, it makes you look needy for approval from equally feeble-minded tits.
Typing compensation in that weird way doesn't make you clever, it makes you look needy for approval from equally feeble-minded tits.
Edited by jjlynn27 on Saturday 1st August 12:48
jjlynn27 said:
I don't get the vitriol towards OP.
Is there any continued vitriol? The O/P has since come back saying hes getting a 5 series so hes happy in the meantime, and thanked everyone for their contributions.Fair play to them for coming back with an update.
Wheres the problem?
jjlynn27 said:
Neither do I get all the self-congratulating, mostly irrelevant, stories of what I, my dad, my dog did in similar circumstances. Just because you do ( or pretend to do ) things certain way, it doesn't it make it the only valid way. There were some useful posts explaining that rejection on grounds mentioned is not an option. Op, from what I've read, took that info, said thanks and that was that.
What i was doing was backing up what i said i would do, with real experiences of what i have actually done in "similar" circumstances. As opposed to willy waving, roaring and shouting on an internet forum about what other people "have rights" to do, but not actually having any balls to do it in real life.jjlynn27 said:
Typing compensation in that weird way doesn't make you clever, it makes you look needy for approval from equally feeble-minded tits.
Its not to seek approval from anyone, its a reference to the much vaunted "com-pen-say-shun" culture that we have in the UK now of "where theres blame, theres a claim".Sorry you didnt pick up on the social references.
Edited by daemon on Saturday 1st August 13:14
daemon said:
After owning the car a year, i asked them to stamp up the service book as it had a couple of stamps missing. As they didnt have another they refunded me the (agreed) value of a car with a FBMWSH at that time, and thry took the car bac
I had virtually the same with an M3, having bought bmw approved used and owned it for 18 months I tried to trade it in and a dealer noticed it was missing the all important 1,200 mile service. I went back to the supplying dealer who had no hesitation in making me a really good offer to buy the car back. Compensation never occurred to me and in fact I was so pleased with how the dealer had sorted the problem with no argument and no fuss that I won't go anywhere else for either bmw purchases or servicing. LoonR1 said:
JustinP1 said:
£30k in three years is astonishing.
This is a real case where the SOGA should apply. Clearly, when the warranty runs out, it's uneconomical to own the car.
Can I ask what the solicitor advised regarding a potential claim?
A load of stuff that I ant remember off the top of my head. I've left it with them to sort but they're pretty confident, but I guess they will be as they earn either way. This is a real case where the SOGA should apply. Clearly, when the warranty runs out, it's uneconomical to own the car.
Can I ask what the solicitor advised regarding a potential claim?
BMW could argue that as you car has had 30k warranty work they have already replaced 75% of the car.
btcc123 said:
I believe your solicitor will have a problem being successful rejecting your car as it is over 3 years old.
BMW could argue that as you car has had 30k warranty work they have already replaced 75% of the car.
We'll see. It went back in yesterday with yet another engine management light fault. This is the 8th since the engine was replaced. They'll struggle to say they've fixed it. BMW could argue that as you car has had 30k warranty work they have already replaced 75% of the car.
LoonR1 said:
btcc123 said:
I believe your solicitor will have a problem being successful rejecting your car as it is over 3 years old.
BMW could argue that as you car has had 30k warranty work they have already replaced 75% of the car.
We'll see. It went back in yesterday with yet another engine management light fault. This is the 8th since the engine was replaced. They'll struggle to say they've fixed it. BMW could argue that as you car has had 30k warranty work they have already replaced 75% of the car.
Sheepshanks said:
BMW sold him a car which broke. It should be their their problem, not his. But they make it into his problem by dicking him around and taking the piss.
Lending him a Mini Cooper "S" for a week or so.Taking the piss....
Diddums daddums.....
Anyhow they have now "upgraded" the loan car.....
There are literally thousands and thousands of parts in a brand new car, the part that failed was probably a seal costing a fiver.....unfortunate.
I fully appreciate it is very inconvenient and annoying for the OP, it would be different if the car had been stuck in the workshop for weeks and weeks on end, awaiting a replacement part.
I hope the problem is sorted very quickly, and the OP gets plenty of pleasure out of his new car.
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