The new Average speed cameras on the A40 /westway West Lond
Discussion
HotJambalaya said:
Disgusting little money maker, being show for what it is. Making £100k a month....
I must have travelled along this stretch of road 30 times since the cameras went live, and they've not had a bean off me. That's because I've worked out a great little scam to avoid getting fined. I stick to the limit. Ken Figenus said:
DonkeyApple said:
Whether average camera systems are any good or should be used is a totally separate issue.
I think that deal is done and the ink totally dried. You saw the thread on the TFL comedy consultation and just do it anyway?I can see the argument that it may benefit flow during peak hours but outside of that it's probably more hazardous as it's just another road where most people are reduced to staring at a dial instead of the road ahead and their brains switch into neutral.
TwigtheWonderkid said:
I must have travelled along this stretch of road 30 times since the cameras went live, and they've not had a bean off me. That's because I've worked out a great little scam to avoid getting fined. I stick to the limit.
If you've got a scam, does that leave Transport for London with an era? 
It's all very well for you, I and other regular A40 users, we saw the cameras go up, we read this topic and saw the information signs (now gone) telling us the average speed camera system would be live from 26 Oct. Occasional visitors to London on the A40, otoh, may not know any of that and might simply have driven safely and considerately, rather than putting compliance to the top of their priorities. I expect that many of those done for speeding may have been speeding in several sections. Have they been done for several offences (say 7 speeding on 1 journey), or just 1 offence for that day?
Dave Finney said:
TwigtheWonderkid said:
I must have travelled along this stretch of road 30 times since the cameras went live, and they've not had a bean off me. That's because I've worked out a great little scam to avoid getting fined. I stick to the limit.
If you've got a scam, does that leave Transport for London with an era? It's all very well for you, I and other regular A40 users, we saw the cameras go up, we read this topic and saw the information signs (now gone) telling us the average speed camera system would be live from 26 Oct. Occasional visitors to London on the A40, otoh, may not know any of that and might simply have driven safely and considerately, rather than putting compliance to the top of their priorities. I expect that many of those done for speeding may have been speeding in several sections. Have they been done for several offences (say 7 speeding on 1 journey), or just 1 offence for that day?
How would that defence fly if it was a bank robber getting nabbed by CCTV evidence?
Shaoxter said:
CoolHands said:
the ones on the north circ near hanger lane to ikea wembley don't seem to be live yet - I noticed last few days they have intermittently been 'lit up' for periods of time ie the row of four lights have a grid of led's on them that light up and light the road immediately in front of them. I think they are installing / testing them at the mo. Might try and take a pic if I see them lit up next week.
They've been like that for a while, going all the way to where I live in Finchley and beyond.No average speed signs so assuming they're not live yet.
Geekman said:
They're already installed on the a2, because of course it's really dangerous to do more than 50MPH on a straight dual carriageway 
Quite. One could almost believe that the limits are set too low for a road, for some reason... I've seen very narrow country roads at national speed limit and never seen a camera. Exceeding 60 on the roads I'm thinking of would truly be perhaps inviting an off, but of course a camera wouldn't rake much money in on such a road.
TwigtheWonderkid said:
No idea if it's one offence or more. But the complaint here seems to be "I got done because no one told me the speed limits that are perfectly clearly marked are being actively policed. Had I known I was being monitored I wouldn't have committed the offence".
How would that defence fly if it was a bank robber getting nabbed by CCTV evidence?
The discussion is a little more developed than 'don't speed; don't moan'. There is little moral highground as most of us don't exceed the limit most of the time. The discussion isn't really about that or any resentment at having to stick to a limit that really does improve safety. I suspect you know this but the simplistic 'dont speed; never get a ticket; live happily ever after' is SO much easier. Sadly it hardly scratches the surface on so many issues/angles/concerns so it is barely worth saying anymore - and I too speak as someone who got his homework in FIRST and laughed at those non-compliant moaners in detention How would that defence fly if it was a bank robber getting nabbed by CCTV evidence?
This subject is a bit more grown up though.Ken Figenus said:
TwigtheWonderkid said:
No idea if it's one offence or more. But the complaint here seems to be "I got done because no one told me the speed limits that are perfectly clearly marked are being actively policed. Had I known I was being monitored I wouldn't have committed the offence".
How would that defence fly if it was a bank robber getting nabbed by CCTV evidence?
The discussion is a little more developed than 'don't speed; don't moan'. There is little moral highground as most of us don't exceed the limit most of the time. The discussion isn't really about that or any resentment at having to stick to a limit that really does improve safety. I suspect you know this but the simplistic 'dont speed; never get a ticket; live happily ever after' is SO much easier. Sadly it hardly scratches the surface on so many issues/angles/concerns so it is barely worth saying anymore - and I too speak as someone who got his homework in FIRST and laughed at those non-compliant moaners in detention How would that defence fly if it was a bank robber getting nabbed by CCTV evidence?
This subject is a bit more grown up though.The official world has been anti-motorist for some time. Somebody at the HA once described commuters as 'the lowest of the low' and there are folks, including a retired police class 1 (car and bike) driver, who consider this now includes the police. See the solo effort so far at this homely link if you're interested:
http://bit.ly/1O8cZGx
turbobloke said:
And potentially wide-ranging but that's not an attempt to derail the thread, merely take it on a weekday excursion.
The official world has been anti-motorist for some time. Somebody at the HA once described commuters as 'the lowest of the low' and there are folks, including a retired police class 1 (car and bike) driver, who consider this now includes the police. See the solo effort so far at this homely link if you're interested:
http://bit.ly/1O8cZGx
Read this page on the blog linked aboveThe official world has been anti-motorist for some time. Somebody at the HA once described commuters as 'the lowest of the low' and there are folks, including a retired police class 1 (car and bike) driver, who consider this now includes the police. See the solo effort so far at this homely link if you're interested:
http://bit.ly/1O8cZGx
http://driveeastmidlands.blogspot.co.uk/search/lab...
The guy is a t
tgiantdefy said:
Read this page on the blog linked above
http://driveeastmidlands.blogspot.co.uk/search/lab...
The guy is a tt
OMFG - is that Alf Garnet resurrected? Just blows any salient, well researched points out of contention. I couldn't do more then a paragraph. And shes 'a gay' FFS.http://driveeastmidlands.blogspot.co.uk/search/lab...
The guy is a t
tThis is why we need to develop the argument rather than leave it to all to 'what did I say wrong' bearded pensioners and the calculated vested interests.
V8 Fettler said:
Motorists as a group don't have meaningful representation; the "war" on motorists will continue until there is meaningful representation.
The driveeastmidlands blog must be a spoof.
That is a good observation. The motorist has two issues. One is that they are incredibly easy to tax and the second is that they are very good scape goats. The AA et al aren't the most efficient lobby group to be defending what is, in reality, quite a soft target. The driveeastmidlands blog must be a spoof.
TwigtheWonderkid said:
Dave Finney said:
TwigtheWonderkid said:
I must have travelled along this stretch of road 30 times since the cameras went live, and they've not had a bean off me. That's because I've worked out a great little scam to avoid getting fined. I stick to the limit.
If you've got a scam, does that leave Transport for London with an era? It's all very well for you, I and other regular A40 users, we saw the cameras go up, we read this topic and saw the information signs (now gone) telling us the average speed camera system would be live from 26 Oct. Occasional visitors to London on the A40, otoh, may not know any of that and might simply have driven safely and considerately, rather than putting compliance to the top of their priorities. I expect that many of those done for speeding may have been speeding in several sections. Have they been done for several offences (say 7 speeding on 1 journey), or just 1 offence for that day?
How would that defence fly if it was a bank robber getting nabbed by CCTV evidence?
I took some pics for interest.
There are two parts to the system. One stand has these anpr type cameras which presumably cover all lanes & I think are the thing that calculates your average speed:
then there is another stand which has five led lamps on it:
which are at the moment being periodically lit up such (they are very bright):
they are lighting these symbols on the road (there's one in the far-lane too):
I suspect they are the evidence to prove the fact the cameras have calculated that you are over the average speed.
There are two parts to the system. One stand has these anpr type cameras which presumably cover all lanes & I think are the thing that calculates your average speed:
then there is another stand which has five led lamps on it:
which are at the moment being periodically lit up such (they are very bright):
they are lighting these symbols on the road (there's one in the far-lane too):
I suspect they are the evidence to prove the fact the cameras have calculated that you are over the average speed.
I suspect the L-shaped marks that are on the road, are probably mainly to aid in keeping it all lined up; if the lights or cameras get whacked by a bird (!) or more likely a maintenance man's cherry picker, such marks will make it really easy to re-point the lights or the cameras and make sure the marked area is properly illuminated / fills the camera frame. Similar to how tube station platform edges have a series of yellow diamonds or squares painted at seemingly random places, actually they are so that when they've done maintenance on the cameras it only takes seconds to re-point them correctly, by ensuring the yellow diamond is centre bottom of that cameras's picture.
CoolHands said:
I took some pics for interest.
There are two parts to the system. One stand has these anpr type cameras which presumably cover all lanes & I think are the thing that calculates your average speed:
then there is another stand which has five led lamps on it:
which are at the moment being periodically lit up such (they are very bright):
they are lighting these symbols on the road (there's one in the far-lane too):
I suspect they are the evidence to prove the fact the cameras have calculated that you are over the average speed.
Your photos will make clear which cameras are the average speed cameras. It would appear that:There are two parts to the system. One stand has these anpr type cameras which presumably cover all lanes & I think are the thing that calculates your average speed:
then there is another stand which has five led lamps on it:
which are at the moment being periodically lit up such (they are very bright):
they are lighting these symbols on the road (there's one in the far-lane too):
I suspect they are the evidence to prove the fact the cameras have calculated that you are over the average speed.
The lights are there to ensure every number plate can be seen clearly by the cameras.
The lines on the road are reference points to prove the distances between each camera set.
The way the average speed cameras work is:
a) each camera sends video to a computer
b) the computer scans the video looking for number plates
c) when a number plate is seen, the computer:
1) records the picture
2) reads and records the vehicle registration number
3) records the time
So, for each camera, there's a picture of every vehicle that passed, with it's No plate and the time.
The computers then look for all the records of each vehicle and subtract the times each vehicle was at each camera. Knowing the distance between each camera, a check is made to see if any vehicle reached the next camera in a time shorter than is allowed. If so, that vehicle must have travelled faster than the speed limit.
Note, it doesn't matter what speed you pass each camera. You could do 80mph past every camera and you shouldn't be prosecuted for speeding, so long as you stop for a while in between each pair of cameras!
You'll also note that every single vehicle is photographed, speeding or not, time and time again as it travels. This means that the authorities can know where every single vehicle was, and when it was there, day or night, all of the time. They might also see from the photographs how many occupants in each vehicle, age, sex, descriptions etc. If the data is stored, these cameras may be very useful to track terrorists, criminals, demonstrators, activists, political opposition groups, and anyone else the authorities may wish to monitor on our behalf.
Dave Finney said:
... these cameras may be very useful to track terrorists, criminals, demonstrators, activists, political opposition groups, and anyone else the authorities may wish to monitor on our behalf.
I might suggest in reality that they catch more trivialities from soft targets than they thwart actual terrorists. Its all getting a bit East German! But hey ho I've nothing to hide - other than my innocence!Drove back into Town yesterday afternoon on the A40. The only cars ignoring the the average speed cameras were a selection of BMWs and Mercs and a succession of cars displaying those fluorescent green disabled badges in their rear window. A couple of dimwits in BMWs were braking hard for each camera pole and then flooring it!
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