Another NIP - A depressing experience
Discussion
My second NIP. The previous one was in 2006.
Mobile camera caught me doing 79 in a 70 some miles east of Sparkford on the A303 a few weeks ago. I happened to have my GPS tracker running so I thought I would check it. Sure enough I was doing 79 at the stated time. However further checking put a slightly different perspective on it. The total driving time was 4h36m. During that time I was doing 79 or over for no more than 43 seconds. The weather was clear, road dry, visibility for over a mile. Whole stream of cars doing more or less the same speed, all behaving reasonably. Saw no accidents or even close calls on the whole journey either in front or behind me.
So all legal. Nothing to do with justice. Nothing to do with safety. All about money. They must have 'earned' many £1000's that day.
I elected to take the 'Speed Awareness Scheme' class. The NIP was from the Avon and Somerset police but I elected to take it in Surrey which was nearer for me. It was made clear at the start of the course that it would be wise to be cooperative and that if your mobile phone rang or even vibrated you were finished and failed.
The course was educational for me, but not in the way they intended. There were 23 in the class, all apparently of normal intelligence and education. However I was appalled at the abysmal lack of knowledge about driving. Not any exotic knowledge, just ordinary knowledge that you need to pass your test. I was the only person in the class that knew the difference between a single and dual carriageway. Only 50% knew the various speed limits for a car.
There was heavy emphasis on the fact that even 1mph over the limit was dangerous and only brief mention of the fact that under the speed limit might be dangerous as well. Also conflated exceeding the speed limit and wrong speed for conditions.
One section was something to do with attention and observation I think but I wasn't quite sure. At one point we had to count the number of 'F's in a short sentence in about 15 seconds. I and two others got the correct answer (it was 6). The other two said they managed to count up to 5 and guessed there was probably 6. I just counted them.
They gave an example of dangerous speed. A driver killed someone on a pedestrian crossing doing 39 in a 30. It had nothing to do with speed. There was almost 100yds clear view to the crossing but the driver just didn't bother braking either before or after the crossing. There was also a large something dangling from the rear view mirror. They also somehow blamed the fatality on the vehicles kinetic energy, not its speed.
One interesting point though. It was stated that Wales is starting to impose a no tolerance policy. They have seen drivers booked for 31 or 32 in a 30 and 41 or 42 in a 40.
I just said enough to show I was cooperating, bit my tongue when they were talking nonsense, and left quietly at the end.
Overall a depressing experience.
Judgement by machine.
Sentence by decree.
Education by diktat.
There, I feel better now. I am no driving god, just another driver who wants to stay safe. Without doubt there are very many better and more knowledgeable drivers here and elsewhere. Obviously none of them were on that class.
Mobile camera caught me doing 79 in a 70 some miles east of Sparkford on the A303 a few weeks ago. I happened to have my GPS tracker running so I thought I would check it. Sure enough I was doing 79 at the stated time. However further checking put a slightly different perspective on it. The total driving time was 4h36m. During that time I was doing 79 or over for no more than 43 seconds. The weather was clear, road dry, visibility for over a mile. Whole stream of cars doing more or less the same speed, all behaving reasonably. Saw no accidents or even close calls on the whole journey either in front or behind me.
So all legal. Nothing to do with justice. Nothing to do with safety. All about money. They must have 'earned' many £1000's that day.
I elected to take the 'Speed Awareness Scheme' class. The NIP was from the Avon and Somerset police but I elected to take it in Surrey which was nearer for me. It was made clear at the start of the course that it would be wise to be cooperative and that if your mobile phone rang or even vibrated you were finished and failed.
The course was educational for me, but not in the way they intended. There were 23 in the class, all apparently of normal intelligence and education. However I was appalled at the abysmal lack of knowledge about driving. Not any exotic knowledge, just ordinary knowledge that you need to pass your test. I was the only person in the class that knew the difference between a single and dual carriageway. Only 50% knew the various speed limits for a car.
There was heavy emphasis on the fact that even 1mph over the limit was dangerous and only brief mention of the fact that under the speed limit might be dangerous as well. Also conflated exceeding the speed limit and wrong speed for conditions.
One section was something to do with attention and observation I think but I wasn't quite sure. At one point we had to count the number of 'F's in a short sentence in about 15 seconds. I and two others got the correct answer (it was 6). The other two said they managed to count up to 5 and guessed there was probably 6. I just counted them.
They gave an example of dangerous speed. A driver killed someone on a pedestrian crossing doing 39 in a 30. It had nothing to do with speed. There was almost 100yds clear view to the crossing but the driver just didn't bother braking either before or after the crossing. There was also a large something dangling from the rear view mirror. They also somehow blamed the fatality on the vehicles kinetic energy, not its speed.
One interesting point though. It was stated that Wales is starting to impose a no tolerance policy. They have seen drivers booked for 31 or 32 in a 30 and 41 or 42 in a 40.
I just said enough to show I was cooperating, bit my tongue when they were talking nonsense, and left quietly at the end.
Overall a depressing experience.
Judgement by machine.
Sentence by decree.
Education by diktat.
There, I feel better now. I am no driving god, just another driver who wants to stay safe. Without doubt there are very many better and more knowledgeable drivers here and elsewhere. Obviously none of them were on that class.
No way. That's astonishingly novel...
You got done speeding in the 3 or 4 milliseconds you crept into 10%+2 territory
Noone died that you saw so the speed limits are set too low
Someone's making money out of courses
Everyone else is a muppet not me.
Sorry, but it's not that bad. We've heard it a million times and in the grand scheme of things it's a bit trivial. You got caught, had to listen to the surrey driveaware muppets and everyone else was a moron.
Learn anything from the course?
Bert
You got done speeding in the 3 or 4 milliseconds you crept into 10%+2 territory
Noone died that you saw so the speed limits are set too low
Someone's making money out of courses
Everyone else is a muppet not me.
Sorry, but it's not that bad. We've heard it a million times and in the grand scheme of things it's a bit trivial. You got caught, had to listen to the surrey driveaware muppets and everyone else was a moron.
Learn anything from the course?
Bert
k that bbobmalcs said:
One interesting point though. It was stated that Wales is starting to impose a no tolerance policy. They have seen drivers booked for 31 or 32 in a 30 and 41 or 42 in a 40.
Sounds like a case of scaremongering to me. Dont see how they could enforce it. Also, their argument that a modern speedo is super accurate is crap. They're not.bobmalcs said:
I just said enough to show I was cooperating, bit my tongue when they were talking nonsense, and left quietly at the end.
Very wise. Some bits of it are no doubt intelligent, but 90% is probably drivel.bobmalcs said:
During that time I was doing 79 or over for no more than 43 seconds.
So all legal.
You seem to contradict yourself So all legal.
. Unless the speed limit on motorways has increased to 80 mph without me seeing it?Unfortunately you were caught and decided to take the course. End of matter really.
14-7 said:
bobmalcs said:
During that time I was doing 79 or over for no more than 43 seconds.
So all legal.
You seem to contradict yourself So all legal.
. Unless the speed limit on motorways has increased to 80 mph without me seeing it?Unfortunately you were caught and decided to take the course. End of matter really.
REALIST123 said:
As has already been pointed out, that's not what he was saying. He is referring to the process of prosecution being based on legalities and having nothing to do with safety, justice etc.
But he does state that the other 23 people hadn't a clue about basics so they probably learnt something that day from being caught speeding so it is about education and safety.Not saying I agree with it though.
So to boil your post right down, you broke the law and got caught, but it's not fair because you don't agree with the law, and other drivers who also broke the law and got caught aren't as aware of the rules of the road as you are and were in dire need of some education?
Which is, just maybe, why the SACs exist?
I know, it's a radical thought.
Which is, just maybe, why the SACs exist?
I know, it's a radical thought.
charltjr said:
So to boil your post right down, you broke the law and got caught, but it's not fair because you don't agree with the law, and other drivers who also broke the law and got caught aren't as aware of the rules of the road as you are and were in dire need of some education?
Which is, just maybe, why the SACs exist?
I know, it's a radical thought.
Enjoy the storm with that thought....Which is, just maybe, why the SACs exist?
I know, it's a radical thought.
bobmalcs said:
My second NIP. The previous one was in 2006.
During that time I was doing 79 or over for no more than 43 seconds. The weather was clear, road dry, visibility for over a mile. Whole stream of cars doing more or less the same speed, all behaving reasonably. Saw no accidents or even close calls on the whole journey either in front or behind me.
So all legal.
Errr...no. Exceeding the limit for 43 seconds is not legal.During that time I was doing 79 or over for no more than 43 seconds. The weather was clear, road dry, visibility for over a mile. Whole stream of cars doing more or less the same speed, all behaving reasonably. Saw no accidents or even close calls on the whole journey either in front or behind me.
So all legal.
TwigtheWonderkid said:
bobmalcs said:
My second NIP. The previous one was in 2006.
During that time I was doing 79 or over for no more than 43 seconds. The weather was clear, road dry, visibility for over a mile. Whole stream of cars doing more or less the same speed, all behaving reasonably. Saw no accidents or even close calls on the whole journey either in front or behind me.
So all legal.
Errr...no. Exceeding the limit for 43 seconds is not legal.During that time I was doing 79 or over for no more than 43 seconds. The weather was clear, road dry, visibility for over a mile. Whole stream of cars doing more or less the same speed, all behaving reasonably. Saw no accidents or even close calls on the whole journey either in front or behind me.
So all legal.
TwigtheWonderkid said:
bobmalcs said:
My second NIP. The previous one was in 2006.
During that time I was doing 79 or over for no more than 43 seconds. The weather was clear, road dry, visibility for over a mile. Whole stream of cars doing more or less the same speed, all behaving reasonably. Saw no accidents or even close calls on the whole journey either in front or behind me.
So all legal.
Errr...no. Exceeding the limit for 43 seconds is not legal.During that time I was doing 79 or over for no more than 43 seconds. The weather was clear, road dry, visibility for over a mile. Whole stream of cars doing more or less the same speed, all behaving reasonably. Saw no accidents or even close calls on the whole journey either in front or behind me.
So all legal.
14 posts 132 months. Just saying.
Stickyfinger said:
Enjoy the storm with that thought....
I know, I may as well have said Hitler was right, Katie Hopkins isn't that bad, or why don't cyclists have to pay road tax 
I do think it's an odd thing though, other drivers need educating or not obeying the rules is one of the biggest whinges on most motoring forums, yet when people are caught not obeying the rules and get the option to be educated not punished that's a bad thing?
Yeah I know speed is the soft target for enforcement, but the OPs experience in common with almost all the feedback I've heard about SAC attendees is that the people who go on them tend to not have the first clue about driving.
Avoiding getting caught speeding doesn't seem that hard to me, so maybe it's actually quite a good way of picking people who could do with some education?
When I went in surrey there were loads of throwaway one liners that stood no questioning, just myth and daftness.
Pebbles167 said:
bobmalcs said:
One interesting point though. It was stated that Wales is starting to impose a no tolerance policy. They have seen drivers booked for 31 or 32 in a 30 and 41 or 42 in a 40.
Sounds like a case of scaremongering to me. Dont see how they could enforce it. Also, their argument that a modern speedo is super accurate is crap. They're not.Gassing Station | Speed, Plod & the Law | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff