Sold a Car that has broken down HELP ASAP
Discussion
IntriguedUser said:
DanielJames said:
Thanks for the replies all.
I just stayed with the lad whilst the recovery came. I offered him £250 back to cover the recovery and inspection etc but he refused and said he wants to get it looked over by a professional first.
I'm worried he might be taking it to a friend and get some bs engineering report done or something.
Can anyone link me to some reading I can do about this situation? Not that I don't trust the responses, but on Google I'm only finding links to other forum posts...
FFSI just stayed with the lad whilst the recovery came. I offered him £250 back to cover the recovery and inspection etc but he refused and said he wants to get it looked over by a professional first.
I'm worried he might be taking it to a friend and get some bs engineering report done or something.
Can anyone link me to some reading I can do about this situation? Not that I don't trust the responses, but on Google I'm only finding links to other forum posts...
Can you just read the thread and all the replies and take our advise, tell him its not your problem, now jog on mate!
Doesn't matter if the engineers report shows up 10,000 issues, he saw the car and presumably test drove it with a working engine, anything after that is his problem.....
I would urge a little caution here.
All the posts saying that in a private sale caveat emptor applies are correct and it is also true that he has no right to reject the car because it wasn't fit for purpose/satisfactory quality (the usual grounds on which goods are rejected when buying from somebody acting in the course of business).
But that is not what the buyer is alleging. He says you made misrepresentations, which is a separate cause of action and does apply to private sales. Representations aren't limited to eg what was written in the advert as has been implied above, it could be any statement that was made that didn't become part of the contract but induced him to enter it.
Having said that, I think he's probably just clutching a straws after breaking the thing/being super unlucky. Or perhaps a scam. There's certainly logic in not corresponding with him until getting some indication that he's actually going to pursue it. But you might decide to try to put it to bed would be to reply with something like:
'It is unfortunate that a problem developed after the sale of the car to you. However, I cannot respond to vague allegations of misrepresentation, as found in your letter of ........... . If you provide particulars of the alleged misrepresentation(s), I will consider responding.
For the avoidance of doubt, I deny making any misrepresentation.'
The idea here is that (assuming you did not say anything that was untrue/misleading) he won't be able to provide any such particulars and will realise that he has nothing to pursue.
All the posts saying that in a private sale caveat emptor applies are correct and it is also true that he has no right to reject the car because it wasn't fit for purpose/satisfactory quality (the usual grounds on which goods are rejected when buying from somebody acting in the course of business).
But that is not what the buyer is alleging. He says you made misrepresentations, which is a separate cause of action and does apply to private sales. Representations aren't limited to eg what was written in the advert as has been implied above, it could be any statement that was made that didn't become part of the contract but induced him to enter it.
Having said that, I think he's probably just clutching a straws after breaking the thing/being super unlucky. Or perhaps a scam. There's certainly logic in not corresponding with him until getting some indication that he's actually going to pursue it. But you might decide to try to put it to bed would be to reply with something like:
'It is unfortunate that a problem developed after the sale of the car to you. However, I cannot respond to vague allegations of misrepresentation, as found in your letter of ........... . If you provide particulars of the alleged misrepresentation(s), I will consider responding.
For the avoidance of doubt, I deny making any misrepresentation.'
The idea here is that (assuming you did not say anything that was untrue/misleading) he won't be able to provide any such particulars and will realise that he has nothing to pursue.
MrBarry123 said:
His one and only aim here is to be refunded his money and return to you a faulty car.
That's a pretty crap scam. Waste all weekend looking at cars, then get a refund and give the car back - that'll learn 'em! Probably more like trying to get a significantly discounted car with threats of legal action and thanks to a network of friends who pose as engineers etc.
22 said:
That's a pretty crap scam. Waste all weekend looking at cars, then get a refund and give the car back - that'll learn 'em!
Probably more like trying to get a significantly discounted car with threats of legal action and thanks to a network of friends who pose as engineers etc.
sounds to me like the buyer is misguided and genuinely thinks he has a case against the OPProbably more like trying to get a significantly discounted car with threats of legal action and thanks to a network of friends who pose as engineers etc.
There are any number of threads on PH covering exactly this. Can I suggest you do a 'Search' as some IIRC have advice from legally qualified PHers.
As said many times, providing this is a private sale, you are not a trader, not a qualified motor engineer and have not misrepresented the condition of the car in any way - what does your ad say & have you kept a copy? - then it is his problem & he can rant & threaten as much as he likes. Entering into any further communication with him is pointless.
As said many times, providing this is a private sale, you are not a trader, not a qualified motor engineer and have not misrepresented the condition of the car in any way - what does your ad say & have you kept a copy? - then it is his problem & he can rant & threaten as much as he likes. Entering into any further communication with him is pointless.
Just a cautionary thought here Dan, you say you only kept the car for a month, do you change cars often?
If so, is there any danger that the buyer could "out you" as a part time motor trader, even if this is not the case?
IIRC you don't even have to make a profit on the cars, just buy and sell more than 6 per year to be defined as a trader, by the taxman at least, maybe not in law, someone better qualified than myself will hopefully be along to enlighten us.
OTOH a friend bought a car which was misrepresented WRT service history, it blew up on the way home, he took the matter to court and despite having what looked like a cast iron case was totally unsuccessful.
PS, do we know yet what the cause of the alleged knocking noise is yet?
If so, is there any danger that the buyer could "out you" as a part time motor trader, even if this is not the case?
IIRC you don't even have to make a profit on the cars, just buy and sell more than 6 per year to be defined as a trader, by the taxman at least, maybe not in law, someone better qualified than myself will hopefully be along to enlighten us.
OTOH a friend bought a car which was misrepresented WRT service history, it blew up on the way home, he took the matter to court and despite having what looked like a cast iron case was totally unsuccessful.
PS, do we know yet what the cause of the alleged knocking noise is yet?
Thanks for the replies all.
To clarify on the price , the advertised price was £6500, he offered £6k and we met in the middle. As consolation I offered him the £250 back meaning he would have got the car for £6k.
I know there wasn't any obligation to do that but I didn't think he was trying it on and genuinely felt bad for the guy. The car owed me £6k anyway so I didn't feel bad about giving him back the "profit".
I got the call at about 7pm, went down to the KFC they were stranded at (about an hour and half from Manchester btw), and stayed until around 10pm to try and find a conclusion to the problem.
I thought I was more than reasonable but as soon as we left (on a handshake) the email was sent stating he rejected it.
I'll not respond to the email.
Thanks for the replies.
To clarify on the price , the advertised price was £6500, he offered £6k and we met in the middle. As consolation I offered him the £250 back meaning he would have got the car for £6k.
I know there wasn't any obligation to do that but I didn't think he was trying it on and genuinely felt bad for the guy. The car owed me £6k anyway so I didn't feel bad about giving him back the "profit".
I got the call at about 7pm, went down to the KFC they were stranded at (about an hour and half from Manchester btw), and stayed until around 10pm to try and find a conclusion to the problem.
I thought I was more than reasonable but as soon as we left (on a handshake) the email was sent stating he rejected it.
I'll not respond to the email.
Thanks for the replies.
Normal people (i.e. not legally trained) don't write letters like that so if that arrived literally as soon as you left then something doesn't quite smell right.
That said, if there's a scam here, assuming the car doesn't actually work, I'm not sure quite what the scam is?
Also can you break an S2000 engine on demand? I thought those things were suppose to have failure counts in the single figures or some such mind boggling stat?
That said, if there's a scam here, assuming the car doesn't actually work, I'm not sure quite what the scam is?
Also can you break an S2000 engine on demand? I thought those things were suppose to have failure counts in the single figures or some such mind boggling stat?
b
hstewie said:
hstewie said: Also can you break an S2000 engine on demand? I thought those things were suppose to have failure counts in the single figures or some such mind boggling stat?
It's a very reliable engine. However, I should suspect that downshifting into a low gear from a very high one would probably rev it to death.To the OP - the buyer knows a little bit, which is why he's claiming misrepresentation rather than defective goods. You will need to show good faith - Munich and back is good evidence so if you have any proof of the car in Munich that would be handy.
Added to that you need to make sure you can't be accused of being a dealer. How many cars have you bought and sold this year, and how much profit did you make on them? More importantly, is it possible to work out all of that from social media and forum postings that can be easily tracked back to you?
I could prove the car was in Munich as we parked in the hotel car park and have the reg. Also have the ferry crossing information that proves it went overseas.
I don't see that I could be said to be a dealer. I have all time job but have had a few cars this year out of a hobby more than anything. Never to make any profit.
This is the advert that he is claiming misrepresentation from:
http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/h...
I don't see that I could be said to be a dealer. I have all time job but have had a few cars this year out of a hobby more than anything. Never to make any profit.
This is the advert that he is claiming misrepresentation from:
http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/h...
DanielJames said:
This is the advert that he is claiming misrepresentation from:
http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/h...
FWIW you're the sort of person I'd want to buy a car from going from that advert.http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/h...
The whole things is very strange.
Thanks - I do usually enjoy the process of selling a car but this has been a nightmare.
I sold my 330i to a chap on here back in May and the whole thing was a pleasure. Then again, it didn't break down on the way home.
As its bank holiday Sunday i think I had better go to the Winchester, grab a pint, and wait for this thing to blow over.
I sold my 330i to a chap on here back in May and the whole thing was a pleasure. Then again, it didn't break down on the way home.
As its bank holiday Sunday i think I had better go to the Winchester, grab a pint, and wait for this thing to blow over.
If the guy who bought your car was genuine he would have either accepted the £250 or would have demanded his money back but instead he rejected the £250 because he wants more money from you.
Your problem is that you have already offered him money and he thinks you are a weak person and will take advantage of that.What he will do next is say he has an engine report with lots of problems with the car and you misrepresented it in your advert.He wants the car so will not ask for his money back but demand you give him a refund of between 1k and 2k so he scams you to get a £6 car for hopefully £4 from his point of view.He will try to frighten you will legal action to agree to the refund he wants.
Only you know if the advert was correct and factual and if that is the case do not reply to him at all and he will go away.
Edited to say I have just seen your advert and cannot see the buyer having an issue with it.
Your problem is that you have already offered him money and he thinks you are a weak person and will take advantage of that.What he will do next is say he has an engine report with lots of problems with the car and you misrepresented it in your advert.He wants the car so will not ask for his money back but demand you give him a refund of between 1k and 2k so he scams you to get a £6 car for hopefully £4 from his point of view.He will try to frighten you will legal action to agree to the refund he wants.
Only you know if the advert was correct and factual and if that is the case do not reply to him at all and he will go away.
Edited to say I have just seen your advert and cannot see the buyer having an issue with it.
Edited by btcc123 on Sunday 30th August 12:33
Gassing Station | Speed, Plod & the Law | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff