Won an Ebay auction, seller never sent off V5C/2
Discussion
akirk said:
No Bend said:
MoggieMinor said:
V5 isn't proof of ownership. It just shows who is responsible for licencing the vehicle.
Ok, my question is how do you prove ownership of a vehicle? You'd want something to show that the person who you are about to hand a wad of money over to has the ability to sell you the car lawfully.In reality - good luck
In practice - checking for HPI / reported as stolen etc. is the only option...
if the previous owner's details are on the V5, contact them for confirmation...
Here's a scenario -
A crook knows of a car owner who'll be uncontactable for a couple of weeks. Breaks into his house, steals the car keys, finds the V5 in the car.
Sells the car to an eager person off gumtree or wherever. Buyer does checks, hasn't been reported stolen, HPI clear and the V5 has the 'previous to sellers' details on it.
Buyer takes the car, hands over the cash. Owner returns later and reports it stolen. Where does that leave the buyer?
R8Steve said:
Hi said:
You can now complete the logbook online, so why not do that at the sellers house? You need the reference number from the latest V5c, which by the sounds of it the seller has that document, just not with his details on. If you do it online in front of the seller then you can make sure the correct date is put on there, plus you get an email receipt to confirm.
How do you do this? I've never heard of being able to apply for a logbook or transfer one online.Type 'change of owner' into google and it's the second link that comes up. Or just follow this link: https://www.gov.uk/sold-bought-vehicle
It's a great service, I used it the other day when I sold a vehicle, much easier as DVLA know straight away, I don't have to post anything off and they can't claim they haven't received it as I have an email receipt confirming that I no longer own the vehicle.
No Bend said:
Thats a system that's open to shonky business isn't it?
Here's a scenario -
A crook knows of a car owner who'll be uncontactable for a couple of weeks. Breaks into his house, steals the car keys, finds the V5 in the car.
Sells the car to an eager person off gumtree or wherever. Buyer does checks, hasn't been reported stolen, HPI clear and the V5 has the 'previous to sellers' details on it.
Buyer takes the car, hands over the cash. Owner returns later and reports it stolen. Where does that leave the buyer?
In the infinitesimally small chance of that actually happening i.e. a crook knowing someone who will be away for weeks leaving the house unattended, then to know when to break in to not raise the alarm from neighbours etc. then to find the keys, and find the V5/be lucky enough that the V5 is in the car, then to find someone willing to buy in the short space of time that the owner is away, and for the buyer to be available to complete the transaction before the owner comes home, and to not be spotted by the neighbours trying to sell the car in broad daylight....Here's a scenario -
A crook knows of a car owner who'll be uncontactable for a couple of weeks. Breaks into his house, steals the car keys, finds the V5 in the car.
Sells the car to an eager person off gumtree or wherever. Buyer does checks, hasn't been reported stolen, HPI clear and the V5 has the 'previous to sellers' details on it.
Buyer takes the car, hands over the cash. Owner returns later and reports it stolen. Where does that leave the buyer?
I'd want to buy a car/bike from the owner's home address, i'd like to think it'd be pretty obvious that the house i was at did not belong to the person selling the vehicle, alarm bells would ring and i'd walk away from the transaction.
No Bend said:
Vixpy1 said:
V5C has absolutely no bearing on ownership, I've bought numerous cars which are still in the previous keepers name because the seller is flipping the car. It keeps the number of owners down on the V5
How do you prove ownership of the car if the name isn't on the V5?
No Bend said:
Thats a system that's open to shonky business isn't it?
Here's a scenario -
A crook knows of a car owner who'll be uncontactable for a couple of weeks. Breaks into his house, steals the car keys, finds the V5 in the car.
Sells the car to an eager person off gumtree or wherever. Buyer does checks, hasn't been reported stolen, HPI clear and the V5 has the 'previous to sellers' details on it.
Buyer takes the car, hands over the cash. Owner returns later and reports it stolen. Where does that leave the buyer?
I've tried ringing the seller and its just gone through to voicemail, left him a message too that he has read but hasn't replied too. I said if he registers the car to himself then I'll happily sign a new V5 if its register to him and his address. Here's a scenario -
A crook knows of a car owner who'll be uncontactable for a couple of weeks. Breaks into his house, steals the car keys, finds the V5 in the car.
Sells the car to an eager person off gumtree or wherever. Buyer does checks, hasn't been reported stolen, HPI clear and the V5 has the 'previous to sellers' details on it.
Buyer takes the car, hands over the cash. Owner returns later and reports it stolen. Where does that leave the buyer?
I'm not too bothered about the extra owner. I'd rather have 1 more owner and a proper paper trail than a scribbled out V5, Cash on collection and a few messages.
He could be genuine but we all know its just as viable there's something wrong and unless I buy it there will be a massive gamble involved that could end up paying for the car twice over in either repairs or fines/payments
Vixpy1 said:
No Bend said:
Vixpy1 said:
V5C has absolutely no bearing on ownership, I've bought numerous cars which are still in the previous keepers name because the seller is flipping the car. It keeps the number of owners down on the V5
How do you prove ownership of the car if the name isn't on the V5?I could write myself a receipt for any car, how would you know it was real?
This thread once again shows that a surprising number of people do not appreciate that a V5C is NOT PROOF OF OWNERSHIP.
Those who think that a V5C is proof of ownership, please have a look at this picture and see if you can spot the tiny, obscure, not at all noticeable hidden clue. Hint: It's the big writing at the top, FFS:
Ownership is proven by sufficient evidence, and evidence varies from someone saying (truthfully) "I own this car" to a bundle of documents indicative of ownership. The V5C is not such a document. As noted above, people flipping cars often have the V5C showing someone else's name. This may be a sign that the seller is a trader posing as a private seller. I would not let that stop me buying if I was otherwise happy with the proposed purchase (I have indeed bought from such a person, and deduced that he was a trader from the first phone call), but proceed with caution.
Those who think that a V5C is proof of ownership, please have a look at this picture and see if you can spot the tiny, obscure, not at all noticeable hidden clue. Hint: It's the big writing at the top, FFS:
Ownership is proven by sufficient evidence, and evidence varies from someone saying (truthfully) "I own this car" to a bundle of documents indicative of ownership. The V5C is not such a document. As noted above, people flipping cars often have the V5C showing someone else's name. This may be a sign that the seller is a trader posing as a private seller. I would not let that stop me buying if I was otherwise happy with the proposed purchase (I have indeed bought from such a person, and deduced that he was a trader from the first phone call), but proceed with caution.
Edited by anonymous-user on Tuesday 1st September 13:53
Breadvan72 said:
This thread once again shows that a surprising number of people do not appreciate that a V5C is NOT PROOF OF OWNERSHIP.
Those who think that a V5C is proof of ownership, please have a look at this picture and see if you can spot the tiny, obscure, not at all noticeable hidden clue. Hint: It's the big writing at the top, FFS:
Sorry, I can't quite see what you are referring to Those who think that a V5C is proof of ownership, please have a look at this picture and see if you can spot the tiny, obscure, not at all noticeable hidden clue. Hint: It's the big writing at the top, FFS:
No, a V5 isn't proof of ownership, but I wouldn't buy a car through a private sale without one from the address from which I was purchasing the car.
It's all part of a picture you build up of the seller.
If a trader isn't up front straight away then i'd walk.
You accumulate the available information about a seller and a car and make a judgment. If a trader poses as a private seller that is a bad thing, but it does not always follow that the car will be a dud. Also, an honest person may have a legit reason for not being the registered keeper. The person may have inherited the car, or been given it by someone to sell. If things feel iffy, walk away.
Some people (I think foolishly) care about how many keepers a car has had and don't change keepers when they should. Several recorded keepers may not mean much. For example, the car I bought from the trader had had four keepers but only two owners, and those two were a company and the company's main shareholder, so in other words it was pretty much a one owner car.
Some people (I think foolishly) care about how many keepers a car has had and don't change keepers when they should. Several recorded keepers may not mean much. For example, the car I bought from the trader had had four keepers but only two owners, and those two were a company and the company's main shareholder, so in other words it was pretty much a one owner car.
AlexMG said:
After finding a car on ebay and making a bid on my phone while out at the weekend things have gone a bit pear shaped with the seller.
The seller never actually sent off the V5C/2 so the current V5 is in the previous owners name with the V5C/2 filled in.
His solution to this was to just tip ex over it with my details when sending it off.
There is something very wrong here. With a private sale, the seller of a car is responsible for sending the V5C to the DVLA (assuming the online facility has not been used). The V5C/2 should never be 'sent off' anywhere by the seller, but handed over to the buyer. The latter should keep it safe until he/she receives the new V5C in his/her name. It follows that if the car is still registered to the previous owner, either the V5C was never sent by him/her to the DVLA or it has been lost (by RM or DVLA: most likely the latter). The seller never actually sent off the V5C/2 so the current V5 is in the previous owners name with the V5C/2 filled in.
His solution to this was to just tip ex over it with my details when sending it off.
However if the person you are buying from is a trader then he will legitimately have the V5C. The previous owner should have notified a disposal to the trade by sending the yellow V5C/3 to the DVLA. You need to find out what the true situation is here. A maxim which has serve me well is: if there is anything doubtful and/or due process hasn't been followed, be prepared to walk away. Avoid getting involved with other people's
-ups.No Bend said:
Thats a system that's open to shonky business isn't it?
How do you "prove ownership" of _anything_, except for land/houses? They're about the only tangible asset that there's any kind of central OWNERSHIP register for.Anyway, the V5C/2 never gets sent off. The V5C itself is the bit that's sent off.
Hi said:
It's a new service, which doesn't seem to have been publicised very well.
Type 'change of owner' into google and it's the second link that comes up. Or just follow this link: https://www.gov.uk/sold-bought-vehicle
It's a great service, I used it the other day when I sold a vehicle, much easier as DVLA know straight away, I don't have to post anything off and they can't claim they haven't received it as I have an email receipt confirming that I no longer own the vehicle.
That looks useful, however with my cynical head on it means they know the exact time the tax is cancelled so no leeway due to postage to get the car home and tax at the start of the next month. Type 'change of owner' into google and it's the second link that comes up. Or just follow this link: https://www.gov.uk/sold-bought-vehicle
It's a great service, I used it the other day when I sold a vehicle, much easier as DVLA know straight away, I don't have to post anything off and they can't claim they haven't received it as I have an email receipt confirming that I no longer own the vehicle.
On the positive side clear demarcation of any traffic offences committed for both parties.
No Bend said:
akirk said:
No Bend said:
MoggieMinor said:
V5 isn't proof of ownership. It just shows who is responsible for licencing the vehicle.
Ok, my question is how do you prove ownership of a vehicle? You'd want something to show that the person who you are about to hand a wad of money over to has the ability to sell you the car lawfully.In reality - good luck
In practice - checking for HPI / reported as stolen etc. is the only option...
if the previous owner's details are on the V5, contact them for confirmation...
Here's a scenario -
A crook knows of a car owner who'll be uncontactable for a couple of weeks. Breaks into his house, steals the car keys, finds the V5 in the car.
Sells the car to an eager person off gumtree or wherever. Buyer does checks, hasn't been reported stolen, HPI clear and the V5 has the 'previous to sellers' details on it.
Buyer takes the car, hands over the cash. Owner returns later and reports it stolen. Where does that leave the buyer?
the police might be asking them why they didn't match up person selling / v5 / address from which the car was sold / etc. etc.
The V5C/2 (green slip) is never sent anywhere - it's given to the new owner as an interim means to tax a car whilst the rest of the V5 is processed at DVLA
It's very common for scrotey driveway trader types to pass cars amongst themselves "just has the green slip innit" with no indication of who it's actually registered to
The only way to properly resolve that is to apply for a V5 using a V62 - and filling in the V5/C with your details to save the £25 admin fee isn't recommended since the V5 it is from has probably already been processed.
This type of fkwittery is much more common with the new tax law with scrotes leaving cars "taxed" while they change hands and never actually processing the paperwork properly.
Walk away.
It's very common for scrotey driveway trader types to pass cars amongst themselves "just has the green slip innit" with no indication of who it's actually registered to
The only way to properly resolve that is to apply for a V5 using a V62 - and filling in the V5/C with your details to save the £25 admin fee isn't recommended since the V5 it is from has probably already been processed.
This type of f
kwittery is much more common with the new tax law with scrotes leaving cars "taxed" while they change hands and never actually processing the paperwork properly.Walk away.
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