Can insurers make you let them see your e-license?

[agtlaw]

photosnob said:

LoonR1 said:

This is getting murkier. You can not be banned for speeding, it's a 3-6 point penalty range as I understand it (could be wrong). What were you found guilty of?

You don't get points and a ban either.

You can. I was found guilty of speeding. It was SP30 and a ban. I didn't get points as well.

Loon, this is true. Speeding carries a ban of any length (not 'up to 56 days' as some internet 'experts' would have you believe) or otherwise 3-6 penalty points. Very unusual to get a retest for anyone other than a 'new driver', and _from memory_ the court only has the power to order an extended retest for an offence carrying a mandatory disqualification. I'll have to check this. Certainly haven't seen it happen in any discretionary disqualification case of mine.

[Rtype]

Clutching at straws here Photosnb.

[photosnob]

LoonR1 said:

You mentioned "points that you don't have to declare".

How did you get banned for an SP30? It's not possible, other than it being a totting up ban, but they couldn't order a retest for that. You couldn't be in the first two years of your licence (even if you were a kid) either, as you say that you passed your first test in 2007 and this happened in 2012.

You're not telling the truth here. Why should we believe the rest of your story?

Yes loon - because between my passing my test and getting banned I got some points. I can assure you that you can be banned for SP30. If you can't please send me the evidence as the magistrates made a mistake.

[Durzel]

LoonR1 said:

How did you get banned for an SP30? It's not possible, other than it being a totting up ban, but they couldn't order a retest for that.

You can get a discretionary disqualification for a grossly excessive speed that is still prosecuted as a SP30.

edit: beaten

[LoonR1]

photosnob said:

LoonR1 said:

I'm starting to get confused now. What does your plastic card say? That's your licence.

Show me the FOS link to the section you reference. I'm really interested in the comment about claiming the rest from the price comparison website.

Card has the date of first test. This is the current one. Same issue number as the online thing. The back of the card gives the date I gave.

http://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/publications...

The date may be OK then, although I'd be surprised. Is this an old card that you've somehow held onto? I used to have two copies of my paper licence back in the day for exactly that reason

Where am I looking on that link? If it's the Intermediary pice, then you're pissing in the wind. That's for advised broker sales, not you buying directly via the Internet. Price comparison websites offer no advice and have no liability for your chosen purchase.

[Devil2575]

jbsportstech said:

As part of my admiral claim this month both myself and her indoors (named driver)had to do conference calls with the Admiral/DVLA to confirm what endorsements if any were shown prior to them even discussing payout figures.

I had to do the same last time I was involved in a claim.

[LoonR1]

agtlaw said:

Loon, this is true. Speeding carries a ban of any length (not 'up to 56 days' as some internet 'experts' would have you believe) or otherwise 3-6 penalty points. Very unusual to get a retest for anyone other than a 'new driver', and _from memory_ the court only has the power to order an extended retest for an offence carrying a mandatory disqualification. I'll have to check this. Certainly haven't seen it happen in any discretionary disqualification case of mine.

That's fine and I stand corrected. Glad you share my concerns though over the whole retest piece as well. It's good to know that even with your experience you can't remember this happening.

[LoonR1]

Durzel said:

LoonR1 said:

How did you get banned for an SP30? It's not possible, other than it being a totting up ban, but they couldn't order a retest for that.

You can get a discretionary disqualification for a grossly excessive speed that is still prosecuted as a SP30.

edit: beaten

Hence why I said I stood to be corrected, the retest seems extremely unlikely though and that's on top of the SP30 ban being extremely unlikely too.

[Durzel]

photosnob said:

For the sake of pedantic. Utmost good faith is no longer relevant.

"On 6 April 2013, the Consumer Insurance (Disclosure and Representations) Act 2012 (referred to as "the Act" in this note) came into force. The Act says that the consumer's duty is to "take reasonable care not to make a misrepresentation" - replacing the previous duty to disclose all necessary information."

http://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/publications...

Good info, I stand corrected.

photosnob said:

Either way I feel I was acting in utmost good faith. I answered the questions asked. I didn't read any small print. Which was my fault. That could maybe come back to haunt me. I'll see.

I don't know, "current licence" is unambiguous. The inception of your "current licence" began in 2012.

Notwithstanding that I think the fact you'd rather they not look at your e-licence to verify dates (and by implication potentially find a reason to decline cover) speak volumes really about the good faith arrangement.

[Durzel]

LoonR1 said:

Hence why I said I stood to be corrected, the retest seems extremely unlikely though and that's on top of the SP30 ban being extremely unlikely too.

I'm being pedantic now Why would it be extremely unlikely to get a straight ban for a grossly excessive speed? Doing 90 in a 30, for example, would see you with a straight ban all day long - in the absence of anything else besides just the speed making it qualify for careless or dangerous (unless that's the point you're making?).

[Fatrat]

This thread made me look at my licence. I'm epileptic and a few years ago had to surrender my licence for 12 months after an epileptic incident

When my licence was returned the date on the back of the card shows the date I first passed my test not the date the licence was re-issued.

However from what the OP has said the question appears to be very specific and refer to current licence and as such that surely is the date he passed the second test

[LoonR1]

Durzel said:

LoonR1 said:

Hence why I said I stood to be corrected, the retest seems extremely unlikely though and that's on top of the SP30 ban being extremely unlikely too.

I'm being pedantic now Why would it be extremely unlikely to get a straight ban for a grossly excessive speed? Doing 90 in a 30, for example, would see you with a straight ban all day long - in the absence of anything else besides just the speed making it qualify for careless or dangerous (unless that's the point you're making?).

See agtlaw's comment on this. It does happen, I accept that in extremely rare circumstances. Maybe your definition of extremely rare differs from mine, but I doubt that many of the 100,000s of SP30s dished out in any given year result in a ban. I doubt many of those that end in a ban end up with a retest ordered too. The fact that agtlaw's can't remember one, does cover that, as I think he will be involved in a lot of the speeding offences where the speed was high.

Would the police / CPS pursue an SP30, or would they more likely go for a DWDCA or something else that is more likely to attract a ban (and retest) when / if proven.

[Rtype]

Hmm, outside of my knowledge, but apart from the Mandatory retest AGT mentioned above, is it possible this SP30 ban & retest could be applied if there was a "Dangerous Driving" conviction alongside it? It appears OP hasn't been entirely honest with us and, based on his other thread, this seems plausible?

[agtlaw]

OP said he did a longer (extended?) retest. I've now refreshed my memory - an extended retest can only be ordered where there is a mandatory disqualification for manslaughter, death by dangerous, death by careless whilst under the influence, or dangerous driving; see s.36 RTOA 1988.

[photosnob]

agtlaw said:

OP said he did a longer (extended?) retest. I've now refreshed my memory - an extended retest can only be ordered where there is a mandatory disqualification for manslaughter, death by dangerous, death by careless whilst under the influence, or dangerous driving; see s.36 RTOA 1988.

Gonna look up my docs and see what it was then. I'll come back with anything I have. I'm pretty sure I was not wrong. But if I was I'll admit as much.

[toddygti]

LoonR1 said:

You mentioned "points that you don't have to declare".

How did you get banned for an SP30? It's not possible, other than it being a totting up ban, but they couldn't order a retest for that.

Edited by LoonR1 on Wednesday 23 September 12:31

To clarify - SP30 Exceeding Statutory Speed Limit n a Public Road (Non-Motorway)

If you are caught at more than 30mph over the posted limit then you're are highly likely to receive an SP30 (SP50 Motorway Offences) and be disqualified from driving instead of receiving points. The offence and the conditions surrounding a factors are taken into consideration by the Magistrate at the hearing.

EFA

Edited by toddygti on Wednesday 23 September 13:56

[LoonR1]

toddygti said:

LoonR1 said:

You mentioned "points that you don't have to declare".

How did you get banned for an SP30? It's not possible, other than it being a totting up ban, but they couldn't order a retest for that.

Edited by LoonR1 on Wednesday 23 September 12:31

To clarify - SP30 Exceeding Statutory Speed Limit n a Public Road (Non-Motorway)

If you are caught at more than 30mph over the posted limit then you're are highly likely to receive an SP30 (SP50 Motorway Offences) and be disqualified from driving instead of receiving points. The offence and the conditions surrounding a factors are taken into consideration by the Magistrate at the hearing.

EFA

Edited by toddygti on Wednesday 23 September 13:56

We've already done this discussion. Along with the issue around the retest and that being extended. However, if you have information on SP30s and extended retests then that might add some value.

[photosnob]

I've got some serious back peddling to do... Firstly I am not going to ignore AGT. When I get home I'll go into the loft and try and pull out any documents I have from the time.

But - err my reading skills are about as good as my spelling in the title. The license did not start on the day I passed my test again. It started from when I applied for a provisional LGV... But even the online form shows I've had a driving license since 2007. In short I've read the License Valid From date - and worked out something very wrong... So the online form shows I've had a driving license since January 2007.

I've checked my online forms with my insurer. And it only says three years plus under license held for. So I don't think this will be a problem.

I still have to show how I achieved the impossible and got banned for an SP30 - all I know is that I was banned. I had to redo both the theory and the driving part. If that is incorrect then I was a fool at the time for not challenging it.

Loon - I'm only going to say this again as you didn't like it. But your not a bad bloke. I'm sure in person we'd be able to have 241 cocktails at the slug and lettuce and be the very best of friends. We could vape our ecigs and have a ball. Then you could take me out on your motorbike and show me a good time .

[LoonR1]

So all this is moot anyway as your test pass in 2012 covers the 3+ years criteria of your current insurers? If so happy days.

I don't drink cocktails, wouldn't be seen dead in a Slug & Lettuce, don't vape or smoke anymore and my bike has no pillion seat and isn't insured for pillions. Other than that we're all good

[photosnob]

LoonR1 said:

So all this is moot anyway as your test pass in 2012 covers the 3+ years criteria of your current insurers? If so happy days.

I don't drink cocktails, wouldn't be seen dead in a Slug & Lettuce, don't vape or smoke anymore and my bike has no pillion seat and isn't insured for pillions. Other than that we're all good

Not sure. I'd have to look at what month in 2012 and what month I took it out. Don't know how picky they would be. But my documents all say 2007. So unless the insurer is going to say both me and DVLA are wrong. I can't see it being a drama.

But - it goes to show. Read your policy documents clearly. And then read the online forms carefully. Bet this becomes common though. The old paper documents were easy. The new online system had size 18 font saying licence valid from... And then only in the small print on a tab does it say when each part is valid from.

Tell you what - lets have a healthy salad at weatherspoons. We can then head to a track day and you can give me a tutorial on gears, and then let me lose on it. Don't worry I've got experience - I did nearly 4 weeks on southern thailand on a 125cc automatic. None of this insurance or licence nonsense over there.