Dog attacked by another dog - advice please
Discussion
As has already been said by the people that actually have a clue, Staffies are lovely dogs but unfortunately they are often owned by absolute t
ts to look 'well 'ard innit' so some of them turn out bad (the owners fault not the dogs). If the same person owned a golden retriever it would be as likely (or more) to end up nasty, the only trouble is Staffies are powerful dogs and when they do go wrong it is more dangerous than many.
Banning the breed is clearly not the answer though I'm not sure what is, issuing lifetime dog-owning bans to anyone convicted of any moronic/unpleasant offence be it littering or assault perhaps?
ts to look 'well 'ard innit' so some of them turn out bad (the owners fault not the dogs). If the same person owned a golden retriever it would be as likely (or more) to end up nasty, the only trouble is Staffies are powerful dogs and when they do go wrong it is more dangerous than many.Banning the breed is clearly not the answer though I'm not sure what is, issuing lifetime dog-owning bans to anyone convicted of any moronic/unpleasant offence be it littering or assault perhaps?
_dobbo_ said:
Devil2575 said:
In a significant proportion of reported in a local paper dog attack cases I have seen a Staffie has been involved. There's a report in the local paper typically once a week of a dog attack and more often than not it's a Staffie.
Possibly the local paper doesn't report every time a family Labrador bites someone? But does when it's a Staffie?Look up the stats, you're a man who likes to argue scientific method on other topics, why ignore it here and instead rely on what the sensationalist local rag says in order to support your preconceived idea of what the facts are?
Show me that stats. I've spent some time searching for them but can't find any that refer to the UK.
_dobbo_ said:
Devil2575 said:
I've lived in a house with a Staffie and if it had attacked me I'm not sure I could have fought it off. I took it out for walks and while it was ok with people it hated other dogs and given the chance it would have attacked them. No, it wasn't properly trained, but unless you can guarantee that an owner is going to train a dog like that is it really sensible to let people own animals that could clearly do substantial damage or even kill?
I lived in a house with a bloke. He was OK when on foot but in a car he was a liability. Is it really sensible to let people own a huge lump of metal that could do substantial damage or even kill?Edited by _dobbo_ on Monday 12th October 11:40
article said:
There were wide regional variations in hospital admissions for dog bites or attacks, with the highest rate in Merseyside (27 per 100,000 people) and the lowest in Kent and Medway (7.3 per 100,000), although these figures may reflect regional variations in dog ownership, according to the government’s Health and Social Care Information Centre (HSCIC).
The rate of admissions for dog bites was between two and three times as high for the most deprived areas (1,251 admissions, 24.4 per 100,000 population) as for the least deprived areas (448 admissions, 8.5 per 100,000).
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015/may/28/hos...The rate of admissions for dog bites was between two and three times as high for the most deprived areas (1,251 admissions, 24.4 per 100,000 population) as for the least deprived areas (448 admissions, 8.5 per 100,000).
It's not the dogs, it's the owners.
Thanks for the helpful advice so far, we'll see what the council do (I suspect based upon a single account, nothing, however it's good to log the matter).
The possible nephew (!) has been in touch and is most insistent that he will do everything he can to ensure that his aunt pays up. Both the GF and I have sympathy for the dog itself, as it will no doubt bear the brunt of the owner's displeasure.
Cheers,
Tom
The possible nephew (!) has been in touch and is most insistent that he will do everything he can to ensure that his aunt pays up. Both the GF and I have sympathy for the dog itself, as it will no doubt bear the brunt of the owner's displeasure.
Cheers,
Tom
Devil2575 said:
Jasandjules said:
velocefica said:
How Staff aren't a banned breed is ridiculous. At least 90% of dog attacks on other dogs or children/adults involves a Staffie.
You appear to suffer from a magnificent lack of knowledge in relation to this subject area. Perhaps some research is in order?It's partly because Staffys are 'nanny dogs'. They are protective of their pack, much more so than some other breeds. So they will defend their humans with less reason than some other breeds. It's not a bad thing, it just needs proper owners who understand & train them.
PS. We've got a rescue Staffy who used to try and eat everyone he met, we've had him three months now & he spends most of his life asleep on my lap - except when I've laid down & he sleeps with his head on my head.
Devil2575 said:
Possibly because when a Labrador bites someone they don't need plastic surgery to repair the damage?
Show me that stats. I've spent some time searching for them but can't find any that refer to the UK.
If it is the breed itself that is dangerous (as per your contention) then the source (as in country) of the stats surely doesn't matter, as the breed is the breed wherever you are.Show me that stats. I've spent some time searching for them but can't find any that refer to the UK.
Plenty of data out there about most aggressive/dangerous breeds. Staffies don't appear in the top ten anywhere.
Devil2575 said:
I've been bitten by a jack Russell sized dog and it didn't even break the skin.
It wasn't trying! I've seen the aftermath of where a Parsons Terrier got in to a field with some sheep. It caught one and ripped its throat out. A thick woolly neck would offer more protection than a bare hand would.Dogs communicate in different ways from humans. Consider a bite that didn't break the skin as being told to f*ck off. Whether it's a small Terrier or a Great Dane, a dog can do loads of damage if it tries.
Imagine you've been abducted by aliens and being kept as a pet. You don't speak the language, you don't know the rules. Every one of your natural instincts gets you shouted at. Welcome to the life of a dog!
People who don't train their dogs and don't do all they can to teach the dog what is acceptable, don't deserve to have a dog. I wish they'd bring in a basic competency test to dog ownership (and yes, I'd have failed first time around).
I've seen aggressive dogs that can't be near another dog, sit next to one after 20 minutes of work with the right trainer and right techniques. While some obedience classes are a good starting point, a lot of so called trainers I've met don't have a clue how to deal with the real-world problems dog owners discover themselves up against
_dobbo_ said:
Devil2575 said:
Possibly because when a Labrador bites someone they don't need plastic surgery to repair the damage?
Show me that stats. I've spent some time searching for them but can't find any that refer to the UK.
If it is the breed itself that is dangerous (as per your contention) then the source (as in country) of the stats surely doesn't matter, as the breed is the breed wherever you are.Show me that stats. I've spent some time searching for them but can't find any that refer to the UK.
Plenty of data out there about most aggressive/dangerous breeds. Staffies don't appear in the top ten anywhere.
http://www.wptv.com/news/region-c-palm-beach-count...
It's about a Labrador that savaged a child, child needs plastic surgery, but would have been a whole load worse if it wasn't for the pitbull that came and saved her by laying in to the Lab.
A dog regardless of breed can be dangerous!
_dobbo_ said:
Devil2575 said:
Possibly because when a Labrador bites someone they don't need plastic surgery to repair the damage?
Show me that stats. I've spent some time searching for them but can't find any that refer to the UK.
If it is the breed itself that is dangerous (as per your contention) then the source (as in country) of the stats surely doesn't matter, as the breed is the breed wherever you are.Show me that stats. I've spent some time searching for them but can't find any that refer to the UK.
Plenty of data out there about most aggressive/dangerous breeds. Staffies don't appear in the top ten anywhere.
The reason I was looking for UK stats is that it is more relevant to breeds typically kept in the UK. Thee is little point in reading about breeds that are banned in the UK or on the dangerous dogs list.
There is also some confusion as to what dogs they are refering, some websites talk about the American pit bull but others just refer to the pit bull which is a blanket term that covers several breeds including the Staffie.
This story from the independant says a lot.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/this-britain/...
Whether the breed is at fault or the owner doesn't change the fact that these dogs are frequently owned by a certain type of person and in their hands they become dangerous.
Edit: Just to add I have a big problem with poorly trained dogs of any breed.
Edited by Devil2575 on Monday 12th October 16:11
Devil2575 said:
I'm not going hunting for data. I had a reasonably good look around earlier, I couldn't find a single source that listed a Staffordshire Bull Terrier as either agressive or high up the list of dogs that are recorded as biting or attacking either other dogs or humans.Your nine year old article from the independant contains one story about a dog biting a person - it hardly represent either current, or useful information about "dangerous" dogs.
If you've decided that Staffies are dangerous based on something like that, you are no better than the climate change deniers you challenge on every thread where the topic comes up.
Edit: Sorry that last line reads as more combative than I intended. My intention was to appeal to you to ignore the hyperbole and press and take a viewpoint based on the information that is out there from owners and experts about these breeds.
Like all the crap about Staffies and their "locking jaws" - that sort of stuff is trotted out frequently - and is simply wrong.
Edited by _dobbo_ on Monday 12th October 16:53
If you read up on the RSPCA website, you will find Staffies number 5 on the list of best family dogs household pets, youll find it at number 100 on the dogs most suitable for guard dogs, a Staffie would be more likely to lick a burglar in to submission than bite them, youve never been kissed until youve been kissed by a Staffie, absolutely adorable little dogs when properly looked after they just want to please you and be close to you all the time.
_dobbo_ said:
I'm not going hunting for data. I had a reasonably good look around earlier, I couldn't find a single source that listed a Staffordshire Bull Terrier as either agressive or high up the list of dogs that are recorded as biting or attacking either other dogs or humans.
Your nine year old article from the independant contains one story about a dog biting a person - it hardly represent either current, or useful information about "dangerous" dogs.
If you've decided that Staffies are dangerous based on something like that, you are no better than the climate change deniers you challenge on every thread where the topic comes up.
Edit: Sorry that last line reads as more combative than I intended. My intention was to appeal to you to ignore the hyperbole and press and take a viewpoint based on the information that is out there from owners and experts about these breeds.
Like all the crap about Staffies and their "locking jaws" - that sort of stuff is trotted out frequently - and is simply wrong.
I take your point.Your nine year old article from the independant contains one story about a dog biting a person - it hardly represent either current, or useful information about "dangerous" dogs.
If you've decided that Staffies are dangerous based on something like that, you are no better than the climate change deniers you challenge on every thread where the topic comes up.
Edit: Sorry that last line reads as more combative than I intended. My intention was to appeal to you to ignore the hyperbole and press and take a viewpoint based on the information that is out there from owners and experts about these breeds.
Like all the crap about Staffies and their "locking jaws" - that sort of stuff is trotted out frequently - and is simply wrong.
Edited by _dobbo_ on Monday 12th October 16:53
darkyoung1000 said:
Both the GF and I have sympathy for the dog itself, as it will no doubt bear the brunt of the owner's displeasure.
I'm very glad to hear that. Do what you like to the owners or any other bipedal meatsacks who happen to fall into your orbit, but do your best to avoid it being one of these situations where the dog gets the blame/punishment.eldar said:
Having been attacked by a Jack Russell, I'd disagree. They are completely mental in attack mode and immune to pain.
In a seminar I attended recently, Terriers got a special mention. They are the only type of dog with absolutely zero selfPreservation gene. Other dogs know when it's time to give up as it can't sustain anymore damage and won't survive and should probably back down and run off.
A Terrier lacks this and won't back down!!
Autopilot said:
In a seminar I attended recently, Terriers got a special mention. They are the only type of dog with absolutely zero self
Preservation gene. Other dogs know when it's time to give up as it can't sustain anymore damage and won't survive and should probably back down and run off.
A Terrier lacks this and won't back down!!
Can't disagree with that! Preservation gene. Other dogs know when it's time to give up as it can't sustain anymore damage and won't survive and should probably back down and run off.
A Terrier lacks this and won't back down!!
eldar said:
Having been attacked by a Jack Russell, I'd disagree. They are completely mental in attack mode and immune to pain.
Incidentally, as the lucky chap who gets to wear a sleeve and get attacked by various sports and security dogs, ANY dog that goes in to fight drive is quite a spectacle!! Some of these dogs work in defence drive and most in prey drive, but every now and again you'll get a dog go from prey to fight drive and I can tell you it's rather scary!!! Their face and eyes look completely different, the bark changes pitch and I can only describe its enthusiasm to come and get the sleeve as a real brown trouser moment! It doesn't happen often, but when it does it makes you realise how dangerous any dog can be.
I've worked with a Belgian Shephard (with an IPO3 title) that goes in to Fight Drive quite regularly. It's about the size of a Collie and if it kicked off (it's a great natured dog and under excellent control so wouldn't!) no human would stand a chance against it.
As others have posted on here, any dog is a danger if not well trained.
We have a rescue staffie we got at 3 weeks old and he's an incredibly friendly and loyal dog.
Like all staffies he has a much stronger drive than a lot of breeds so we had to work him through training to build up to his drive and then get him listen to us to bring it back down so we can control him.
We also have a five month old baby (think of the children!) and the dog knows his place in the pack order and ever since we were expecting we've trained him by pulling his tail, putting out hands in his jaws and tugging his ears...all the things a baby/toddler would do to piss him off but by us doing it he knows he's not allowed to be bothered and we reduce (not eliminate - he is still an animal, like all dogs) the chances of him attacking our baby or anyone else for that matter.
Tldr - dogs are OK some owners are tts.
We have a rescue staffie we got at 3 weeks old and he's an incredibly friendly and loyal dog.
Like all staffies he has a much stronger drive than a lot of breeds so we had to work him through training to build up to his drive and then get him listen to us to bring it back down so we can control him.
We also have a five month old baby (think of the children!) and the dog knows his place in the pack order and ever since we were expecting we've trained him by pulling his tail, putting out hands in his jaws and tugging his ears...all the things a baby/toddler would do to piss him off but by us doing it he knows he's not allowed to be bothered and we reduce (not eliminate - he is still an animal, like all dogs) the chances of him attacking our baby or anyone else for that matter.
Tldr - dogs are OK some owners are t
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