Being sued over a car I sold :(
Discussion
Tyre Tread said:
You've made my day BV. I thought it was just me. I have experienced some bizarre judgements given in the small claims court. Mostly they were elicited by the Judge ignoring the facts and being overly influenced by the other parties bringing in emotional issues often related to supposed disabilities.
The only thing that is certain when you enter a courtroom is that the outcome is uncertain IME.
Yep. Only been to court once, and the only thing I can say is that the judge seemed to totally ignore the issues at hand and capitulated to emotional pleading by the opposition. The only thing that is certain when you enter a courtroom is that the outcome is uncertain IME.
You may think you have a cast-iron case, but once you are in court it is a lottery
boyse7en said:
Tyre Tread said:
You've made my day BV. I thought it was just me. I have experienced some bizarre judgements given in the small claims court. Mostly they were elicited by the Judge ignoring the facts and being overly influenced by the other parties bringing in emotional issues often related to supposed disabilities.
The only thing that is certain when you enter a courtroom is that the outcome is uncertain IME.
Yep. Only been to court once, and the only thing I can say is that the judge seemed to totally ignore the issues at hand and capitulated to emotional pleading by the opposition. The only thing that is certain when you enter a courtroom is that the outcome is uncertain IME.
You may think you have a cast-iron case, but once you are in court it is a lottery
Just had another look through the solicitors reference material and I know this has been touched on briefly with regards to the 'estimate' but...
Look at the date on the estimate for the pump and pin.
It's almost a month before any parts were actually purchased. So he's using that 'estimate' to try and say he bought a pump and pin, yet in his later invoice he bought the pin again apparently with his touch up stick.
So now the car apparently has a working tailgate which he wants you to pay for yet I'd be 99% certain it'd be the old pump still in place.
I wonder if the part number has been revised since the car was built? i.e. if it's possible to prove the pump has never been replaced.
Look at the date on the estimate for the pump and pin.
It's almost a month before any parts were actually purchased. So he's using that 'estimate' to try and say he bought a pump and pin, yet in his later invoice he bought the pin again apparently with his touch up stick.
So now the car apparently has a working tailgate which he wants you to pay for yet I'd be 99% certain it'd be the old pump still in place.
I wonder if the part number has been revised since the car was built? i.e. if it's possible to prove the pump has never been replaced.
schmunk said:
Breadvan72 said:
I missed the Nazi bunker thread, which is a pity as I find Nazi bunker threads to be simply the best thing on the internet. Exec summary, anyone?
Did you ever hear the story of the old, empty barn...?So it would be a good idea to buy one of those police interview recording machines and ensure that all pre-sale discussions and Q&A sessions are recorded, with each party getting a copy of the tape afterwards. Is there a sort of civilian caution that can be used to ensure that there is definitely no chance of comeback after that?
Arrrrgh, noooo. don't lawyerise life! I oppose the growth of dash cams, driveway CCTVs and tape recorders etc. Most people are to be trusted. Just deal in a straightforward way with people. write stuff down if important. No need to go around wearing legal armour.
There is no civil caution. There are no magic words. Nothing can stop some nutter having a pop at you, but deal honestly with others and you should usually be OK.
There is no civil caution. There are no magic words. Nothing can stop some nutter having a pop at you, but deal honestly with others and you should usually be OK.
Breadvan72 - I assume a decent barrister can "encourage" a judge to make the correct legal decision? By that I mean, something along the lines of stating "whilst Mr X makes a heart rendering emotional case, I am sure the respected Judge will agree with me in stating that he will make his decision on legal grounds and not emotional ones". i.e. "politely" reminding the judge to do his job properly 
Also, had the judge made a decision not on correct legal grounds, can that be appealed or referred in any way?
Also, had the judge made a decision not on correct legal grounds, can that be appealed or referred in any way?
Off topic, but judge related: -
I got knocked off my bike* as the result of a car turning left from the right hand lane in rush hour traffic, at fault driver blamed me, farcical court case where the driver at fault admitted it was all their fault. Judge said their insurance company had to pay after all for the damage to a car, but told me off for riding across a busy junction (i was in a cycle lane and I had even waited for the green light!).
I got knocked off my bike* as the result of a car turning left from the right hand lane in rush hour traffic, at fault driver blamed me, farcical court case where the driver at fault admitted it was all their fault. Judge said their insurance company had to pay after all for the damage to a car, but told me off for riding across a busy junction (i was in a cycle lane and I had even waited for the green light!).
- Adopts foetal position for cycling PH kicking...
james_tigerwoods said:
When will this be resolved - I keep checking back in... 
/irony
That is very much the question!/irony
I'll be keeping my eye on the post at least until Christmas.
I'm assuming there's no immediate timeline for proceeding to court from the original solicitors letter?
I however refuse to let it worry e further, it's done enough of that already. With the amazingly generous help from Breadvan I'm able to put it to the back of my mind and if he proceeds then he does so and there's little more I can reasonably do to prevent it.
I now instead await for him to claim for whiplash from the test drive...
Dracoro said:
Breadvan72 - I assume a decent barrister can "encourage" a judge to make the correct legal decision? By that I mean, something along the lines of stating "whilst Mr X makes a heart rendering emotional case, I am sure the respected Judge will agree with me in stating that he will make his decision on legal grounds and not emotional ones". i.e. "politely" reminding the judge to do his job properly
Also, had the judge made a decision not on correct legal grounds, can that be appealed or referred in any way?
(1) The art of the advocate (be that advocate barrister, solicitor or anyone else) is to make the decision maker feel intellectual discomfort at the prospect of finding against the position advanced by the advocate. Emotion shouldn't be a factor.Also, had the judge made a decision not on correct legal grounds, can that be appealed or referred in any way?
(2) You can appeal on issues of law and sometimes on issues of fact (depending on the type of court or tribunal in question). In many but not all situations you need the court that makes the decision or failing that the appellate court to give you permission to appeal. An appeal on a distinct point of law almost always has a better chance of success than an appeal on the facts.
Appeal courts manage to correct most errors, but sometimes an error persists all the way through the layers of appeal, and sometimes the first Judge gets it right but the appeal Judges get it wrong. The system is operated by humans, and is prone to error. It is hard to say what proportion of cases are finally decided rightly as opposed to wrongly. My own experience of many years in the civil courts is that the right answer is finally arrived at in something like eight out of ten cases. Others may have different experiences, and NB I am taking civil and not criminal. By the right answer I don't always mean the answer that my client wants, as they are not always the same thing. The trite proposition that law and justice have little in common is, in my experience, not true. I see a far bit of injustice in my work, but I would give up the job if I didn't mostly see justice.
QuattroDave said:
I however refuse to let it worry e further, it's done enough of that already. With the amazingly generous help from Breadvan I'm able to put it to the back of my mind and if he proceeds then he does so and there's little more I can reasonably do to prevent it.
I think that's a good attitude to have.As I said previously, IMHO it was by far the best thing to do to reply, and the short but to the point letter BV provided which quickly counters the new points raised puts the ball back in his court.
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