NSL - 60 or 70mph
Discussion
V8LM said:
speedking31 said:
V8LM said:
Mr E said:
What's the speed limit on a single lane, one way NSL road (as there's no chance of oncoming traffic)?
60.A poster above has posted a photo of the A38(M) in Birmingham (the tidal one with 3 normal lanes each side and a red one in the middle). I believe this has a permanent 50mph limit, but if it was NSL then it would be 70mph as well.
Not many NSL multi-lane single carriageways left now anyway. Apparently it's a better idea to remark them as 2 lanes with hatching, and have everyone stuck behind lorries and the 40 Everywhere Brigade (or risk driving on debris on the hatching).
Cliftonite said:
ModernAndy said:
jshell said:
About 300m, NSL, not posted as 70mph. Prevents Northbound traffic turning right at the junction.
definitely more an island than a proper separation between the carriageways then.Schedule 6 Part 1 Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984
Part IV of said schedule is the interpretation part and defines Dual carriageway as-
a road part of which consists of a central reservation to separate a carriageway to be used by vehicles proceding in one direction froma a carrieway to be used by vehicles proceeding in the opposite direction.
Central reservation is not further defined but is so at Traffic Signs and General Directions 2002 : -
"central reservation" means -
(a) any land between the carriageways of a road comprising two carriageways; or
(b) any permanent work (other than a traffic island) in the carriageway of a road
T5R+ said:
Debate raging in office - if in a NSL with 2 lanes in one direction and 2 in opposing with no physical barrier (or divide) - what is the max permitted speed limit in a car, 60 or 70mph?
(In the interests of honesty - I am in the 60mph camp until educated otherwise).
Very wise. After all what are you going to do with the time saved by risking 70mph? Discretion is so often the better part of valour & you sure 'ain't gonner win any argument with a know-it-all traffic plod. (In the interests of honesty - I am in the 60mph camp until educated otherwise).
Cliftonite said:
VX Foxy said:
Cliftonite said:
It is dual carriageway. 70 mph if safe.
No. It's just a traffic island. NSL = 60There are two carriageways.
https://youtu.be/kQFKtI6gn9Y
Not a dc. Happy* to be corrected with facts.
-*not very, I hate being wrong!
I tried to find legislation around the legal definition of a traffic island last night but couldn't find anything relevant. I suspect it's not black and white in this case but unless there's signage to denote that it is in fact a dual carriageway, I believe that the separation between the roads should be considered as an island, especially as the road stays 1 lane each way and there are junctions.
It is an island. Nothing else. I've just designed one for a scheme. It's to ensure that the junction operates as a left in/left out, with no right-turning.
There are no signs to indicate it's d/c either, which is what you would expect to see on roads where sections of d/c drop in and out.
It's bloody worrying that even motoring/driving enthusiasts can't get their head around this.
There are no signs to indicate it's d/c either, which is what you would expect to see on roads where sections of d/c drop in and out.
It's bloody worrying that even motoring/driving enthusiasts can't get their head around this.
Agree with the sentiments that it's worrying that even on a motoring enthusiast website so many get so much wrong.
Firstly a dual carriageway does not need dual carriageway ahead signs etc to make it a legal dc. Callaghan from Cumbria camera lot tried that one years ago and he had his arse handed to him. Then he cleared off and called himself something else.
Secondly that section as shown of the A9, the one with lots of different coloured tarmac and a few poles down the middle is definitively a single carriageway. I don't care how many posters express opinions that it's other land, you are simply wrong. It's the same land not "other" land. This phrase allows, for example, an area of grass without kerbs to be considered as a central reservation. I think these roads with a simple grass strip are few and far between now but nevertheless still legal dc. Obviously a grass strip down the middle of a country lane doesn't count, not separating carriageway for travel in one direction from another carriageway for travel in opposite direction see?
Fly in all the ointment is that there is no legal definition of traffic island. Not even in the design manual, which are only guidelines anyway. Personally where I am on a DC and get to where the central reservation has a gap for a potential crossover I don't slow down, unless it's a junction and there's other traffic about in which case will have pegged it back anyway. So in that case it's moot.
Firstly a dual carriageway does not need dual carriageway ahead signs etc to make it a legal dc. Callaghan from Cumbria camera lot tried that one years ago and he had his arse handed to him. Then he cleared off and called himself something else.
Secondly that section as shown of the A9, the one with lots of different coloured tarmac and a few poles down the middle is definitively a single carriageway. I don't care how many posters express opinions that it's other land, you are simply wrong. It's the same land not "other" land. This phrase allows, for example, an area of grass without kerbs to be considered as a central reservation. I think these roads with a simple grass strip are few and far between now but nevertheless still legal dc. Obviously a grass strip down the middle of a country lane doesn't count, not separating carriageway for travel in one direction from another carriageway for travel in opposite direction see?
Fly in all the ointment is that there is no legal definition of traffic island. Not even in the design manual, which are only guidelines anyway. Personally where I am on a DC and get to where the central reservation has a gap for a potential crossover I don't slow down, unless it's a junction and there's other traffic about in which case will have pegged it back anyway. So in that case it's moot.
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