27 mph in a 20 zone - nicked.

[youngsyr]

Barchettaman said:

Living in Germany where the 20mph urban limit is the norm, but currently in London, where it's more often than not 30mph, the speed people drive round urban streets here seems ridiculously fast and dangerous.

The whole concept of shared urban road space seems to be done better in DE. It helps that there is a better cyclepath infrastructure, that the vast majority of drivers are cyclists themselves, that most cyclists have lights, that kids are expected to walk/scoot to school on designated 'Schulwege' so drivers are used to going at a sensible urban speed.

Residential estate roads are often designated 'Spielstrassen' and cars have to go at walking pace, give way to everything, aren't even allowed to park etc. My kids and their mates really do play football (in relative safety) on the road. Works beautifully.

Although we have loads of speed cameras every village will have an 'informal' reminder Radar check just before the new lower limit with a red 'Langsam' or a green 'Danke' sign that flashes up.

It probably also helps that we and our American chums pretty much bombed the place flat in the 1940s, giving them the chance to create "modern" infrastructure.

[xjay1337]

Saw the streetview. What a joke. 20 mph limit there is completely BS.
Fingers crossed a SAC but I doubt it somehow if Bedford are not in on the scheme.

[Wills2]

I say bring back the man with the red flag....they might as well if this continues.

[Fish]

Doesn't look like there are enough repeaters to meet the regs, maybe worth following up..

[chevy55]

andygo said:

My fault entirely. Saw the truvelo, checked I wasn't hurtling along at more than 30. Travelled a bit further down the wide grass verged road and spotted the 20mph sign.
Thought 20mph zones weren't policed as such.

Anyway, got a NIP from Beds Plod.

Am I likely to get a speed awareness course or 3 points on my clean licence. Not been on a course before, so clearly that's why I missed the 20mph signs..

I'll be interested to hear what happens with this. A mate of mine says he was done for 27 in a 20, in London but they told him that 27 was too slow to be eligible for a SAC and got a £100 fine and 3 points, before anyone starts, I did ask him if he was sure that's what they said and he seemed pretty certain that it.
One other thing about Beds police, haven't they started a zero tolerance policy to speeding purely as a money raising scheme? I read it somewhere on here late last year.

[Vipers]

andygo said:

It goes back to the main road, probably 3/4 mile in the opposite direction to the camera. There were a few repeaters, but there you go. Live and learn. Ridiculous really, these 20mph limits. Nobody keeps to 20mph. All brought in to win a few votes here and there.

A visitor to that area could easily miss the 20 mph sign exiting the roundabout. If they are that bothered about the speed behind adhere to, a few repeaters wouldn't be out of order.

[SS2.]

Fish said:

Doesn't look like there are enough repeaters to meet the regs, maybe worth following up..

20mph limits need terminal signing and a minimum of just one repeater, irrespective how far down that road the 20mph limit may extend.

Edited by SS2. on Monday 1st February 19:49

[Vipers]

andygo said:

It goes back to the main road, probably 3/4 mile in the opposite direction to the camera. There were a few repeaters, but there you go. Live and learn. Ridiculous really, these 20mph limits. Nobody keeps to 20mph. All brought in to win a few votes here and there.

The only way I can be sure to stick to 20 is use cruise control.

[daytona355]

20 limits are an absolute joke, pointless and just there to cause issues. None of my cars will stick at 20 unless manually held in gear with your foot on the brake. In the fezza, I sit in first and second in ridiculous limits and make sure to give back some pollution. I'm that kind of wally to be fair, I also buy bags when shopping every time, and smile when I throw them in the trash for sticking it to 'the man'

[Tony33]

youngsyr said:

Brilliant bit of logic!

Drivers ignoring a 30 mph limit? -> Make it a 20 mph limit -> that'll learn 'em!

That really IS the logic!

There is evidence that people will drive slower in a 20 than a 30 so rather than enforce a 30 with a fixed camera introducing a 20 has much the same effect presumably at a lower cost.

The problem is that is by then enforcing the 20 pretty much the majority of drivers are likely to be caught exceeding 20mph even though the target was to achieve compliance with the original 30mph limit. This makes it something of a lottery - the more you drive the more you are at risk of losing your licence.

An example of this is from our local newspaper a couple of months ago

"North Somerset Council monitored traffic in the village and its speed measurements showed about half of all motorists were exceeding the 30mph limit.
About 10 per cent in total were travelling at more than 40mph.
Road markings were already in place, but the council felt to achieve long-term success a 20mph restriction, was necessary.
The council plans to review speeds in the area in the coming weeks to see what impact its changes have made."

A mobile camera site has been already been added to the 20 zone:

North Somerset Council Camera Site: 2308
Type of camera: Mobile camera

[youngsyr]

Tony33 said:

youngsyr said:

Brilliant bit of logic!

Drivers ignoring a 30 mph limit? -> Make it a 20 mph limit -> that'll learn 'em!

That really IS the logic!

There is evidence that people will drive slower in a 20 than a 30 so rather than enforce a 30 with a fixed camera introducing a 20 has much the same effect presumably at a lower cost.

The problem is that is by then enforcing the 20 pretty much the majority of drivers are likely to be caught exceeding 20mph even though the target was to achieve compliance with the original 30mph limit. This makes it something of a lottery - the more you drive the more you are at risk of losing your licence.

An example of this is from our local newspaper a couple of months ago

"North Somerset Council monitored traffic in the village and its speed measurements showed about half of all motorists were exceeding the 30mph limit.
About 10 per cent in total were travelling at more than 40mph.
Road markings were already in place, but the council felt to achieve long-term success a 20mph restriction, was necessary.
The council plans to review speeds in the area in the coming weeks to see what impact its changes have made."

A mobile camera site has been already been added to the 20 zone:

North Somerset Council Camera Site: 2308
Type of camera: Mobile camera

So, to stop a minority of people speeding at >30 mph, they're going to make everyone drive at <20 mph?!

You really couldn't make this up, it's absolutely bonkers!

[daytona355]

youngsyr said:

So, to stop a minority of people speeding at >30 mph, they're going to make everyone drive at <20 mph?!

You really couldn't make this up, it's absolutely bonkers!

Haha, when did you land here, and where from, this is the UK, land of the nonsense rules and a nanny state, treating us all at the level of the most moronic, left wing denominator

[youngsyr]

daytona355 said:

youngsyr said:

So, to stop a minority of people speeding at >30 mph, they're going to make everyone drive at <20 mph?!

You really couldn't make this up, it's absolutely bonkers!

Haha, when did you land here, and where from, this is the UK, land of the nonsense rules and a nanny state, treating us all at the level of the most moronic, left wing denominator

To be fair, the only 20 mph zones I've come across have been residential estates, where 20 mph isn't too slow a speed to be travelling generally and across Tower Bridge (to reduce wear on the bridge).

I would be a bit more bothered about it if they were cropping up left, right and centre.

[chevy55]

youngsyr said:

To be fair, the only 20 mph zones I've come across have been residential estates, where 20 mph isn't too slow a speed to be travelling generally and across Tower Bridge (to reduce wear on the bridge).

I would be a bit more bothered about it if they were cropping up left, right and centre.

Try driving in Camden, Islington, Hackney, Newham, they are all 20mph on main roads as well as residential, the on;y exception is Seven Sisters rd as I think that isn't run by TFL. Greenwich is slowly moving over to a complete 20mph borough but they can afford the signs to do it in one swoop.

[TheInternet]

chevy55 said:

ry driving in Camden, Islington, Hackney, Newham, they are all 20mph on main roads as well as residential, the on;y exception is Seven Sisters rd as I think that isn't run by TFL. Greenwich is slowly moving over to a complete 20mph borough but they can afford the signs to do it in one swoop.

All of Southwark is 20mph, Lambeth is going to be in April. I imagine almost the whole of inner London will be 20mph soon. You'll still only do 7mph though.

[timetex]

Chris Type R said:

FFS, these are being policed.

All of Stotfold has been turned into 20mph - seemingly not based on any accident statistics. The local calls for voluntary speed checkers has met with quite a lot of hostility. It seems that very few people support the lowered limits, while there is far more support for 30mph.

Ah-ha - you're local to me then!

[LunarOne]

Barchettaman said:

Living in Germany where the 20mph urban limit is the norm

Funny, I've recently got back from a driving trip in middle and southern Germany and the urban speed limit was 50km/h which is 31mph. A few years ago I lived in Hamburg and it was the same there too. I don't recall ever seeing a lower limit, even in the city centre.

[Vipers]

daytona355 said:

20 limits are an absolute joke, pointless and just there to cause issues. None of my cars will stick at 20 unless manually held in gear with your foot on the brake.

Hmmmm so you are saying in first and tick over, it will be doing over 20, what do you drive?

Just interested.

[WJNB]

20 mph limits are excellent & long may they exist & be extended. With luck more & more fixed cameras will be installed so that they are adhered to 24/7/365.
Town & village centres are NOT the place for higher speeds.
Even at 6am many strictly adhere to 20mph limits probably because they once just missed a paper boy riding a bike sans lights. All this drives commuters mad as a huge queue forms because having used such restricted roads as rat runs only to find they get stuck behind somebody adhering to the limit & then have to drive at 20mph whether they like it or not. Result & a fixed camera would soon teach them safer ways.

[TheInternet]

WJNB said:

All this drives commuters mad as a huge queue forms because having used such restricted roads as rat runs only to find they get stuck behind somebody adhering to the limit & then have to drive at 20mph whether they like it or not overtake and get on with their day.

FTFY. Any traffic doing 20mph on one particular road near me gets overtaken by almost everyone else. Really safe.