International Parental Abduction
Discussion
Don't get chance to look at PH much these days, but thought I'd give this a whirl... And before the 'you should seek legal advice' comments, yes, this is already being sought and paid for. But you never know - something novel might come out of this post.
My brother lived in Germany for a while, met a girl, got married, had 2 kids. Just over 3 years ago they moved to New Zealand on a Work to Residence visa (work for 3 years, then apply for full residence), with the kids and wife's visas dependent on his own.
The three years are up, but while the application for full residence was ongoing and he was in AUS working for a week, she ran off back to Germany with the kids. She called immigration to state that they had lied on their visa forms, and were not in a stable relationship (it had been shaky for a little while). There are no issues around violence, fear of personal safety etc.
He can apply to have the kids returned to their normal place of living, which is NZ. Immigration are saying that they will not grant the kids visas as under their regulations the kids are resident in Germany. So there is a crazy situation where the kids can get returned to NZ under international law, then turned away as they have no visas.
At present she seems to hold all the cards, despite illegally removing them from NZ. He doesn't feel inclined to up and leave his job, relinquishing their only way of supporting the kids etc to move back to Germany to get occasional visiting rights.
He doesn't want the kids to suffer more upheaval than is necessary, but wants to get a fair hearing so it can be sorted out properly one way or another.
Thoughts? I realise its complicated, with lots of international law, immigration regulations etc.
My brother lived in Germany for a while, met a girl, got married, had 2 kids. Just over 3 years ago they moved to New Zealand on a Work to Residence visa (work for 3 years, then apply for full residence), with the kids and wife's visas dependent on his own.
The three years are up, but while the application for full residence was ongoing and he was in AUS working for a week, she ran off back to Germany with the kids. She called immigration to state that they had lied on their visa forms, and were not in a stable relationship (it had been shaky for a little while). There are no issues around violence, fear of personal safety etc.
He can apply to have the kids returned to their normal place of living, which is NZ. Immigration are saying that they will not grant the kids visas as under their regulations the kids are resident in Germany. So there is a crazy situation where the kids can get returned to NZ under international law, then turned away as they have no visas.
At present she seems to hold all the cards, despite illegally removing them from NZ. He doesn't feel inclined to up and leave his job, relinquishing their only way of supporting the kids etc to move back to Germany to get occasional visiting rights.
He doesn't want the kids to suffer more upheaval than is necessary, but wants to get a fair hearing so it can be sorted out properly one way or another.
Thoughts? I realise its complicated, with lots of international law, immigration regulations etc.
Firstly, IANAL.
As she is their mother, I don't understand the 'illegally removing them from New Zealand' bit. In what way is it illegal as opposed to just being not a nice thing to do to your brother?
Is she a German national?
What nationality are the children?
As she is their mother, I don't understand the 'illegally removing them from New Zealand' bit. In what way is it illegal as opposed to just being not a nice thing to do to your brother?
Is she a German national?
What nationality are the children?
Edited by paintman on Tuesday 3rd May 08:14
Exige46 said:
He can apply to have the kids returned to their normal place of living, which is NZ.
But it isn't, is it?He's British. She's German. The kids are on EU passports (doesn't really matter whether D/UK).
He is on a non-permanent NZ visa, and they're in NZ solely because of his visa.
She's left him, and the kids are with her.
Umm, surely in that situation, the illegality would be for her and the kids to STAY in NZ, since they'd be outside the terms of their visas?
In the absence of any court-appointed custody, she has just as much right as he does to custody - but he's not only on a temporary work posting to the other side of the world, but working away from there for extended periods.
Sorry, but I think he needs to grow up a bit. If he wants to live near the kids, then he needs to move back to Europe.
TooMany2cvs said:
But it isn't, is it?
He's British. She's German. The kids are on EU passports (doesn't really matter whether D/UK).
He is on a non-permanent NZ visa, and they're in NZ solely because of his visa.
She's left him, and the kids are with her.
Umm, surely in that situation, the illegality would be for her and the kids to STAY in NZ, since they'd be outside the terms of their visas?
In the absence of any court-appointed custody, she has just as much right as he does to custody - but he's not only on a temporary work posting to the other side of the world, but working away from there for extended periods.
Sorry, but I think he needs to grow up a bit. If he wants to live near the kids, then he needs to move back to Europe.
Neatly sums it up - OR another way - he British, she German - He wants to live and work in NZ - and expects the rest of the family to live away from both parents support-family groups - because he likes the work???He's British. She's German. The kids are on EU passports (doesn't really matter whether D/UK).
He is on a non-permanent NZ visa, and they're in NZ solely because of his visa.
She's left him, and the kids are with her.
Umm, surely in that situation, the illegality would be for her and the kids to STAY in NZ, since they'd be outside the terms of their visas?
In the absence of any court-appointed custody, she has just as much right as he does to custody - but he's not only on a temporary work posting to the other side of the world, but working away from there for extended periods.
Sorry, but I think he needs to grow up a bit. If he wants to live near the kids, then he needs to move back to Europe.
The good lady has torpedoed her chances of coming back - by advising Immigration of no relationship - it could be entertaining having that discussion with Immigration to get another visa.
If your brother wants to stay - best et used to the local girls......
TVRnutcase said:
OR another way - he British, she German - He wants to live and work in NZ - and expects the rest of the family to live away from both parents support-family groups - because he likes the work???
Indeed.TVRnutcase said:
If your brother wants to stay - best et used to the local girls......
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