Goddamit Jury service. Get outs?

[spaximus]

My problem with this is I could not honestly say I would not be biased. Having been burgled and found my goods on Ebay, the police did everything they could and eventually got the CPS to take the case. It was so difficult that to my mind anyone there is most likely guilty as the CPS only take winners.

Now I know that is probably not the case but if faced with an alleged burglar of thief I would automatically find it impossible to find them innocent and not be able to give a fair trial.

I would have to explain that to the court before hand.

My wife wants to do one just incase there is an opportunity to make sure someone gets a guilty verdict.

[Monkeylegend]

spaximus said:

My problem with this is I could not honestly say I would not be biased. Having been burgled and found my goods on Ebay, the police did everything they could and eventually got the CPS to take the case. It was so difficult that to my mind anyone there is most likely guilty as the CPS only take winners.

Now I know that is probably not the case but if faced with an alleged burglar of thief I would automatically find it impossible to find them innocent and not be able to give a fair trial.

I would have to explain that to the court before hand.

My wife wants to do one just incase there is an opportunity to make sure someone gets a guilty verdict.

Good old British justice for you, guilty now what's the charge

[crystalmethod]

I had to do jury service three times before I turned 35.

First time no problem. Got on with it, not needed many afternoons.

Then called again. Deferred but called up six months later, and did a couple of weeks.

A year later I'm called for Coroner's Court jury. Explained my previous times as a juror but it was made clear to me that this was managed differently, so two weeks of looking at pictures of dead people, and listening to grieving relatives followed.

That was just over ten years ago, so I guess I'm due another summons.

[Ian Geary]

DuraAce said:

Oddly it's something I've always fancied! I'm ineligible due to my job which is a shame.

This would have been much funnier if you said you were a "career criminal".

Anyway, never been called in the 15 odd years I've been working, but my employer would continue my pay (though I wouldn't be able to take the expenses as well)


Ian

[Slidingpillar]

Called once. Would have been two trials, so two juries needed, except one trials date was changed. So rather a lot of people called and only 12 selected.

Stayed for opening statements as I was curious how things went. The defendant was five foot nothing older bloke, looked like he wouldn't say boo to a goose and was accused of being an axe wielding maniac. If true, I guess alcohol had a teeny weeny bit to do with it! This was Scotland after all.

Could still be called, but if I am - they won't want me after I get my brother to ring, or I write a letter, as I have the ultimate get out now as I'm totally deaf.

[Red Devil]

Sometimes being a juror can cause real financial hardship - http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2005/mar/23/transpor...

crystalmethod said:

A year later I'm called for Coroner's Court jury. Explained my previous times as a juror but it was made clear to me that this was managed differently, so two weeks of looking at pictures of dead people, and listening to grieving relatives followed.

A mere two weeks. Pah, be grateful you weren't called to be one of those who had to serve on the Hillsborough inquest. Imagine having to your life on hold for two years.

[marshalla]

Slidingpillar said:

Called once. Would have been two trials, so two juries needed, except one trials date was changed. So rather a lot of people called and only 12 selected.

Stayed for opening statements as I was curious how things went. The defendant was five foot nothing older bloke, looked like he wouldn't say boo to a goose and was accused of being an axe wielding maniac. If true, I guess alcohol had a teeny weeny bit to do with it! This was Scotland after all.

Should have been 15 selected for a Scottish jury.

[TerzoNeil]

was called around 1999/2000, employer wrote letter and instantly not needed as only electrician at the time and business would suffer

since then never been called

now i know i wont be called as my pal wife picks the names from the electoral register and if you know anyone in the court, you will never be pick

[Zigster]

My wife has her own business.

Three years ago she was called for jury service and got a quite unpleasant child abuse case which she found very tough. Inevitably it had a negative impact on her business as well.

18 months ago, she got called up again and asked to be excused because of the stress caused by the first one. She was excused.

A couple of weeks ago she got yet another request for jury service.

Random selection, my arse. I could design a better random selection process than the courts seem to use.

[oyster]

swerni said:

280E said:

swerni said:

Personally I find the whole jury thing ridiculous.
If was ever tried for something, I'd want my innocence or guilt determined by an expert not Mrs Miggins from number ten or Wayne from the local council estate.

Maybe you don't realise how pompous that sounds

It may do to you but it's totally logical.
Your innocent or guilt being based on someone who may or may not grasp the facts of a case and who's judgement will be biased by personal prejudice, whether conscious or subconscious, regardless of their education, creed or colour

If you think that's pompous you're a moron.

So you'd prefer your innocence or guilt decided by just one person whose judgement could be biased by personal prejudice, rather than by 12 of them?

[silent ninja]

Strange how some people are being called up multiple times in a few years. I've never been called and don't actually know anybody who's been called either! Most of my family and friends work professional jobs too. Strange.

[donkmeister]

colin_p said:

As we all know some law is bad law and some law is an arse

An ass.

The quote is "the law is an ass", i.e. stupid and stubborn. Not a bottom. It comes from something that Charles Dickens wrote.

It's one of those points of pedantry that I can't unsee, not intended to poke at you, Colin!

Out of interest, if you can claim lost earnings, how does that work for self-employed people with much of their money earned as dividends? Do they have to take it on the chin (recognising that the loss is more than balanced by the tax that this approach has avoided over the years)? Honest question, not trying to start a tax debate.

[marshalla]

donkmeister said:

Out of interest, if you can claim lost earnings, how does that work for self-employed people with much of their money earned as dividends? Do they have to take it on the chin (recognising that the loss is more than balanced by the tax that this approach has avoided over the years)? Honest question, not trying to start a tax debate.

They're not self-employed.

They may be employed by a ltd. company, of which they happen to be a director or shareholder. As far as dividends go, though, those are returns on investments, not earnings.

[TwigtheWonderkid]

Zigster said:

My wife has her own business.

Three years ago she was called for jury service and got a quite unpleasant child abuse case which she found very tough. Inevitably it had a negative impact on her business as well.

18 months ago, she got called up again and asked to be excused because of the stress caused by the first one. She was excused.

A couple of weeks ago she got yet another request for jury service.

Random selection, my arse.

Doesn't this prove it's random. She's had 3 call ups, as have I (I only did 2 of them), whereas others have never been called. That sounds random to me. If no one got called twice and everyone got called once, I'd say that wasn't random.

[Slidingpillar]

marshalla said:

Slidingpillar said:

Called once. Would have been two trials, so two juries needed, except one trials date was changed. So rather a lot of people called and only 12 selected.

Stayed for opening statements as I was curious how things went. The defendant was five foot nothing older bloke, looked like he wouldn't say boo to a goose and was accused of being an axe wielding maniac. If true, I guess alcohol had a teeny weeny bit to do with it! This was Scotland after all.

Should have been 15 selected for a Scottish jury.

In that case there were, I'm English, was living in Scotland at the time and it was 30 years ago, so memory of events is not 100%

[colin_p]

donkmeister said:

colin_p said:

As we all know some law is bad law and some law is an arse

An ass.

The quote is "the law is an ass", i.e. stupid and stubborn. Not a bottom. It comes from something that Charles Dickens wrote.

It's one of those points of pedantry that I can't unsee, not intended to poke at you, Colin!

Out of interest, if you can claim lost earnings, how does that work for self-employed people with much of their money earned as dividends? Do they have to take it on the chin (recognising that the loss is more than balanced by the tax that this approach has avoided over the years)? Honest question, not trying to start a tax debate.

Thank you Donk.

I'm aware that it is ass but put in arse as ass doesn't adequately describe how goppingly stupid some laws are. I also like using arse as it seems a little less Americanised.

Going back to my first post on Nullification, nobody has picked up on it. I would have hoped that some of the PH legal beagle types could have elaborated upon it and what effect it has on getting out of jury service if you announce that you are aware of it and that it is your right to do so.

Generally for Jury service, it seems that there is a 50/50 split of people who would love to do it and those that would do anything to get out of it. Strangely as it effects so many people, there is precious little online instructing as to the best way to get out of it.

I've never been called but would like to know how to get out of it as and when the time comes. Jinxed it now, there is probably a letter on its way.

[JDiz]

I was called up not long after surgery, I postponed it as was was still on crutches, they came back a month later, told them I still wasn't up to doing it as not fully recovered, they said that in that case they will permanently excuse me, interestingly they never asked for proof.

I would have done it if wasn't ill

[Zigster]

TwigtheWonderkid said:

Zigster said:

My wife has her own business.

Three years ago she was called for jury service and got a quite unpleasant child abuse case which she found very tough. Inevitably it had a negative impact on her business as well.

18 months ago, she got called up again and asked to be excused because of the stress caused by the first one. She was excused.

A couple of weeks ago she got yet another request for jury service.

Random selection, my arse.

Doesn't this prove it's random. She's had 3 call ups, as have I (I only did 2 of them), whereas others have never been called. That sounds random to me. If no one got called twice and everyone got called once, I'd say that wasn't random.

Laws of large numbers. The distribution (presumably something like a Poisson?) should mean it evens out a lot better than it appears to. Most people would get 0 or 1 call ups, with 3 (in three years) being a pretty extreme event.

I'd have to look at some numbers (e.g. how many jurors are required each year, how many UK residents are eligible) to get a better feel for the likelihood.

[Getragdogleg]

Never been asked but would love to do it.

[DBSV8]

easy just get a criminal record and you wont be asked