Police detain 11 year of girl with a neurological disability

[jan8p]

Greendubber said:

You've more chance of winning the lottery than get that bunch together in the same room.

Ninja edit!

[Elroy Blue]

What Mr David Ball seems completely unable to grasp is that Mental Health units WILL NOT accept anyone who has had a sniff of alcohol, shows any sign of aggression or uncooperative behaviour. They simply say "NO".

Police Officers are then sat swinging in the wind. No Police Officer wants to be dealing with these people. Those on the outrage bus, as usual, fail to offer an informed solution.

[rb5er]

It sounds like to police did all they could do with the resources given. That may seem barbaric but does her mother have any bright ideas?

[Bigends]

Greendubber said:

jan8p said:

Generally an NHS 'crisis team', consisting of someone from Social Services, a mental health nurse and a doctor. Or two.

You've more chance of winning the lottery than get that bunch together in the same room.

My lot have a duty psychiatric nurse on duty at one of the stations ready to attend such incidents with Police and advise accordingly. Something other forces could consider.

[davidball]

Given that the NHS is in crisis itself I suspect the time frame for attendance is a lottery.

More questions.

Is there still accelerated promotion in the force for university graduates?
How many graduates does the force attract?
How many have studied psychology, better still psychopathology?

I do not know if this information is available but I will be surprised if many psychology graduates consider the police as a career opportunity.

Do police stations no longer have padded cells?

Edited by davidball on Wednesday 8th June 19:21

[jamesson]

davidball said:

Given that the NHS is in crisis itself I suspect the time frame for attendance is a lottery.

More questions.

Is there still accelerated promotion in the force for university graduates?
How many graduates does the force attract?
How many have studied psychology, better still psychopathology?

I do not know if this information is available but I will be surprised if many psychology graduates consider the police as a career opportunity.

I'd love to know what a psychology graduate PC would do differently to any other PC.

As asked before, how would YOU deal with the situation?

[Greendubber]

Bigends said:

My lot have a duty psychiatric nurse on duty at one of the stations ready to attend such incidents with Police and advise accordingly. Something other forces could consider.

Who cant section anyone so just arranges for the same people to come and carry out an assessment, so there we are still sat waiting.

[rb5er]

I'm certainly no defender of the Police but David you are continually asking questions without answering any of the ones posed to yourself.

[jamesson]

davidball said:

Do police stations no longer have padded cells?

Edited by davidball on Wednesday 8th June 19:21

Mine certainly doesn't. But what would you do before you could get the girl to a padded cell, even if one were to exist AND be available? There's every chance that another violent mental health patient is using it.

[Elroy Blue]

davidball said:

Given that the NHS is in crisis itself I suspect the time frame for attendance is a lottery.

More questions.

Is there still accelerated promotion in the force for university graduates?
How many graduates does the force attract?
How many have studied psychology, better still psychopathology?

I do not know if this information is available but I will be surprised if many psychology graduates consider the police as a career opportunity.

Do police stations no longer have padded cells?

Edited by davidball on Wednesday 8th June 19:21

Just bizarre.

[davidball]

I am surprised that you do not have standing orders relating to the management of such patients that detail best practices, for that is essentially what you are asking me to supply. It will require some thought.

[davidball]

Elroy Blue said:

Just bizarre.

Explain.

[Bigends]

Greendubber said:

Bigends said:

My lot have a duty psychiatric nurse on duty at one of the stations ready to attend such incidents with Police and advise accordingly. Something other forces could consider.

Who cant section anyone so just arranges for the same people to come and carry out an assessment, so there we are still sat waiting.

Or..as happened yesterday - they assessed a patient, calmed things down - decided sectioning wasnt applicable and everyone went on their way. Theyre on hand to give expert, on the spot advice - not to section - surely better than untrained cops attending alone

[jamesson]

davidball said:

I am surprised that you do not have standing orders relating to the management of such patients that detail best practices, for that is essentially what you are asking me to supply. It will require some thought.

David, you've had ages to compose a reply to the repeated questions about what you would do.

In a fast moving environment with someone kicking off, you have mere seconds to make those decisions. The 9 o'clock jury can take their sweet time about analysing every move the officers made but when you're the one dealing with an unpredictable violent person, there is no such luxury.

So, right now, off the top of your head and without mulling it over for hours on end citing best practice from a psychological perspective, how would you, as a police officer, react to a violent person right in front of you?

[Greendubber]

davidball said:

I am surprised that you do not have standing orders relating to the management of such patients that detail best practices, for that is essentially what you are asking me to supply. It will require some thought.

The standing order is that the crisis team attend within a reasonable time and take the girl to a suitable place, not leave the police babysitting her.

This incident just shows how open to falling in the st the police are when they are expected to backfill the NHS

[bitchstewie]

davidball said:

I am surprised that you do not have standing orders relating to the management of such patients that detail best practices, for that is essentially what you are asking me to supply. It will require some thought.

You're playing the Monday morning quarterback.

In such a situation you don't have time as "will require some thought" as you could be injured or the other people involved could be injured.

You have seconds to decide what to do and whatever you choose someone is likely to complain about your actions.

You couldn't pay me to do the job.

[ELD3R]

rb5er said:

I'm certainly no defender of the Police but David you are continually asking questions without answering any of the ones posed to yourself.

David - just for clarity, are you a practising clinical psychologist, or are your qualifications limited to holding a first degree in psychology? The reason I ask is that there is a significant difference between the two in terms of qualification to speak with authority on the example this thread is based upon. A psychology degree alone does not make a psychologist.

[paintman]

I joined the job in 1979. I've never seen a 'padded cell' - other than in Hollywood & other films - or heard of a force that had one and I can say with absolute certainty that mine didn't.

We did have a regular MFH who also had mental health issues. On medication which she failed to take. She was regularly detained as MFH (from her parents address) and was one of the few females where male officers were required to be present to restrain her whilst a female officer performed an intimate search. Reason for that was that despite her small size she was incredibly strong, was not averse to biting anything that came within reach and was known for secreting blades - including razor blades - in a certain part of her anatomy.
In an ideal world she would have been in a secure establishment but this was the early days of 'care in the community' and such places were being closed down left, right & centre. She killed herself by overdose in her very late teens.

Edited by paintman on Wednesday 8th June 19:48

[hora]

I'm only going to post once. It's called a spitter hood.

Would you like someone's spit in your face or eye?

Goodbye.

[Elroy Blue]

Bigends said:

Or..as happened yesterday - they assessed a patient, calmed things down - decided sectioning wasnt applicable and everyone went on their way. Theyre on hand to give expert, on the spot advice - not to section - surely better than untrained cops attending alone

Did you see that on telly? Of course every mental health job is exactly the same and can be dealt with the same way. You know this because you were, apparently, 'in the job'.