Flashed by speed camera, pleaded not guilty and WON
Discussion
So, last October I was flashed by a speed camera, doing 40mph in a 30mph zone at around midnight on the A4147 Maylands Avenue, Hemel Hempstead.
At the time something did not feel right, and after I received the NIP I decided to check the terminal signs prior to the camera to see how I missed them. Evidently the near side terminal sign was not illuminated (unit missing completely) and the offside sign was dirty. I turned down the generous offer of a speed awareness course and decided to plead not guilty instead and see what happens. I took photos of the signs, reported the defects and requested street lighting inspection records from the highway authority (which were duly supplied). I have an advantage here over Joe blogs in that I work in the highway maintenance sector so know how these things work.
I employed a reputable nationally known Solicitors, and nine months later (this week) I attended magistrates court, with a barrister. The day before trial at 16:45hrs, finally the CPS indicated they would seek adjournment so an officer could investigate further. At trial the following day the magistrates refused adjournment, thanks to my barrister and the trial would be in the afternoon. My barrister liaised with prosecution who subsequently indicated they would offer no evidence and intended to drop the case. Into court we went, prosecution offered no evidence and so I was 'free to go' and was awarded all costs (£1k).
I could not have won this without the help of the Solicitors and barrister who were excellent, despite my technical knowledge regarding road signs the nuances of court were beyond me.
Now then, from my investigations the signs in question have been defective for at least 5 years. It seems farcical that someone has to spend a not inconsiderable sum to get justice where there is an obvious issue. The highway authority have done nothing about it,evidently are inspecting the road every two months and fail to spot the defect each time.
There was a comical moment prior to court where the prosecution said they would seek adjournment so an officer could come to court to say the signs were correct at the time of the offence, "which is ridiculous" said my barrister given the evidence. The speed I was travelling was never in question. Apparently, in the photo of the offence my barrister said it "was pitch black" and you could barely make out my car.
So, I'm wondering what to do about all this? There must have been thousands caught at this location over the last few years. The condition of road signs generally is poor in the uk in recent years,and I've now noticed other terminal signs in the area, which don't comply (badly faded), but also have a speed camera a short distance away. i.e. A4147 nr Blackwater Lane.
At the time something did not feel right, and after I received the NIP I decided to check the terminal signs prior to the camera to see how I missed them. Evidently the near side terminal sign was not illuminated (unit missing completely) and the offside sign was dirty. I turned down the generous offer of a speed awareness course and decided to plead not guilty instead and see what happens. I took photos of the signs, reported the defects and requested street lighting inspection records from the highway authority (which were duly supplied). I have an advantage here over Joe blogs in that I work in the highway maintenance sector so know how these things work.
I employed a reputable nationally known Solicitors, and nine months later (this week) I attended magistrates court, with a barrister. The day before trial at 16:45hrs, finally the CPS indicated they would seek adjournment so an officer could investigate further. At trial the following day the magistrates refused adjournment, thanks to my barrister and the trial would be in the afternoon. My barrister liaised with prosecution who subsequently indicated they would offer no evidence and intended to drop the case. Into court we went, prosecution offered no evidence and so I was 'free to go' and was awarded all costs (£1k).
I could not have won this without the help of the Solicitors and barrister who were excellent, despite my technical knowledge regarding road signs the nuances of court were beyond me.
Now then, from my investigations the signs in question have been defective for at least 5 years. It seems farcical that someone has to spend a not inconsiderable sum to get justice where there is an obvious issue. The highway authority have done nothing about it,evidently are inspecting the road every two months and fail to spot the defect each time.
There was a comical moment prior to court where the prosecution said they would seek adjournment so an officer could come to court to say the signs were correct at the time of the offence, "which is ridiculous" said my barrister given the evidence. The speed I was travelling was never in question. Apparently, in the photo of the offence my barrister said it "was pitch black" and you could barely make out my car.
So, I'm wondering what to do about all this? There must have been thousands caught at this location over the last few years. The condition of road signs generally is poor in the uk in recent years,and I've now noticed other terminal signs in the area, which don't comply (badly faded), but also have a speed camera a short distance away. i.e. A4147 nr Blackwater Lane.
chevy55 said:
Where do you find a barrister that'll work a day for under £1k? That's assuming you've added your own costs on as well. Congratulations BTW.
The average daily fee for a barrister is £502. [The Times, October 2015]The OP could have saved money going direct to his counsel. Not always much point also instructing a solicitor in a straightforward case like this. Especially if you're paying the solicitor £900 and getting a £300 barrister - the solicitor sometimes won't present you with the barrister's fee note if he's trousering a large fee for doing very little. Did you get the barrister's fee note? If not, why not?
In the context of solicitors, the word "national" is sometimes synonymous with unscrupulous. Unless the firm is truly national in the sense that it has multiple offices then I'd caution against using a "national" solicitor. Just be sure that you know what you are getting and how they work. E.g. Paying £800 for police station advice, "national" solicitor instructs a local agent solicitor that you could have got for free.
I'd be surprised if the OP has actually been awarded all of his costs. The usual order is assessment by the NTT. Very unusual for the court to make a summary assessment.
I reckon you should sell your story to a National newspaper and get it maximum publicity. They should have to repay ach and every fine over the period, repay increased insurance costs. What about the guys who will have list their licenses on toting up could cost hundreds of thousands. Hopefully they'll learn a lesson but probably won't.
Well done OP. 
However before people get too excited bear in mind that TSRGD 2106 has moved the goal posts
It is no longer mandatory to position speed limit signs on both sides of the road.
Also the illumination requirements have been modified.
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploa...
However before people get too excited bear in mind that TSRGD 2106 has moved the goal posts
It is no longer mandatory to position speed limit signs on both sides of the road.
Also the illumination requirements have been modified.
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploa...
Red Devil said:
Well done OP.
However before people get too excited bear in mind that TSRGD 2106 has moved the goal posts
It is no longer mandatory to position speed limit signs on both sides of the road.
Also the illumination requirements have been modified.
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploa...
Surely they can't make that retrospective for all the people done prior to that though?However before people get too excited bear in mind that TSRGD 2106 has moved the goal posts
It is no longer mandatory to position speed limit signs on both sides of the road.
Also the illumination requirements have been modified.
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploa...
PurpleMoonlight said:
Do you deny exceeding the speed limit at the time then?
Depends how you look at it, the alleged speed limit of 30mph is not the actual speed limit at that point if it is not properly signed as such. No, he didn't deny exceeding 30mph, but he denied that that was in fact the speed limit for that road at the time of the alleged offence. As I see it, any road which is not properly signposted with a speed limit is an NSL.I was found not guilty in a similar situation a few years ago.
brrapp said:
PurpleMoonlight said:
Do you deny exceeding the speed limit at the time then?
Depends how you look at it, the alleged speed limit of 30mph is not the actual speed limit at that point if it is not properly signed as such. No, he didn't deny exceeding 30mph, but he denied that that was in fact the speed limit for that road at the time of the alleged offence. As I see it, any road which is not properly signposted with a speed limit is an NSL.I was found not guilty in a similar situation a few years ago.
Trabi601 said:
Depending on where it was on Maylands Avenue, I'd have thought the presence of street lighting would be enough to indicate a 30mph limit.
Unless I'm mistaken the photo evidence from the prosecution showed the road to be pitch black. If the lights don't work does the limit apply?telecat said:
Trabi601 said:
Depending on where it was on Maylands Avenue, I'd have thought the presence of street lighting would be enough to indicate a 30mph limit.
Unless I'm mistaken the photo evidence from the prosecution showed the road to be pitch black. If the lights don't work does the limit apply?Edited by Trabi601 on Sunday 17th July 20:25
elanfan said:
I reckon you should sell your story to a National newspaper and get it maximum publicity. They should have to repay ach and every fine over the period, repay increased insurance costs. What about the guys who will have list their licenses on toting up could cost hundreds of thousands. Hopefully they'll learn a lesson but probably won't.
I'd be very tempted to go to someone like the daily mail or someone equivalent. They'd love a story like this! Gassing Station | Speed, Plod & the Law | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff