Police Inspectors - what do they do?
Discussion
Defcon5 said:
If these positions arent going to be operational, why does it need to be a Police Inspector post in the first place? Why not a civilian role, XYZ Manager. Much cheaper on costs for the force involved too
You think that these new civilians, for that is what they are, will be cheaper? Now there's a thought. Not in the great plan I'm afraid.A family friend is a very senior scene of crime officer ,he is a police officer and started as a constable. He tells me regularly that those above him are all people who have never done front line police work and have little clue of procedures but are all highly qualified in some form of management, unfortunately none of it has anything to do with polce work .
A superintendent, freshly returned from a command course, gave me one of his jobs. I was given a short deadline but in the report was a letter which gave his deadline, one week after mine.
The problem was that I could not make a decision on a number of matters without specific information. I went as far as I could then went to him to show him the report and say I was waiting for information. I had tried to get the info but was told by an SB DC that it was 'beyond my pay grade'. I pointed out that as a 21-year inspector, and him with about 8 years in the lowest of ranks, the statement was nonsense.
I was told by the super that I should bring him 'solutions, not problems'. Straight out of the then management speak. What does that mean? That I should make up the numbers? I said the solution was there: get me the details. He said it was my job. I pointed out that I needed higher clearance. He said that he hadn't the necessary clearance either.
In the end I phoned the acc whose name was on the original form. She said that I should not worry as it had been cancelled. I asked when and was told four days before. So beyond the SB's pay grade as well.
So I sat on the report until past the deadline. I was approached by the super who demanded to know where the report was. I told him I had shredded it, although failed to remember that it was under the instructions of the acc. Good fun, but catch-phrases are not the answer to lack of information.
All of a sudden I would hear identical phrases from different command officers, the latest way they could escape having to make a decision or do their job.
After taking over a new shift I wandered around the division meeting local beat officers. I turned at one after a weekend operation with important people coming to the division.
I arrived as he was opening his correspondence, built up over the weekend and the days leave he'd had to swap. He asked if it was OK to continue with the letters in case there was any important ones. One was a package, obviously a video. He threw it into the bin. I handed him his tea - I was doing important stuff - and I asked him why he had discarded the package without opening the parcel.
He said: 'That's the instructions for the [major incident] on Saturday. I came in on Friday [his leave day] but it hadn't arrived.'
The super in charge of the incident was commended on his innovative use of new means of communication in briefing staff.
Yet the bloke was a double university graduate, having been something of a phenomenon on the special course which gave rapid promotion. He'd been in the job less than 10 years and spent a few days in each speciality on his CV. But he was thick. If it had been me, I'd have handed the job to the unit whose job it was to inform officers by video.
That said, he went on to be a divisional super and then transferred to another force. When I phoned another inspector in his new force to discuss our speciality, the bloke told me stories of his 'innovations' in his new force.
But, as with these new direct entrants, he was too important to fail. Much had been invested in him and he had been picked out by HMIC.
The problem was that I could not make a decision on a number of matters without specific information. I went as far as I could then went to him to show him the report and say I was waiting for information. I had tried to get the info but was told by an SB DC that it was 'beyond my pay grade'. I pointed out that as a 21-year inspector, and him with about 8 years in the lowest of ranks, the statement was nonsense.
I was told by the super that I should bring him 'solutions, not problems'. Straight out of the then management speak. What does that mean? That I should make up the numbers? I said the solution was there: get me the details. He said it was my job. I pointed out that I needed higher clearance. He said that he hadn't the necessary clearance either.
In the end I phoned the acc whose name was on the original form. She said that I should not worry as it had been cancelled. I asked when and was told four days before. So beyond the SB's pay grade as well.
So I sat on the report until past the deadline. I was approached by the super who demanded to know where the report was. I told him I had shredded it, although failed to remember that it was under the instructions of the acc. Good fun, but catch-phrases are not the answer to lack of information.
All of a sudden I would hear identical phrases from different command officers, the latest way they could escape having to make a decision or do their job.
After taking over a new shift I wandered around the division meeting local beat officers. I turned at one after a weekend operation with important people coming to the division.
I arrived as he was opening his correspondence, built up over the weekend and the days leave he'd had to swap. He asked if it was OK to continue with the letters in case there was any important ones. One was a package, obviously a video. He threw it into the bin. I handed him his tea - I was doing important stuff - and I asked him why he had discarded the package without opening the parcel.
He said: 'That's the instructions for the [major incident] on Saturday. I came in on Friday [his leave day] but it hadn't arrived.'
The super in charge of the incident was commended on his innovative use of new means of communication in briefing staff.
Yet the bloke was a double university graduate, having been something of a phenomenon on the special course which gave rapid promotion. He'd been in the job less than 10 years and spent a few days in each speciality on his CV. But he was thick. If it had been me, I'd have handed the job to the unit whose job it was to inform officers by video.
That said, he went on to be a divisional super and then transferred to another force. When I phoned another inspector in his new force to discuss our speciality, the bloke told me stories of his 'innovations' in his new force.
But, as with these new direct entrants, he was too important to fail. Much had been invested in him and he had been picked out by HMIC.
To the Op, Here is a hypothetical question. If there was a promotion available in the place you work at and you spent many months, sometimes a few years filling in that job temporarily and then someone with no experience is parachuted in and takes over. How would you feel? There are many, many PCs and Sergeants waiting to be promoted already. Direct entry would create envy and resentment to those coming into the job 'off the street' with no knowledge and they they would have zero respect from the the officers.
Greendubber said:
anonymous said:
[redacted]
Sounds like you want to be a PC then. Dont spend the starting 19k a year all at once though!
carinaman said:
Greendubber said:
anonymous said:
[redacted]
Sounds like you want to be a PC then. Dont spend the starting 19k a year all at once though!
Defcon5 said:
Greendubber said:
Nope every officer starts at the same pay level and it only increases with length of service or promotion only, not life or any other kind of experience.
If you have been a special/pcso/police staff you start on 22kpossesses a policing qualification as defined by the chief officer after consultation with the local policing body;
was, prior to appointment, serving as a Special Constable who has been assessed and has achieved ‘Safe and Lawful' attainment to National Standards, or the equivalent as specified by the chief officer;
was, prior to appointment, serving as a Police Community Support Officer who has been signed off as competent to perform independent patrol and who has served a minimum of 18 months in the role.
Pay point 1 is £22k.
Not sure why though - they still have to undergo the same training as somebody recruited straight off the street. Assuming they know more than they actually do and not giving the same level of training is a dangerous route to go down
Edited by Bigends on Sunday 24th July 12:53
Bigends said:
Defcon5 said:
Greendubber said:
Nope every officer starts at the same pay level and it only increases with length of service or promotion only, not life or any other kind of experience.
If you have been a special/pcso/police staff you start on 22kpossesses a policing qualification as defined by the chief officer after consultation with the local policing body;
was, prior to appointment, serving as a Special Constable who has been assessed and has achieved ‘Safe and Lawful' attainment to National Standards, or the equivalent as specified by the chief officer;
was, prior to appointment, serving as a Police Community Support Officer who has been signed off as competent to perform independent patrol and who has served a minimum of 18 months in the role.
Pay point 1 is £22k.
Not sure why though - they still have to undergo the same training as somebody recruited straight off the street. Assuming they know more than they actually do and not giving the same level of training is a dangerous route to go down
Edited by Bigends on Sunday 24th July 12:53
Greendubber said:
Bigends said:
Defcon5 said:
Greendubber said:
Nope every officer starts at the same pay level and it only increases with length of service or promotion only, not life or any other kind of experience.
If you have been a special/pcso/police staff you start on 22kpossesses a policing qualification as defined by the chief officer after consultation with the local policing body;
was, prior to appointment, serving as a Special Constable who has been assessed and has achieved ‘Safe and Lawful' attainment to National Standards, or the equivalent as specified by the chief officer;
was, prior to appointment, serving as a Police Community Support Officer who has been signed off as competent to perform independent patrol and who has served a minimum of 18 months in the role.
Pay point 1 is £22k.
Not sure why though - they still have to undergo the same training as somebody recruited straight off the street. Assuming they know more than they actually do and not giving the same level of training is a dangerous route to go down
Edited by Bigends on Sunday 24th July 12:53
Edited by Bigends on Sunday 24th July 16:08
Greendubber said:
Thats ridiculous, I honestly thought every probationer started on the same pay...... shame the CRTP was dropped for me as it took a decent amount of money from me.....
Yup I am in that boat too, bearing in mind i haven't had a pay rise for about 6 years anyway my take home pay since April has took another hit due to loss of CRTP, Increased NI contributions and a small drop in unsocial hours due to a new role. My flat 4 weekly take home pay this week was £133 less than the one I had in March.Pay is dropping year on year in real terms due to loss of CRTP, increased pension contributions etc, etc, etc. Our 1% rise in Spet will not even make up 25% of what I lost in April.
ED209 said:
Greendubber said:
Thats ridiculous, I honestly thought every probationer started on the same pay...... shame the CRTP was dropped for me as it took a decent amount of money from me.....
Yup I am in that boat too, bearing in mind i haven't had a pay rise for about 6 years anyway my take home pay since April has took another hit due to loss of CRTP, Increased NI contributions and a small drop in unsocial hours due to a new role. My flat 4 weekly take home pay this week was £133 less than the one I had in March.Pay is dropping year on year in real terms due to loss of CRTP, increased pension contributions etc, etc, etc. Our 1% rise in Spet will not even make up 25% of what I lost in April.
At least the MP's got their 10% though.... at least we dont have an unelected PM who exploited the only service with no industrial rights... oh hang on...
We should catch up with the pay scales in Sept or so I'm told.
mybrainhurts said:
Unless your name's Brunstrom...
Edited to foil the spelling police...
Dick's career was accelerated. He spent two (I think) years of his up-through-the-ranks career at university. Edited to foil the spelling police...
Edited by mybrainhurts on Sunday 24th July 17:25
Regardless of what you might think, Dick, despite nominative determinism ruling, is, or at least was, highly intelligent. He was quite pleasant to talk with. My feeling was that even if he had spent a few more years in lower ranks he still wouldn't have got a grip on what is important in police work and in life.
I had an argument with him when we were both inspectors as to the proper use of police resources. If what he'd done had hit the papers at the time and officers had not managed to cope with a serious incident without certain consequences the force would have been ridiculed and, possibly been held responsible.
Yet he just couldn't see what I was trying to say to him. It seemed that I was arguing with someone who was so assured of his superiority (which he was intellectually) that the experience of lesser beings (me and probably everyone else in his opinion) wasn't even worth arguing over.
A strange chap. Colleagues liked him (apart from those in competition with him) and he was quite chatty. He had different takes on established practices, which was good, but some clearly would not work, sometimes for pretty obvious reasons.
He can also be remarkably behind the times. Years, literally, after other senior officers spoke out against the way we were policing drugs Dick said exactly the same thing, seemingly, and I can't help but think probably, believing he thought of it first.
The world would be a worse place without the likes of Dick. However it is weirder place with him in it, so that's good. I just didn't see his place being in the police, and certainly not middle/upper management.
As mentioned, it seems very much a managerial role but again, depends on which area. My old man was Chief Inspector on traffic and ended up being the face you see in the papers, in charge of family liaison officers and was also a fatal crash investigator. I imagine it can be a fairly stressful but not very hands on role.
I see on Page 1 someone mentioned Inspector and Super roles you can dive straight in at... How is that even allowed, what a ridiculous idea!
I see on Page 1 someone mentioned Inspector and Super roles you can dive straight in at... How is that even allowed, what a ridiculous idea!
Derek Smith said:
Dick's career was accelerated. He spent two (I think) years of his up-through-the-ranks career at university.
Regardless of what you might think, Dick, despite nominative determinism ruling, is, or at least was, highly intelligent. He was quite pleasant to talk with. My feeling was that even if he had spent a few more years in lower ranks he still wouldn't have got a grip on what is important in police work and in life.
I had an argument with him when we were both inspectors as to the proper use of police resources. If what he'd done had hit the papers at the time and officers had not managed to cope with a serious incident without certain consequences the force would have been ridiculed and, possibly been held responsible.
...
Toads?Regardless of what you might think, Dick, despite nominative determinism ruling, is, or at least was, highly intelligent. He was quite pleasant to talk with. My feeling was that even if he had spent a few more years in lower ranks he still wouldn't have got a grip on what is important in police work and in life.
I had an argument with him when we were both inspectors as to the proper use of police resources. If what he'd done had hit the papers at the time and officers had not managed to cope with a serious incident without certain consequences the force would have been ridiculed and, possibly been held responsible.
...
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