Stopped for no reason. Do I have to hang around?

[Prof Prolapse]

I was recently stopped with a fellow biker by plod in a NSL. In their defense it is a blackspot, but I have a road legal bike, and I wasn't speeding.

They were pleasant so I was pleasant. I did however refuse to admit to speeding on the highways "on other days", despite repeatedly being asked to do so as part of the new informal attitude they seem to have. I responded along the lines of, "I don't answer hypotheticals that incriminate me, with two police officers present, especially when you are planning to lecture me if I do".

He proceeded to do so anyway, but thankfully rounded up after wasting about 10 minutes of my time when I demonstrated an existing awareness of the statistics he was hitting me over the head with.

So my question if it happens again, having committed no crime and not being suspected of any, can I not just decline the officers kind offer of a chat, and leave them by the side of the road?

[TheBear]

If they are not asking you for your licence or other docs (or you have produced them) then you are free to leave once you have stopped and established that.

If they suspected you of an offence then you must be cautioned immediately before any discussion/questions are asked about it. Even then you are free to leave (and must be told that) if you want to.

It just remains that if you have been cautioned then you may be reported for an offence should you want to leave and providing that your identity and a suitable address has been established then off you go. It might be that, if serious enough you'll be asked to have an interview (which you can delay to obtain legal advice) or be arrested at the roadside if the necessity criteria is met.

I always cringe a little when some officers on traffic stops say "do you know why I stopped you" without cautioning first as that obviously constitutes an interview and you are asking someone to potentially incriminate themselves.

Of course, there is no need to be rude about it and get all "I know my rights" about it. Jut simply be polite and ask if there is anything else, as if not then you'd like to crack on.

[bitchstewie]

I'm guessing there's no crime of "Refusing to speak to a Police Officer" but whenever I read threads like this I always find myself wondering why, when there's an easy way and a hard way, people would consider choosing the hard way?

[Digitalize]

I'd probably just treat it like anyone else who is rambling on, and start to imply that you have somewhere to be, but at the same time, just be nice and if they stop you in the future they might be nice back, if you're a dick they'll be a dick. Simple as that really.

[surveyor_101]

I think unless you have your driving licence your on a sticky wicket trying to leave before they want you to. If you get difficult with some cops they tend to be the same back. If they don't think they can establish your identify they can arrest you in theory. I always carry my licence, as it makes life a lot easier, most of the people who get into bother on telly seems to have no I'd on them, funny that.

Once you have not been accused of any crime, established your identity you should be free to go., if they caution you but won't arrest you there should be no further Reason for them to detain you.

I wouldn't get cocky but if they ask for you to answer questions , just say as per the caution you wish to remain silent and in that case will answer questions like that no comment.

Edited by surveyor_101 on Friday 12th August 16:54

[Prof Prolapse]

Thanks for the responses.

I find police generally very polite (even when booking me), so I'm always happy to reciprocate.

No caution or request for docs or even my address. Just an attempted, and prematurely aborted, lecture after being tailed by an unmarked for about 4 miles.

My mate says I should have left it alone but I felt I was respectful and the copper handled criticism of his approach professionally. His colleague did visibly snigger at some of my responses, so hopefully it was obvious I just wasn't interested in playing, rather than being a total dick.

I think perhaps I'm overcomplicating it. Next time I guess I'll just politely ask if they want to see my documents or can I be on my way as I don't really want to participate in their free roadside education session.

Edited by Prof Prolapse on Friday 12th August 17:02

[PlayFair]

Police need no reason to stop anyone traveling on a public road.

If you haven't been cautioned/arrested you are free to leave at any point.

Why not be amicable, have a pleasant conversation and shake their hand? - They're human too and i bet a few of them own bikes too so will share your passion.

They know as well as you that you'll blast past speed limits occasionally.

They would have been told by their sgt. to go do some form of 'traffic educating'

But if you start getting difficult - they can arrest you and take you to the nick and have your bike lifted to 'aid the investigation'

Edited by PlayFair on Friday 12th August 17:11

[mike74]

Similarly, is there an actual crime of 'making off' from the police?

The reason I ask is whenever I watch Police Interceptors etc and they stop someone after a pursuit they only ever seem to face charges of speeding, drink driving, twocing, drugs possession etc etc and never seem to face any charges related to the actual chase.

[carreauchompeur]

Am I being detained?
Am I being detained?
AM I BEING DETAINED?

[768]

bhstewie said:

I'm guessing there's no crime of "Refusing to speak to a Police Officer" but whenever I read threads like this I always find myself wondering why, when there's an easy way and a hard way, people would consider choosing the hard way?

Is the easy way the one that involves having to smile and nod while some self-important tt with no respect for other people's time listens to the sound of his own voice for an indefinite period of his choosing? Rather than trying to bring the conversation to a quick close, as politely as possible?

I struggle to tolerate that sort of behaviour even when I'm submitting an invoice for the time.

[Toilet Duck]

carreauchompeur said:

Am I being detained?
Am I being detained?
AM I BEING DETAINED?

If you watch the same youtube videos as me, you need to repeatedly alternate that with "AM I FREE TO GO?"

[Countdown]

768 said:

Is the easy way the one that involves having to smile and nod while some self-important tt with no respect for other people's time listens to the sound of his own voice for an indefinite period of his choosing? Rather than trying to bring the conversation to a quick close, as politely as possible?

I struggle to tolerate that sort of behaviour even when I'm submitting an invoice for the time.

The "self important tt" is probably doing it not to listen to his own voice but to avoid having to scrape up arrogant tts who thought they knew better....

[un1corn]

mike74 said:

Similarly, is there an actual crime of 'making off' from the police?

The reason I ask is whenever I watch Police Interceptors etc and they stop someone after a pursuit they only ever seem to face charges of speeding, drink driving, twocing, drugs possession etc etc and never seem to face any charges related to the actual chase.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1988/52/section/163

[JonV8V]

Depending where you were stopped it might be worth mentioning how dangerous it is to be stopped on a public highway.

Or.. "I'm going to need the toilet soon and while I'd given myself good time to get where I am going, this delay is compromising my bladder and I may be going before I get there... its am age thing".

There must be a funny retort that the a copper will smile at and let you get on your way.

[768]

Countdown said:

The "self important tt" is probably doing it not to listen to his own voice but to avoid having to scrape up arrogant tts who thought they knew better....

Sounds super effective.

[pim]

If you are stopped for no reason they are wasting theirs and your time.Yes it is dangerous on a motorbike or moped or any two wheeler.I picked up a chap he oher day who fell of his moped skidded on some oil on the road.

He was a bit shocked had some scrapes but ok.We had a natter checked him and his bike and he went on his way.Live is full of dangers.

[Prof Prolapse]

PlayFair said:

Why not be amicable, have a pleasant conversation and shake their hand? - They're human too and i bet a few of them own bikes too so will share your passion.

They know as well as you that you'll blast past speed limits occasionally.

They would have been told by their sgt. to go do some form of 'traffic educating'

But if you start getting difficult - they can arrest you and take you to the nick and have your bike lifted to 'aid the investigation'

Edited by PlayFair on Friday 12th August 17:11

I thought I was clear I was pleasant. I just wouldn't entertain him telling me what I know so brought the conversation to close after entertaining it long enough.

Let's be clear though, life is short, if you waste my time I'm not going to be happy about it. I'm not wanting a chat or to make friends, so I'll reciprocate any respect shown but ultimately I don't give a st about his reasons and I'm not going to be detained any longer than necessary. He's not my friend, he's wasting my time, so small talk is off the table.

As for impounding my bike for politely refusing to be lectured, as is apparently my legal right, that's utter nonsense.

[Stoofa]

mike74 said:

Similarly, is there an actual crime of 'making off' from the police?

The reason I ask is whenever I watch Police Interceptors etc and they stop someone after a pursuit they only ever seem to face charges of speeding, drink driving, twocing, drugs possession etc etc and never seem to face any charges related to the actual chase.

Probably because in the grand scale of things, it's the most minor of the offences.
You very rarely hear about anyone who shoots someone being charged with possession of a gun etc.

[creampuff]

bhstewie said:

I'm guessing there's no crime of "Refusing to speak to a Police Officer" but whenever I read threads like this I always find myself wondering why, when there's an easy way and a hard way, people would consider choosing the hard way?

Because it is easy to incriminate yourself and incriminating yourself may well be the only way to proceed with successful prosecution against you. I'd take the situation as it comes but if I thought there was any hint of fishing for a prosecution, then I would not say anything. Politely not say anything of course.

Edited by creampuff on Saturday 13th August 09:28

[4rephill]

creampuff said:

bhstewie said:

I'm guessing there's no crime of "Refusing to speak to a Police Officer" but whenever I read threads like this I always find myself wondering why, when there's an easy way and a hard way, people would consider choosing the hard way?

Because it is easy to incriminate yourself and incriminating yourself may well be the only way to proceed with successful prosecution against you. I'd take the situation as it comes but if I thought there was any hint of fishing for a prosecution, then I would not say anything. Politely not say anything of course.

Edited by creampuff on Saturday 13th August 09:28

By refusing to answer questions, being evasive with any answers you do give, being awkward with the Officer, or giving the Officer attitude as some on here seem to think is a clever thing to do, all you end up doing is make yourself look far more suspicious - As the old saying goes: "You reap what you sow!".

Added to that, if you've done nothing wrong, how can you incriminate yourself?

TBH, your post (amongst many others on PH), makes it sound as though you view our Police Officers as being just like the Stasi in the 50's/60's/70's, looking to fit people up and get a conviction on a single statement without any corroborating evidence whatsoever.

The reality is, the Police know that relying solely on a statement made to an Officer when questioned at the roadside/in the street without any corroborating evidence whatsoever is highly unlikely to result in a successful prosecution.

Personally speaking, I've always found that the best way of dealing with the Police is to be polite, contrite, honest and respectful (it helps that My parents brought Me up to always have respect for the Police).

Over the years, that theory has saved Me from losing My driving licence on at least four occasions, and has helped Me avoid picking up points on My licence on many more occasions (don't bother with the self righteous lectures - You'll be wasting your keyboard time!), so if you think being evasive and awkward with the Police is the right way to go, crack on and "stick it to the man!", but I'm pretty sure you'll just end up causing yourselves more roadside grief, and frankly, life's just too short for that st!

Myself? - I'll continue with being polite, contrite, honest and respectful as it's paid major dividends for Me over the years and saved Me from any roadside grief and aggravation.