Another disqualification question

[Moominho]

Hi all,

I know there are several threads on this topic, but I couldn't find any that are similar to my case.

I have had 6 points on my license for a while now, and have been trying to behave myself when behind the wheel. However there was a mobile camera van on a road near where I work. I popped into the office to drop off a letter - I was caught by the van on the way in doing 38 in a 30 zone, and on the way out 25 minutes later doing 37 in a 30 zone.

I replied to both cases and have now been invited to Magistrates court, their reason "To attend re disqualification"

I really would like to avoid a ban if possible. Does anyone have any tips on how to behave or what to say when I go? I don't really have any excuse, I was being a tw@t and not paying attention when I was driving.

Thank you

[anonymous-user]

Without wanting to sound glib, you need to hire a lawyer, as totting up may invoke a 6 month disqualification.

[RyanOPlasty]

Are they using invisible vans now?

[Moominho]

RyanOPlasty said:

Are they using invisible vans now?

I didn't see it. Either time

[xjay1337]

Trying to be careful.

Got caught doing 38 in a 30.. so that's an indicated 40-42mph in a 30.

Not really being careful if you ask me... !

I would hire a decent motoring lawyer, see if you can get the 2 fines on the same day done under one charge and end up with 9 points, or see if you can see to have a short 2 week ban or something.

Really a case for a decent LAWWWWYERRRR.

[spookly]

Yeah, that ^^

Time to lawyer up.

If the magistrates follow normal process then I expect those would definitely be two separate offences.
Even with a good lawyer I think he will need to channel the spirit of OJ Simpson to get them to take it as a single speeding offence. You had gone somewhere parked, turned off your car, got back in and then sped past them again. Doesn't say much for your observations either :-)

Maybe a lawyer could find a technicality....

Anyway... best of luck, I think you'll need it.

[Andy OH]

Looks like you need to go to Spec Savers.

I agree with a previous poster...the speed you were caught at is an indicated 40mph in your car. Sorry to say but you were not being careful were you!

Many years ago I had accumulated 9 points (two speeding and one traffic light offence, this was way before awareness courses were offered) and for six months, whilst waiting for the first three points to drop of my licnece I did not at any time or anywhere exceed the speed limit, which took an awful lot of concentration when my only means of transport was a Yamaha R1.

Best you get yourself a good lawyer or otherwise take a holiday if you lose your licence and learn from your mistake(s).

Edited by Andy OH on Monday 15th August 12:44

[speedking31]

But the point (sorry!) of incremental points leading to a totting up ban is to give the motorist the opportunity to modify their behaviour. Otherwise why not have an instant 6 month ban for any speeding offence? By applying 2 sets of points before the driver knows about the first is not giving them that opportunity. Mags should consider the reason for the existence of the points system and assess accordingly.

[Moominho]

Thanks all for your replies - next question then, can anyone recommend a lawyer in the Hertfordshire area? Or close to it?

[Black_S3]

Might sound silly, but the best a lawyer will do for you is avoid a ban if it causes unnecessary hardship. You would still be left with 0 points to play with...

Hate to say it but if you've been caught by the same van in both directions when being careful you're probably just wasting money delaying an inevitable ban trying to drive about with 12 points for months/years. Unless your current 6 have almost expired I'd personally go with the totting up ban and a clear licence after the ban..

[surveyor_101]

Or if you didn't mind lying, say your Mechanic or taxi driver, you have a disabled woman mother etc who relies one, get a woman your mums age and role her into court into a wheel chair.


If you play those cards right you will get a 7 day and small fine, bobs your uncle.

Mechanics and taxi drivers seem in my experience to get away with murder in magistrates courts.

[anonymous-user]

Very pragmatic approach. One consideration might be insurance. Do insurers weight heavily against a totting up code as opposed to a number of SP ones?

[surveyor_101]

janesmith1950 said:

Very pragmatic approach. One consideration might be insurance. Do insurers weight heavily against a totting up code as opposed to a number of SP ones?

Any ban is worse than having points, they look at length and fine only. Not whether it was one big offence or 4 minor ones.

Any excuse to charge you more normally insurers.

[Thurbs]

surveyor_101 said:

Or if you didn't mind lying, say your Mechanic or taxi driver, you have a disabled woman mother etc who relies one, get a woman your mums age and role her into court into a wheel chair.

Yes, good point as perjury sentencing guidelines don't include a driving ban... great advice.

[megaphone]

Do magistrate courts have duty solicitor?

[anonymous-user]

surveyor_101 said:

Any ban is worse than having points, they look at length and fine only. Not whether it was one big offence or 4 minor ones.

Any excuse to charge you more normally insurers.

Totting up has its own offence code, which I presume you'd need to declare come renewal time. Are you saying insurers don't take this offence into account?

Interesting if so.

[Black_S3]

surveyor_101 said:

If you play those cards right you will get a 7 day and small fine, bobs your uncle.

I've heard it's extremely rare for a totting up ban to be anything other than 6 months... Usually hardship ends up with no ban but still the points and a fine - hence the people you hear of getting up to 30 points etc.

The fine is surely banded to weekly salary, so surely no cards to play without lying? Or fairly fixed to the speeding offences.

Edited by Black_S3 on Monday 15th August 16:18

[blueg33]

xjay1337 said:

Trying to be careful.

Got caught doing 38 in a 30.. so that's an indicated 40-42mph in a 30.

Not all speedo's over read, why does PH constantly suggest that they do by quite a big margin, eg 38 to 42 is over 10%

Tested against GPS)

My Lotus is spot on up to about 100mph after that I am not interested in looking at the speedo or the nav
A6 over read at 40 mph by just 1 mph
Outback is 1mph over at 30mph
Tuscan over and under depending on the day

[Ki3r]

speedking31 said:

But the point (sorry!) of incremental points leading to a totting up ban is to give the motorist the opportunity to modify their behaviour. Otherwise why not have an instant 6 month ban for any speeding offence? By applying 2 sets of points before the driver knows about the first is not giving them that opportunity. Mags should consider the reason for the existence of the points system and assess accordingly.

The OPS was already on six points, so already been given a chance to modify their behaviour

[OverSteery]

speedking31 said:

But the point (sorry!) of incremental points leading to a totting up ban is to give the motorist the opportunity to modify their behaviour. Otherwise why not have an instant 6 month ban for any speeding offence? By applying 2 sets of points before the driver knows about the first is not giving them that opportunity. Mags should consider the reason for the existence of the points system and assess accordingly.

Where is it stated that this system is to allow the motorist is to modify their behaviour?

You could equally argue its to allow for the occasional lack of attention but punish the habitual speeder.