Using phone driving to increase to 6 points & £200 fine

Using phone driving to increase to 6 points & £200 fine

Author
Discussion

Willy Nilly

12,511 posts

166 months

Saturday 17th September 2016
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frisbee said:
Willy Nilly said:
'thing is, the roads are safer than they have every been and phone use has gone from pretty much zero to most drivers using them in cars in 20 years, yet there has been no corresponding spike in RTA's.

It is most certainly very irritating, but is it as dangerous as we are being lead to believe?
Why do you need statistics? Get in your car, find a good road, now look down in your lap.
Statistics would say that there has been x increase in phone use and the crash rates on the roads have broadly increased in line with increased phone use. However, phone use has clearly increased and KSI rates, for various reasons are lower now than they have ever been. So, is phone use as dangerous and killing as many people as we are being told? I'm thinking not, but certainly don't encourage it.

Phones may be a contributing factor in most accidents, but there are other factors too. The fact remains that KSI's on the UKsroads are at record low levels, save for the odd blip.

techguyone

3,137 posts

141 months

Saturday 17th September 2016
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caelite said:
Yes. Now get in your car, find a good road & hold your phone up above the steering wheel in eyeshot of your windscreen and select someone to dial and call. I can bet you will have a much easier job doing that than you would looking at your lap.

My argument is that people are going to do it anyway, why not allow them to do it as safely as possible, there is already legislation in place to prosecute drivers which dont do it safely (Driving without due care, dangerous driving etc). I completely agree that texting/facebooking/twittering well driving is bang out of order and completely unecessary however making a phone call is no more of a distraction than having a talktative kid or non-driver sitting in the passenger seat.

As other have pointed out phone use has consistantly gone up in recent years without corresponding accident statistics going up so it really is far less dangerous than many people seem to believe.
The problem with this, is that people take the piss, if phoning is allowed, people will take it further.
I'm willing to bet that more people are doing other things than texting/talking, I bet it's thnigs like FB, snapchat and similar.

Turn7

23,498 posts

220 months

Saturday 17th September 2016
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I drive about 2000 miles a month for work, a lot of it on motorways.

Im gobsmacked by the number of people driving with phones in their hand,or poking away at it on the screen mount.

Its geting genuinly scary out there.

EVERY SINGLE set of red lights, you now need to sound the horn as the car at the front is too busy txting to watch the lights....

Especially in London.

ferrariF50lover

1,834 posts

225 months

Saturday 17th September 2016
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Turn7 said:
I drive about 2000 miles a month for work, a lot of it on motorways.

Im gobsmacked by the number of people driving with phones in their hand,or poking away at it on the screen mount.

Its geting genuinly scary out there.

EVERY SINGLE set of red lights, you now need to sound the horn as the car at the front is too busy txting to watch the lights....

Especially in London.
Either you or I are very special indeed, because I've driven 450 miles today and I've not seen a single person on their phone, nor have I had to beep anyone at any set of lights.
In response to the giant vats of claptrap I read on here, I have made a point of watching people coming the other way on my commute (it's only short, but apparently LITERALLY EVERYONE is on their phones, so that shouldn't matter). In a week, I reckon I got a good look at 1000 people. Definitely one and possibly another two were using a phone.

Have any of you ever stopped to ask, if LITERALLY EVERYONE is using their phone LITERALLY ALL THE TIME and yet we still have the safest roads in the world, how dangerous can it really be? Or is it perhaps that it's not quite as prevalent as you're making out?

jith

2,752 posts

214 months

Saturday 17th September 2016
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ferrariF50lover said:
Turn7 said:
I drive about 2000 miles a month for work, a lot of it on motorways.

Im gobsmacked by the number of people driving with phones in their hand,or poking away at it on the screen mount.

Its geting genuinly scary out there.

EVERY SINGLE set of red lights, you now need to sound the horn as the car at the front is too busy txting to watch the lights....

Especially in London.
Either you or I are very special indeed, because I've driven 450 miles today and I've not seen a single person on their phone, nor have I had to beep anyone at any set of lights.
In response to the giant vats of claptrap I read on here, I have made a point of watching people coming the other way on my commute (it's only short, but apparently LITERALLY EVERYONE is on their phones, so that shouldn't matter). In a week, I reckon I got a good look at 1000 people. Definitely one and possibly another two were using a phone.

Have any of you ever stopped to ask, if LITERALLY EVERYONE is using their phone LITERALLY ALL THE TIME and yet we still have the safest roads in the world, how dangerous can it really be? Or is it perhaps that it's not quite as prevalent as you're making out?
I don't know where you're driving old son, but I can assure you that this is a major, serious problem in Paisley and Glasgow. I have to road test vehicles every day and find myself constantly avoiding the worst excesses of these mindless fools on their phones. The problem is, these devices are no longer phones. They are miniature computers with all the programmes installed to seriously distract a driver.

I would set the ban at a year at least and a 5 grand fine. That would definitely work!

J

stuttgartmetal

8,108 posts

215 months

Sunday 18th September 2016
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Won't make a blind bit of difference
I ride a 1200GSA to work in Fulham

Plod need to target this offence for it to grab thepublics attention
Like they did when the seatbelt law was introduced

Edited by stuttgartmetal on Sunday 18th September 23:20

speedking31

3,543 posts

135 months

Sunday 18th September 2016
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I agree with caelite. Given additional enforcement, persistent offenders will soon rack up 6 points anyway. Its the lack of enforcement, not the penalty, which is the issue.

caelite

4,273 posts

111 months

Sunday 18th September 2016
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speedking31 said:
I agree with caelite. Given additional enforcement, persistent offenders will soon rack up 6 points anyway. Its the lack of enforcement, not the penalty, which is the issue.
Sorry, just to clarify my position, I believe a (possibly small) majority of people can use there phones behind the wheel without it causing a large amount of distraction. Its a minority of people who find it necessary to take the piss which should be prosecuted using other legislation, allowing reasonable users to phone and drive in relative peace.

Its the people who are content to drive along giving driving the minimal amount of attention possible who in my opinion (delivery driver doing ~50k a year) are causing the most problems. These are the people who facebook (not with the phone to there ear, but infront of there face), the people who dont notice light changes, the people who slam on the anchors for no reason, the people who drive 10 below the limit and drive unpredictability when passed. It is these people, with no real interest in using our roads which are the problem. The state is just using minor speeders and all phone users as an easy scapegoat to make people think that they are actually doing something productive regarding road traffic. And im afraid to say it but a lot of people have bought into there utter guff.

anonymous-user

53 months

Sunday 18th September 2016
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As a first step to help enforcement become more widespread, couldn't all APNR/SPECS cameras be linked to machine vision software to recognise when someone is holding a phone to their ear?

Magic919

14,126 posts

200 months

Sunday 18th September 2016
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stuttgartmetal said:
Like they did when the seat elf law was introduced
I never carry one.

e21Mark

16,205 posts

172 months

Sunday 18th September 2016
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stuttgartmetal said:
Like they did when the seat elf law was introduced


Zedboy1200

813 posts

210 months

Sunday 18th September 2016
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speedking31 said:
I agree with caelite. Given additional enforcement, persistent offenders will soon rack up 6 points anyway. Its the lack of enforcement, not the penalty, which is the issue.
The practical solution.... For sure.

Plus target children (a la anti-smoking campaigns) to shame their parents every journey they do it. Joe Public doesn't care about public information alongside the 'it'll never happen to me brigade'", but they often change behaviour if their children drive the message

Steve H

5,224 posts

194 months

Sunday 18th September 2016
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worsy said:
Shoot me down, but I don't see the problem in stopped, waiting at lights in picking up your phone and reading a message/checking the time/ <some other small task>. Texting whilst driving is absolute stupidity though, however it could have been dealt with under existing Driving without Due Care legislation which already had the power to impose more points.
Agreed.

People shouldn't low themselves to be distracted by using a mobile phone but they are still allowed to drive while holding something that is on fire, allow themselves to be distracted by their offspring on the back seat and they are allowed on the road when they are simply lousy drivers and couldn't repass the test if their life depended on it.

There's been a couple of high profile cases where mobile use was a factor in accidents and six points is the political knee jerk reaction.

kowalski655

14,599 posts

142 months

Sunday 18th September 2016
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Perhaps, in addition, confiscate the phone at the roadside. A lot will lose a PAYG POS, but a lot will lose an expensive iPhone on contract that they will have to keep paying for.
Tell the phone company too so it can't be replaced on insurance as "stolen"

e21Mark

16,205 posts

172 months

Sunday 18th September 2016
quotequote all
Steve H said:
worsy said:
Shoot me down, but I don't see the problem in stopped, waiting at lights in picking up your phone and reading a message/checking the time/ <some other small task>. Texting whilst driving is absolute stupidity though, however it could have been dealt with under existing Driving without Due Care legislation which already had the power to impose more points.
Agreed.

People shouldn't low themselves to be distracted by using a mobile phone but they are still allowed to drive while holding something that is on fire, allow themselves to be distracted by their offspring on the back seat and they are allowed on the road when they are simply lousy drivers and couldn't repass the test if their life depended on it.

There's been a couple of high profile cases where mobile use was a factor in accidents and six points is the political knee jerk reaction.
I found easiest thing is to remove the phone from the equation and either put it in the glove box or in luggage in the boot. I seldom do journeys that are more than a few hours anyway and enjoy the break. Some folk seem to forget we managed perfectly well without mobile phones, so a couple of hours without staring at one, won't mean the world ends!

ferrariF50lover

1,834 posts

225 months

Sunday 18th September 2016
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jith said:
I don't know where you're driving old son, but I can assure you that this is a major, serious problem in Paisley and Glasgow. I have to road test vehicles every day and find myself constantly avoiding the worst excesses of these mindless fools on their phones. The problem is, these devices are no longer phones. They are miniature computers with all the programmes installed to seriously distract a driver.

I would set the ban at a year at least and a 5 grand fine. That would definitely work!

J
I must be a very special boy, because I can't think of a single time this year that I've had to take avoiding action for someone say, drifting onto my side of the road whatever. I think I did once have to toot a cabbie at a green light, but I've no idea whether that was phone related.

Pip1968

1,346 posts

203 months

Sunday 18th September 2016
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zarjaz1991 said:
Makes me laugh all the (presumably older) people going on about 'texting'.

Get with the programme....these idiots aren't 'texting', they are pissing about on Facebook, Whatsapp and other such vacuous crap.
You also have to laugh at the younger generation and their grasp of English. They spend so much time "texting" that their grammar and understanding of the language is often very poor. What is texting? The sending of electronic messages. My understand8ng is that you can do that on Whatsapp and 'Farcebook' as well as "other vacuous crap".

Pip

zarjaz1991

3,470 posts

122 months

Sunday 18th September 2016
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Pip1968 said:
You also have to laugh at the younger generation and their grasp of English. They spend so much time "texting" that their grammar and understanding of the language is often very poor. What is texting? The sending of electronic messages. My understand8ng is that you can do that on Whatsapp and 'Farcebook' as well as "other vacuous crap".

Pip
Not so. Nobody refers to sending Facebook messages or Whatsapp messages as "texting". Texting is used to refer to the specific activity of using the SMS facility on a mobile phone.

I don't use Facebook or Whatsapp but in my experience, those who do will just say 'message me', or the utterly horrendous 'inbox me', the less said about the latter the better.

And...do I look like I have a poor grasp of English? Age isn't always the deciding factor, I know people twice my age whose spelling and grammar is embarrassing. And their driving is atrocious too, but that's for another thread.

Pip1968

1,346 posts

203 months

Sunday 18th September 2016
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I think you missed my point. "Texting" is sending a message through electronic means usu. a phone. The fact that 'nobody' refers to sending a message through 'Farcebook' or Whatsapp as texting does not make it wrong or incorrect terminology. I am quite happy that in a court of law a case would not fall down because the accused sent a Farcebook message and not as stated a text/texted. Noboby of your generation may call it a text but most of mine do.

I and others may not use the latest terminology but then often the in words are just a contribution to destruction of the English language ie bad/good, wicked/great (?), inbox me/text a message to me that I can pick up in my inbox.

Maybe you were not clear or I have misunderstood but 'we' are 'with the programme' but just are sometimes less likely to use colloquialisms/slang.

Pip

zarjaz1991

3,470 posts

122 months

Sunday 18th September 2016
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Pip1968 said:
I think you missed my point. "Texting" is sending a message through electronic means usu. a phone. The fact that 'nobody' refers to sending a message through 'Farcebook' or Whatsapp as texting does not make it wrong or incorrect terminology. I am quite happy that in a court of law a case would not fall down because the accused sent a Farcebook message and not as stated a text/texted. Noboby of your generation may call it a text but most of mine do.

I and others may not use the latest terminology but then often the in words are just a contribution to destruction of the English language ie bad/good, wicked/great (?), inbox me/text a message to me that I can pick up in my inbox.

Maybe you were not clear or I have misunderstood but 'we' are 'with the programme' but just are sometimes less likely to use colloquialisms/slang.

Pip
Sorry. Not really interested in legal definitions and courts of law. In the real world, 'Texting' refers to using the SMS system. Absolutely nobody would ever use it to mean anything else, except perhaps trying to prove a non-point in a court of law.

Texting = SMS.