Police Officer Smashes Windscreen
Discussion
Cat said:
Bigends said:
No its not! Otherwise there'd be an offence of failing to quit a vehicle when requested
More semantics - it is an offence to fail to comply with a reasonable instruction given in the course of vehicle exam. If that reasonable instruction is to get out of the car then there doesn't need to be a specific offence of failing to quit the vehicle. Cat
Sunnysider said:
Just imagine being of a mindset where you honestly believed that this police officer hadn't behaved deplorably.
This place is like a lunatic asylum sometimes.
My mindset is one of a person who doesn't know the full story, and who doesn't believe anything about an even until he has all the relevant information.This place is like a lunatic asylum sometimes.
Bigends said:
..and if they didnt respond to that reasonable instruction theyd be obstructing the officer.
...and your point is? It is a specific offence to obstruct a vehicle examiner or to fail to comply with their reasonable instruction in connection with an exam. A driver can be required to get out of the vehicle as part of a vehicle exam they don't need to need to be arrested for this to happen.
Therefore your claim that someone cannot be required "unless under arrest or remaining in the car will obstruct a LAWFUL search" is wrong.
Cat
Cat said:
Bigends said:
..and if they didnt respond to that reasonable instruction theyd be obstructing the officer.
...and your point is? It is a specific offence to obstruct a vehicle examiner or to fail to comply with their reasonable instruction in connection with an exam. A driver can be required to get out of the vehicle as part of a vehicle exam they don't need to need to be arrested for this to happen.
Therefore your claim that someone cannot be required "unless under arrest or remaining in the car will obstruct a LAWFUL search" is wrong.
Cat
singlecoil said:
Sunnysider said:
Just imagine being of a mindset where you honestly believed that this police officer hadn't behaved deplorably.
This place is like a lunatic asylum sometimes.
My mindset is one of a person who doesn't know the full story, and who doesn't believe anything about an even until he has all the relevant information.This place is like a lunatic asylum sometimes.
Alpinestars said:
Terzo123 said:
If you're referring to the video in the op, then there are a few ways in which that driver could have been required to leave the car.
Like?Stop and search.
In the course of arrest.
Prevention of a crime.
Anything else?
I must stress that this is for Scotland, and there are various other scenarios but I don't have the time to go into them at the moment. At the end of the day it will be down to the officer to justify his actions.
Simple really, if a police officer asks you to get out of the car then just do it. If you speak with them the way you expect them to speak to you then they have no room to mistreat you.
Maybe he shouldn't have smashed the windscreen, they had him boxed in, keys out of ignition.
In hindsight is easy to say should have done this or that.
If he had done as he was asked then this would have been avoided.
Maybe he shouldn't have smashed the windscreen, they had him boxed in, keys out of ignition.
In hindsight is easy to say should have done this or that.
If he had done as he was asked then this would have been avoided.
Terzo123 said:
From a Scottish point of view, if the officer has reasonable cause to suspect the male is driving otherwise in accordance with a licence, although not an arrestable offence in itself, if the officer believes the driver is refusing to desist he can use common-law power's to Arrest. Alternatively If the officer believes the driver is driving otherwise in accordance with a licence and he can't confirm his identity, again he can arrest the male and take him to an office to confirm these details. Again reasonable force can be used to get the male out the car.
I must stress that this is for Scotland, and there are various other scenarios but I don't have the time to go into them at the moment. At the end of the day it will be down to the officer to justify his actions.
Scottish law can be different but those situation are covered by the RTA, details of which I've put up a page or two ago. It's an offence not to give certain details, and force can then be used to arrest. But the important point is that it requires an arrest. That doesn't appear to be the case here. I must stress that this is for Scotland, and there are various other scenarios but I don't have the time to go into them at the moment. At the end of the day it will be down to the officer to justify his actions.
If I get pulled over and give my name, address and provide my licence, insurance and MOT, there is no requirement to get out of car. See RTA. I can provide the licence, insurance and MOT within 7 days - but these days, those details can be confirmed immediately.
If I don't provide my name and address, or the PC believes I've not given my correct details, I've committed a crime, for which I can be arrested.
benjijames28 said:
Simple really, if a police officer asks you to get out of the car then just do it. If you speak with them the way you expect them to speak to you then they have no room to mistreat you.
Maybe he shouldn't have smashed the windscreen, they had him boxed in, keys out of ignition.
In hindsight is easy to say should have done this or that.
If he had done as he was asked then this would have been avoided.
If there's no obligation to get out, which appears to be the case, it might as well be me asking you to get out of your car, and then proceeding to vandalise your car because you refused my request. Maybe he shouldn't have smashed the windscreen, they had him boxed in, keys out of ignition.
In hindsight is easy to say should have done this or that.
If he had done as he was asked then this would have been avoided.
Alpinestars said:
Sunnysider said:
Just imagine being of a mindset where you honestly believed that this police officer hadn't behaved deplorably.
This place is like a lunatic asylum sometimes.
There's a few on here, including some coppers. Frightening. This place is like a lunatic asylum sometimes.
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