Police Officer Smashes Windscreen
Discussion
Cat said:
carinaman said:
Rather than PH BiB making sniping comments about other PHers they could read the book?
What sniping comments? Cat
The thought that Dondadda was Eclassy hadn't crossed my mind. I can't be bothered to look for evidence to support such an assertion or doubt. Partially as I can't be bothered, but also because it has nothing to do with the thread or the conduct of PC Savage.
Cat, sorry I went back and edited, double dipped.
vonhosen said:
It's not all you've heard, you've heard wait for the full investigation & it's conclusion.
I've seen some closing of ranks, arrogance and an inability to debate the potential wrongs of something so public, and which rightly or wrongly has elicited a strong negative response from the public, who they are supposed to me serving. Alpinestars said:
vonhosen said:
It's not all you've heard, you've heard wait for the full investigation & it's conclusion.
I've seen some closing of ranks, arrogance and an inability to debate the potential wrongs of something so public, and which rightly or wrongly has elicited a strong negative response from the public, who they are supposed to me serving. Inability to debate? People have explained their view point numerous times and you've constantly repeated yourself as you simply cannot accept them.
Greendubber said:
Hardly, you've seen no closing of ranks at all.
Inability to debate? People have explained their view point numerous times and you've constantly repeated yourself as you simply cannot accept them.
And you are one of those that my comments are aimed at. I'm genuinely surprised at yours and one or two others' reaction and comments. Inability to debate? People have explained their view point numerous times and you've constantly repeated yourself as you simply cannot accept them.
Never been in trouble with the police, middle class, not a DJ, rapper, came into this with a genuine curiosity as to legalities, no axe to grind etc etc.
I think most sensible people will wait until all the evidence has been investigated properly before making any judgement. There is a lot of prejudice ( in it's most literal sense) being displayed on this thread. That often seems to be the way in PH.
Most of the comments from those I know to be police, have been of the 'wait and see' variety. I can't recall much arrogance to be fair.
Most of the comments from those I know to be police, have been of the 'wait and see' variety. I can't recall much arrogance to be fair.
Alpinestars said:
Greendubber said:
Hardly, you've seen no closing of ranks at all.
Inability to debate? People have explained their view point numerous times and you've constantly repeated yourself as you simply cannot accept them.
And you are one of those that my comments are aimed at. I'm genuinely surprised at yours and one or two others' reaction and comments. Inability to debate? People have explained their view point numerous times and you've constantly repeated yourself as you simply cannot accept them.
Never been in trouble with the police, middle class, not a DJ, rapper, came into this with a genuine curiosity as to legalities, no axe to grind etc etc.
XCP said:
I think most sensible people will wait until all the evidence has been investigated properly before making any judgement. There is a lot of prejudice ( in it's most literal sense) being displayed on this thread. That often seems to be the way in PH.
Most of the comments from those I know to be police, have been of the 'wait and see' variety. I can't recall much arrogance to be fair.
Maybe have a read back. Playing the man etc was used, I've made genuine attempts to debate and the response from some has been "it's been explained to you". As a bystander, it doesn't reflect well. That's not aimed at you. Most of the comments from those I know to be police, have been of the 'wait and see' variety. I can't recall much arrogance to be fair.
Greendubber said:
I'm sure you would rather police officers await all information and evidence when looking at an incident and not take everything at face value though. Thats what I'd do if I was investigating an allegation made towards you and I'm sure thats what you would expect me to do, why is it wrong to do so here?
Nothing wrong with a proper investigation. And it's absolutely the right course of action. But your views have been somewhat partisan. You've outright refused to explain points because you either can't (that's being kind to you or maybe me) or you don't want to because you don't understand them yourself. I've asked you politely, but you and ANO have "played the man". I can't be arsed responding in kind because it just reflects badly. Especially on someone who needs the public to be onside.
Alpinestars said:
Greendubber said:
I'm sure you would rather police officers await all information and evidence when looking at an incident and not take everything at face value though. Thats what I'd do if I was investigating an allegation made towards you and I'm sure thats what you would expect me to do, why is it wrong to do so here?
Nothing wrong with a proper investigation. And it's absolutely the right course of action. But your views have been somewhat partisan. You've outright refused to explain points because you either can't (that's being kind to you or maybe me) or you don't want to because you don't understand them yourself. I've asked you politely, but you and ANO have "played the man". I can't be arsed responding in kind because it just reflects badly. Especially on someone who needs the public to be onside.
Greendubber said:
You asked which powers could be used and someone told you. You dont agree with it, thats fair enough but there is no need to keep going around the houses is there?
No, it's not that I don't agree. You're happy wasting ink debating now. But you weren't willing to debate a point where I'm pretty sure you're wrong (in a diplomatic way). But I've equally said that if I am wrong, I'll eat shed loads of humble pie. The worst answers are those that say "just", "that's how it is, lump it or like it", "it's been explained so go away". Maybe I'm just a bit slow . It's easy to be dismissive and flippant on t'internet, but I really do hope you're better at dealing with people whilst carrying our your duties.
Alpinestars said:
Greendubber said:
You asked which powers could be used and someone told you. You dont agree with it, thats fair enough but there is no need to keep going around the houses is there?
No, it's not that I don't agree. You're happy wasting ink debating now. But you weren't willing to debate a point where I'm pretty sure you're wrong (in a diplomatic way). But I've equally said that if I am wrong, I'll eat shed loads of humble pie. The worst answers are those that say "just", "that's how it is, lump it or like it", "it's been explained so go away". Maybe I'm just a bit slow . It's easy to be dismissive and flippant on t'internet, but I really do hope you're better at dealing with people whilst carrying our your duties.
All I know is that I have been subject to questioning in mags & crown court and under complaint situations regarding the use of force and I have never had any cause for concern regarding my knowledge over the last 10 years or any complaints upheld against me. I'm quite confident I know what I am talking about, if you want to disagree with me then fill your boots.
Greendubber said:
You thought the police officers were wrong that had explained the use of force to you, there is no point in me or them repeating themselves is there, its utterly pointless to keep on saying each other is wrong.
All I know is that I have been subject to questioning in mags & crown court and under complaint situations regarding the use of force and I have never had any cause for concern regarding my knowledge over the last 10 years or any complaints upheld against me. I'm quite confident I know what I am talking about, if you want to disagree with me then fill your boots.
There you go again. No point wasting time debating but you can spend time typing all that. All I know is that I have been subject to questioning in mags & crown court and under complaint situations regarding the use of force and I have never had any cause for concern regarding my knowledge over the last 10 years or any complaints upheld against me. I'm quite confident I know what I am talking about, if you want to disagree with me then fill your boots.
Saying you're right doesn't make you right.
Alpinestars said:
Greendubber said:
You thought the police officers were wrong that had explained the use of force to you, there is no point in me or them repeating themselves is there, its utterly pointless to keep on saying each other is wrong.
All I know is that I have been subject to questioning in mags & crown court and under complaint situations regarding the use of force and I have never had any cause for concern regarding my knowledge over the last 10 years or any complaints upheld against me. I'm quite confident I know what I am talking about, if you want to disagree with me then fill your boots.
There you go again. No point wasting time debating but you can spend time typing all that. All I know is that I have been subject to questioning in mags & crown court and under complaint situations regarding the use of force and I have never had any cause for concern regarding my knowledge over the last 10 years or any complaints upheld against me. I'm quite confident I know what I am talking about, if you want to disagree with me then fill your boots.
Saying you're right doesn't make you right.
And see my last sentence.
Alpinestars said:
Maybe have a read back. Playing the man etc was used, I've made genuine attempts to debate and the response from some has been "it's been explained to you". As a bystander, it doesn't reflect well. That's not aimed at you.
I think people get tired of repeating themselves. The law governing the use of force has been linked to and explained many many times. At the end of the day the PC has to be able to justify his use of force. If he can, fine. If he can't, he is for the high jump.And the only way that will be resolved is by investigating ALL the circumstances surrounding the incident in a level headed and dispassionate manner.
None of us are in a position to do that, so we will all have to wait and see. Anything else is just so much froth.
XCP said:
Alpinestars said:
Maybe have a read back. Playing the man etc was used, I've made genuine attempts to debate and the response from some has been "it's been explained to you". As a bystander, it doesn't reflect well. That's not aimed at you.
I think people get tired of repeating themselves. The law governing the use of force has been linked to and explained many many times. At the end of the day the PC has to be able to justify his use of force. If he can, fine. If he can't, he is for the high jump.And the only way that will be resolved is by investigating ALL the circumstances surrounding the incident in a level headed and dispassionate manner.
None of us are in a position to do that, so we will all have to wait and see. Anything else is just so much froth.
Alpinestars said:
vonhosen said:
It's not all you've heard, you've heard wait for the full investigation & it's conclusion.
I've seen some closing of ranks, arrogance and an inability to debate the potential wrongs of something so public, and which rightly or wrongly has elicited a strong negative response from the public, who they are supposed to me serving. Edited by vonhosen on Wednesday 28th September 22:53
Alpinestars said:
Greendubber said:
It took all of 40 seconds?
You type quickly. Try showing just a touch of humility. Go on. It won't hurt and you might learn something, and if not, you'll be more endearing to the public you serve. Enjoy your evening officer.
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