Accelerating whilst being overtaken

[Efbe]

mko9 said:

Rear ending you is about the only thing they can do that can affect you, in which case they are at fault. But as I said, the vast majority of the time once you are past them you never see them again.

MKO, I think most drivers, especially the advanced ones will completely dissagree with you on this one.
It is always best to have rubbish drivers in front of you rather than behind.

Who cares who's fault it is you got rear-ended when you are in a ditch or dead?

Tailgating, aggressive driving, poor overtakes in daft places are what you should expect, all which you cannot control. Drive behind them and you can set the space between you and avoid any chance of a collision.

[cmaguire]

Efbe said:

MKO, I think most drivers, especially the advanced ones will completely dissagree with you on this one.
It is always best to have rubbish drivers in front of you rather than behind.

Who cares who's fault it is you got rear-ended when you are in a ditch or dead?

Tailgating, aggressive driving, poor overtakes in daft places are what you should expect, all which you cannot control. Drive behind them and you can set the space between you and avoid any chance of a collision.

The best answer to this is 'who is faster?'. If you are faster then you will stay in front and there is no issue. If you get caught in the next village then so what, they aren't rear ending you and causing you any grief there. If they are faster, let them past and stop thinking about it.

[Johnnytheboy]

Part of the problem IMO is that the speed-limit-obeying but rapidly accelerating driver is quite a recent phenomenon.

Until not many years ago, a driver that rigidly obeyed a 30 limit was vanishingly unlikely to accelerate hard on leaving it.

So a lot of drivers will not be prepared for this style of driving.

I'll be honest, if I encounter someone doing this I assume they are trying to make a point.

[cmaguire]

Johnnytheboy said:

Part of the problem IMO is that the speed-limit-obeying but rapidly accelerating driver is quite a recent phenomenon.

Until not many years ago, a driver that rigidly obeyed a 30 limit was vanishingly unlikely to accelerate hard on leaving it.

So a lot of drivers will not be prepared for this style of driving.

I'll be honest, if I encounter someone doing this I assume they are trying to make a point.

So who is worse? The driver who wants to be going faster but obeys the urban limits because they appreciate why they should, then when leaving urban areas increases speed quickly and often significantly. Or the driver who does 45 in the urban areas and not much more out of them?

[Johnnytheboy]

cmaguire said:

So who is worse? The driver who wants to be going faster but obeys the urban limits because they appreciate why they should, then when leaving urban areas increases speed quickly and often significantly. Or the driver who does 45 in the urban areas and not much more out of them?

I'm not making any value judgement.

I'm just remarking that the kind of driver that rigidly obeys low limits but drives fast out of them is only a recent invention IME.

Assuming I'm not alone in thinking this, a lot of drivers will assume someone doing 29.9 recurring is not going to floor it at the NSL sign and think they are safe to overtake.

[cmaguire]

Johnnytheboy said:

I'm not making any value judgement.

I'm just remarking that the kind of driver that rigidly obeys low limits but drives fast out of them is only a recent invention IME.

Assuming I'm not alone in thinking this, a lot of drivers will assume someone doing 29.9 recurring is not going to floor it at the NSL sign and think they are safe to overtake.

I've been doing that for years. Occasionally the 45 everywhere will go for the overtake 200M before the 30 ends and I let them go. If they do it 50M before they tediously hold me up but I still put up with it, as accelerating to stop someone overtaking is bad etiquette and sometimes dangerous. I don't get angry and I don't have a point to prove.

[Davidonly]

In order to cover ground on frequent long drives too and from NW Scotland in the 1980's (as a lad) I learned the following.

Local drivers are erratic, speed varies, they are easily distracted. Some appear to be motoring along at first, but lose concentration. Many are quite quick on a straight and not thru bends. Most don't overtake very effectively and so add to the mobile chicane you are about to encounter 4 miles ahead and hence tend to add to your 5-hour run. They are going 15-30 miles, I am going 350.... I could save an hour easily by pressing on and still can on a good run through the countryside / most NSL type roads.

So my strategy became to pass everything whenever a safe opportunity presents (including bikes once I got a decent car) no matter how fast they appear to be travelling when you encounter them. Equally, try not to lose ground to anyone else as once they are in front, they always slow you down later (nearly always - a few vanish into the distance but very rare). Even as a younger driver I would not speed in villages or exceed limit point or other safety related, common sense 'rules' around use of public roads.

So the OP's situation is one where un-winding a aggressive / opportunistic WVM pass is more likely to add delay for me than not, so I'd rather hedge and keep them out of my way. I would not under any circumstances 'race' them tho.

I'd accelerate briskly and see where the WVM ends up relative to me before deciding whether or not to extend my acceleration, but hope that I can keep them behind. Speed limits are irrelevant unless in a ping zone (Scamera van revenue collection area) to the execution of this strategy, whereas hidden entrances, road conditions etc are of course to be taken into account.

Risk to either party would be the key decision point so it might be necessary to maintain speed and let/help a nutter in - but as I say I'd rather stay on the gas and maintain my own average speed for my very long journey.

Given the crude options presented in the survey 'floor it' is closest.

[TWR]

Have you a clean Driving licence Dave? you come across as a very aggressive driver! you want to learn to ease off a bit, we all want to get from A To B Quickly but I want to get there in stressed, 40+ years of HGV Driving has taught me that, from what I read into your post your a Heart attack waiting to happen,

[Rubber-Ducky]

Johnnytheboy said:

Part of the problem IMO is that the speed-limit-obeying but rapidly accelerating driver is quite a recent phenomenon.

Until not many years ago, a driver that rigidly obeyed a 30 limit was vanishingly unlikely to accelerate hard on leaving it.

So a lot of drivers will not be prepared for this style of driving.

I'll be honest, if I encounter someone doing this I assume they are trying to make a point.

A valid point. I'm not, by any means, a speed limit pedant. I endeavour to stick to limits in built up areas, but as long as I'm below the +10%+2 prosecution threshold then I don't get excited.

This particular village, however, clearly has a vociferous group of anti-speeding residents. As well as the previously mentioned community speed watch, there are also a multitude of "Kill your speed" and "Police operate in this area"* signs attached to lampposts in the village. I travel through the village twice a day on my commute and really don't want to give the residents any ammunition to demand additional traffic calming measures. Hence, I stick rigidly to the limit. It's certainly not to make a point against other drivers.

If I choose to exceed a speed limit (or indeed break any law), it is on the understanding that I might get prosecuted for doing so. If I'm going to get 3 points on my licence, then I'd rather do so having a good hoon in the countryside than doing 37mph through a built up area. Knowing what the crossover point from FPN to court appearance also allows me to make an informed decision about the potential consequences of my actions. All hypothetically speaking, of course.

• Are there areas in which the police do not operate..?

[wack]

I would have let him past then overtaken him straight away presuming it's a 60, then been prepared to put up with the headlight flashing until you're out of sight because whatever you do you're, that dick that held him up in the 30, that dick that floored it when he tried to overtake, that dick that let me overtake then floored it past me.

no win situation, many times I've performed a safe overtake of a st box doing 40 in a 60 to see lights flashing behind me, I just assume now they have a dashcam and will be showing it to the highest authority in the land to get satisfaction

[Don]

MagicalTrevor said:

Highway Code - Rule 168
Being overtaken. If a driver is trying to overtake you, maintain a steady course and speed, slowing down if necessary to let the vehicle pass. Never obstruct drivers who wish to pass. Speeding up or driving unpredictably while someone is overtaking you is dangerous. Drop back to maintain a two-second gap if someone overtakes and pulls into the gap in front of you.

This. Then, if the van holds you up in the NSL, overtake it. I guarantee that this annoys them far more. And if he doesn't hold you up? Then he was right to overtake.

I always wait until after I pass the NSL sign before I accelerate. This means the drivers who are happy to accelerate the moment they see it coming up overtake me. I've seen more than one drive directly into the speed trap doing 45-50 in a thirty just before they leave it. That's ban territory. I'm not making that mistake...

Edited by Don on Sunday 4th December 11:38

[DonkeyApple]

wibble cb said:

I was under the impression the highway code states you must allow an overtaking vehicle to,well,overtake!
You should not increase your own speed,as this increases the 'window of danger' moment.

Anyway we all know a van is way faster than any other vehicle know to man, so why argue?

I suspect the issue arises as you know for a fact that he isn't over taking you as you are accelerating faster than he can at the point that he has begun to think that he overtaking. In reality, all he is actually doing is driving slower than you and in the oncoming lane and even the dumbest van driver will eventually work out that he was mistaken.

Generally, I think that when you're the car in front in that situation you just need to be honest. If he has started his manoeuvre before you've started your acceleration then it's fair to say he is overtaking and you should let him go and help if needed by slowing. If however you are genuinely accelerating before he commences then he isn't overtaking but just driving on the wrong side of the road.

This is assuming your car has a big acceleration advantage to the one behind. You can imagine that if they are reasonably matched or it's not obvious that yours is faster then the chap behind may be competitively incentivised to stay out and try and out run you so in that instance I would just lift off from accelerating and let them go and just hope they then don't slow up.

[Rubber-Ducky]

Don said:

...I've seen more than one drive directly into the speed trap doing 45-50 in a thirty just before they leave it. That's ban territory. I'm not making that mistake...

Really? I thought up to 49mph in a 30 limit was a FPN with 3 points. 50+ and you're off to court, but not necessarily looking at a ban.

Edited by Rubber-Ducky on Sunday 4th December 13:12

[wack]

Don said:

I've seen more than one drive directly into the speed trap doing 45-50 in a thirty just before they leave it. That's ban territory. I'm not making that mistake

And they've extended the 30 at the exit of many villages so you start to feel like that car a foot behind you has a point.

[Centurion07]

Rubber-Ducky said:

Really? I thought up to 49mph in a 30 limit was a FPN with 3 points. 50+ and you're off to court, but not necessarily looking at a ban.

Can't remember the exact figure but 40/45% over the limit will see you in proper trouble.

[anonymous-user]

wack said:

I would have let him past then overtaken him straight away presuming it's a 60, then been prepared to put up with the headlight flashing until you're out of sight because whatever you do you're, that dick that held him up in the 30, that dick that floored it when he tried to overtake, that dick that let me overtake then floored it past me.

Correct. You'd be that dick who etc. etc.....

[simoid]

Rubber-Ducky said:

• Are there areas in which the police do not operate..?

Donald Trump told me huge swathes of London are basically Aleppo.

[theboss]

Davidonly said:

In order to cover ground on frequent long drives too and from NW Scotland in the 1980's (as a lad) I learned the following.

Local drivers are erratic, speed varies, they are easily distracted. Some appear to be motoring along at first, but lose concentration. Many are quite quick on a straight and not thru bends. Most don't overtake very effectively and so add to the mobile chicane you are about to encounter 4 miles ahead and hence tend to add to your 5-hour run. They are going 15-30 miles, I am going 350.... I could save an hour easily by pressing on and still can on a good run through the countryside / most NSL type roads.

So my strategy became to pass everything whenever a safe opportunity presents (including bikes once I got a decent car) no matter how fast they appear to be travelling when you encounter them. Equally, try not to lose ground to anyone else as once they are in front, they always slow you down later (nearly always - a few vanish into the distance but very rare). Even as a younger driver I would not speed in villages or exceed limit point or other safety related, common sense 'rules' around use of public roads.

So the OP's situation is one where un-winding a aggressive / opportunistic WVM pass is more likely to add delay for me than not, so I'd rather hedge and keep them out of my way. I would not under any circumstances 'race' them tho.

I'd accelerate briskly and see where the WVM ends up relative to me before deciding whether or not to extend my acceleration, but hope that I can keep them behind. Speed limits are irrelevant unless in a ping zone (Scamera van revenue collection area) to the execution of this strategy, whereas hidden entrances, road conditions etc are of course to be taken into account.

Risk to either party would be the key decision point so it might be necessary to maintain speed and let/help a nutter in - but as I say I'd rather stay on the gas and maintain my own average speed for my very long journey.

Given the crude options presented in the survey 'floor it' is closest.

Amen.

This is totally consistent with my own observations and driving style on rural A/B roads. I live in the Welsh Marches and undertake long predominantly rural NSL journies every week.

There is also a self-righteous sense among slower / short distance drivers that you shouldn't need to go faster - a presumption that you'll only save a few minutes on your journey time and are therefore impatient. This usually results in others beig actively obstructive in attempting to hinder and thwart overtaking attempts. What I see increasingly now is an engineered drama which involves the overtaken seeking to close an otherwise safe gap only to flash, gesture and tailgate. My strategy now is to just do it quickly and authoratitively as soon as the safe opportunity presents, though having a 660 lb ft and 750bhp daily helps in this regard.

In terms of the OP's situation it depends... if I was already accelerating and the van was nearly alongside me I'd back right off and let it pass. I'd overtake it later if holding me up. I'd never hang anyone out to dry - once he looks committed to passing I'd help him past. If he were well and truly behind me, I was already accelerating and there was little speed difference - ie he would have to remain committed to accelerating hard to pass - I'd do what the OP did and just take off.

Edited by theboss on Sunday 4th December 20:15

[MiggyA]

Johnnytheboy said:

Part of the problem IMO is that the speed-limit-obeying but rapidly accelerating driver is quite a recent phenomenon.

Until not many years ago, a driver that rigidly obeyed a 30 limit was vanishingly unlikely to accelerate hard on leaving it.

So a lot of drivers will not be prepared for this style of driving.

I'll be honest, if I encounter someone doing this I assume they are trying to make a point.

OK, I'm genuinely a bit mystified by your last sentence there, what point is it you think they are trying to make?

[Vaud]

theboss said:

My strategy now is to just do it quickly and authoratitively as soon as the safe opportunity presents, though having a 660 lb ft and 750bhp daily helps in this regard.

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The embodiment of PH? Are you also a powerfully built director?