Can you be forced to drive at work?
Discussion
My wife has never driven since passing her test a few years ago when our son was born. She works in a small firm where tittle tattle is rife and someone has complained she uses public transport to get to and from site visits. Her employer has said she must start driving next year despite working during travel time.
In short is this enforceable? I couldnt find anything either way on the topic.
In short is this enforceable? I couldnt find anything either way on the topic.
I think if she goes on site visits as part of her job and she can drive, then I don't think it's unreasonable to insist she drives. It's quicker so she'll have less time away from the office, and no doubt cheaper for the firm who have to pay transport costs.
But they cannot make her use her own car. (especially as she hasn't got one!)
But they cannot make her use her own car. (especially as she hasn't got one!)
The counter argument to this is known as "grey fleet" use - employees using their own vehicles for company use, but using their own fuel, insurance etc and claiming mileage.
As an employee, technically their should be business use insurance cover, but it's rare that this is in place, and if it is, costed for by the employer. Similarly, there are no fleet checks on the grey fleet - how does the fleet manager for the employer know if the car is safe to be on the road?
If the employer insists on the person driving from next year, they should either be provided with a vehicle, or the employer should have a robust duty of care policy that covers both them, and the driver. This is worth a read - http://files.fleetnews.co.uk/Managing_Grey_Fleets....
As an employee, technically their should be business use insurance cover, but it's rare that this is in place, and if it is, costed for by the employer. Similarly, there are no fleet checks on the grey fleet - how does the fleet manager for the employer know if the car is safe to be on the road?
If the employer insists on the person driving from next year, they should either be provided with a vehicle, or the employer should have a robust duty of care policy that covers both them, and the driver. This is worth a read - http://files.fleetnews.co.uk/Managing_Grey_Fleets....
joebongo said:
My wife has never driven since passing her test a few years ago
But she does have a current valid driving licence, and there's no particular reason (other than personal preference) for her not to?joebongo said:
someone has complained she uses public transport to get to and from site visits. Her employer has said she must start driving next year
Is her travel taking significantly longer than it would otherwise do as a result? If so, it doesn't seem unreasonable.joebongo said:
In short is this enforceable?
I can't read her contract or any employee handbooks from here. Is holding a driving licence a requirement for her position?If she can drive, but doesn't want to, and that preference is causing her to take much longer to perform her job than it should do, then I can see why her boss might be aggrieved. Is the work that she's doing on the public transport commercially confidential? If so then, again, that might be a problem.
Sounds like it should be easily resolved without getting too uppity on either side, but the easiest solution might just be for her to get over whatever's stopping her from driving.
It really does come down to contract. If the contract says "must provide and use own car", then be very careful. you WILL need to inform your insurers and get business insurance.
If the employment contract doesn't mention using own car, I'd tell them this is not an option as you don't have a car available (even if you do, they can't prove you haven't lent it to son/daughter/significant other).
I don't think it is out of order to employ someone on the basis they provide transport, but this must be done properly.
If there is any difference between the mileage rate paid and the HMRC mileage rates, then the difference is tax deductable.
If the employment contract doesn't mention using own car, I'd tell them this is not an option as you don't have a car available (even if you do, they can't prove you haven't lent it to son/daughter/significant other).
I don't think it is out of order to employ someone on the basis they provide transport, but this must be done properly.
If there is any difference between the mileage rate paid and the HMRC mileage rates, then the difference is tax deductable.
TwigtheWonderkid said:
I
But they cannot make her use her own car. (especially as she hasn't got one!)
There's the kicker. Unless her job offer/contract stated/states that car ownership was a requirement and that occasional business use of it was also a requirement then she does not have to drive her own car.But they cannot make her use her own car. (especially as she hasn't got one!)
They'll have to maintain a pool car that she and other employees can use. If that would mean that only she would drive it they'll be happy with the public transport option.
Having said this - it may not go down well. But they can't force her to buy a car.
Don said:
TwigtheWonderkid said:
But they cannot make her use her own car. (especially as she hasn't got one!)
There's the kicker. Unless her job offer/contract stated/states that car ownership was a requirement and that occasional business use of it was also a requirement Thanks for all the opinions. It is a confidence thing and there is nothing in her contract. She has been there nearly 3 years or more now.
She is well aware she needs to get her s
t together on a personal basis but the concept of suddenly doing 60 mile round trips is not good. Essentially she is a near passing learner again in competency terms and I wouldn't send her to the corner shop never mind negotiate the great unwashed.
She is well aware she needs to get her s
t together on a personal basis but the concept of suddenly doing 60 mile round trips is not good. Essentially she is a near passing learner again in competency terms and I wouldn't send her to the corner shop never mind negotiate the great unwashed.It's fair enough that she's nervous, my wife was the same for a long time. Even now she's terrified of the motorway but she'll just get on with it.
Thing is it's the trips to the corner shop that help to improve confidence that will then open up the longer trips.
This is obviously nothing to do with the work driving thing, but it sounds like getting out in the car and getting some confidence wouldn't be a bad thing.
Thing is it's the trips to the corner shop that help to improve confidence that will then open up the longer trips.
This is obviously nothing to do with the work driving thing, but it sounds like getting out in the car and getting some confidence wouldn't be a bad thing.
No employer in their right mind would force a self-confessed not confident driver to drive on company business. H&S 101.
If the employer wants it to happen then they will have to provide the wherewithal - driver training etc.
Assuming there are no conditions of employment requiring your wife to drive, the best outcome would be for her and her employer to agree a course of action, ... (them paying for) training, her practising etc to get her there. Sounds a win-win to me.
Bert
If the employer wants it to happen then they will have to provide the wherewithal - driver training etc.
Assuming there are no conditions of employment requiring your wife to drive, the best outcome would be for her and her employer to agree a course of action, ... (them paying for) training, her practising etc to get her there. Sounds a win-win to me.
Bert
joebongo said:
My wife has never driven since passing her test a few years ago when our son was born. She works in a small firm where tittle tattle is rife and someone has complained she uses public transport to get to and from site visits. Her employer has said she must start driving next year despite working during travel time.
In short is this enforceable? I couldnt find anything either way on the topic.
Assuming there is nothing in her contract, and those are the full details, this is vehiphobic discrimination, the employer is breaking the law, and it would be a prosecutable action.In short is this enforceable? I couldnt find anything either way on the topic.
S11Steve said:
As an employee, technically their should be business use insurance cover, but it's rare that this is in place, and if it is, costed for by the employer.
It's generally no more expensive than SD&P.S11Steve said:
Similarly, there are no fleet checks on the grey fleet - how does the fleet manager for the employer know if the car is safe to be on the road?
That's a sweeping statement. My employer certainly checks.If she had the job, role and did the same site visits before she drove, I cant see how the company can insist on her driving to them now. For all they know, she may have suffered a bad knock to confidence soon after passing. It happens.
If however, as others have said, the role changed to include site visits as she could now drive, or she got the role as she could drive, that would be different. I suspect the former though.
How do you think a tribunal would view a company trying to force someone into driving?
If however, as others have said, the role changed to include site visits as she could now drive, or she got the role as she could drive, that would be different. I suspect the former though.
How do you think a tribunal would view a company trying to force someone into driving?
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