DVLA has banned me from driving for 4 years..and it wasnt me
Discussion
TooMany2cvs said:
No, not really. France and the UK aren't the same country.
But it would be sensible.
Arguably, England and Scotland are different countries, they just are a part of the same union.But it would be sensible.
KevinCamaroSS said:
No, it is not. Scotland is part of the United Kingdom, it is the UK that issues the licence. In your example the EU would have to issue the licence, not the individual country.
EU got that bit right at least, don't have one law on this end of the street and another law on that end, when it's in the same "country".Either Scotland has their own laws and licences, or then they follow the same laws as the rest of the UK, simple really.
Red Devil said:
xjay1337 said:
What happens if you were on a back road near the border and crossed without necessarily realising it?
Like this? - https://goo.gl/maps/X5HtXY23qEoOnly someone familiar with the area would know that the border no longer followed the River Tweed.
Pedal to the metal and escape to England on the far side of the bridge.
No excuse going the other way though as the front of that sign tells you.
Finlandia said:
EU got that bit right at least, don't have one law on this end of the street and another law on that end, when it's in the same "country".
Either Scotland has their own laws and licences, or then they follow the same laws as the rest of the UK, simple really.
Scotland does have its own laws and legal system Either Scotland has their own laws and licences, or then they follow the same laws as the rest of the UK, simple really.
KevinCamaroSS said:
No, it is not. Scotland is part of the United Kingdom, it is the UK that issues the licence. In your example the EU would have to issue the licence, not the individual country.
The Isle of Man isn't even part of the UK, but a ban there covers the whole of the UK. They can charge you with driving offences that pretty well don't exist in the UK too. Gavia said:
Finlandia said:
EU got that bit right at least, don't have one law on this end of the street and another law on that end, when it's in the same "country".
Either Scotland has their own laws and licences, or then they follow the same laws as the rest of the UK, simple really.
Scotland does have its own laws and legal system Either Scotland has their own laws and licences, or then they follow the same laws as the rest of the UK, simple really.
Finlandia said:
Gavia said:
Finlandia said:
EU got that bit right at least, don't have one law on this end of the street and another law on that end, when it's in the same "country".
Either Scotland has their own laws and licences, or then they follow the same laws as the rest of the UK, simple really.
Scotland does have its own laws and legal system Either Scotland has their own laws and licences, or then they follow the same laws as the rest of the UK, simple really.
Finlandia said:
Gavia said:
Finlandia said:
EU got that bit right at least, don't have one law on this end of the street and another law on that end, when it's in the same "country".
Either Scotland has their own laws and licences, or then they follow the same laws as the rest of the UK, simple really.
Scotland does have its own laws and legal system Either Scotland has their own laws and licences, or then they follow the same laws as the rest of the UK, simple really.
Gavia said:
Because they don't. Amy comment on the Isle of Man aspect?
Then they shouldn't be taking the licences away from people living in 'other countries'.xRIEx said:
There's probably 1000 years of English, Scottish and UK history that would go in to that answer. Let's just put it down as "one of those things", like Scottish money being legal currency but not legal tender: an interesting point of discussion but not one to get too worked up over.
Is probably the best answer I still find it very strange and utterly bizarre, and I bet I'm not alone.
Finlandia said:
Gavia said:
Because they don't. Any comment on the Isle of Man aspect?
Then they shouldn't be taking the licences away from people living in 'other countries'.On that note, why so keen to defend those drinking and driving? The limits should be known and you should honour the laws of the country that you're in.
Gavia said:
jith said:
I'm going to make a prediction here. I was totally opposed to the limit being lowered in Scotland for two reasons. The first is it won't make a jot of differece to the problem of drunk driving, as those near the limit are not the problem, those who are seriously drunk are.
Secondly, it is clearly out of harmony with the rest of the UK, and this will open the door for legal challenges on those grounds. You are drunk in Gretna, but sober, just 200 yards over the border in Cumbria. The problem is obvious and it will be challenged probably by someone like a footballer who has a massive income and cares not about the legal costs. Bear in mind, in criminal cases in Scotland you don't get a penny in expenses from the courts even if you win outright. It is arguably the worst prejudice in the whole Scottish legal system, and an obvious deterrent to defence.
J
Your first prediction is more of an opinion than anything else and predicts nothing. Secondly, it is clearly out of harmony with the rest of the UK, and this will open the door for legal challenges on those grounds. You are drunk in Gretna, but sober, just 200 yards over the border in Cumbria. The problem is obvious and it will be challenged probably by someone like a footballer who has a massive income and cares not about the legal costs. Bear in mind, in criminal cases in Scotland you don't get a penny in expenses from the courts even if you win outright. It is arguably the worst prejudice in the whole Scottish legal system, and an obvious deterrent to defence.
J
The second isn't great either. Scottish footballers don't earn mega money and the nearest big paying English club is Newcastle and it's unlikely someone will drive all the way through Northumberland without a drink just to make a point. On the West coast you're all the way down to Manchester before you find a high paying PL club (Burnley aren't high payers).
There's no challenge though on the argument that "it's legal over there, so it should be here too". There are two legal systems in the U.K. English & Welsh and Scots & NI, that is well established and precedents in one jurisdiction don't automatically transfer to another.
What the hell are you talking about with your analysis of footballer's incomes? That is totally irrelevant. It is obvious to most that I quoted footballers purely as an example as they have a habit of falling foul of the law in a motor car and have the funds to defend themselves. Scott Brown for Celtic is on 25 grand a WEEK at the moment! But anyone with financial clout can do it.
However, those most likely to defend this will be English; I would have thought that blatantly obvious.
The difference between Scots and English Law is almost all down to procedure, but the Road Traffic Act applies to the UK as a whole as statute law. If a case like this went all the way to Edinburgh it would have precedence in Scotland; why do you think it would need to set a precedent anywhere else?; the problem is only in Scotland.
And to matchmaker: the concept that we don't pay a penny for the courts is an absolute illusion. They are paid for by taxation as they should be. But if you are wrongly accused and have to defend yourself perhaps you would explain how you are supposed to do this on a low income in the knowledge that you won't get a penny back even if you win. Indeed, legal fees now are so exorbitant even those on a good income would struggle to go all the way to trial.
J
The Spruce goose said:
PoleDriver said:
Has anyone around here seen where that thread about the guy who received someone else's ban through the post has gone?
surely you find this interesting. i mean we all need to know the answer to a drunk driver being caught ON the border...think about it..
jith said:
The difference between Scots and English Law is almost all down to procedure, but the Road Traffic Act applies to the UK as a whole as statute law. If a case like this went all the way to Edinburgh it would have precedence in Scotland; why do you think it would need to set a precedent anywhere else?; the problem is only in Scotland.
I can think of one Scottish case which changed UK Road Traffic law - Allan -v- Patterson. The wording of section 2 of the Road Traffic Act 1972 was changed as a result.https://cases.legal/en/act-uk2-123006.html
jith said:
And to matchmaker: the concept that we don't pay a penny for the courts is an absolute illusion. They are paid for by taxation as they should be. But if you are wrongly accused and have to defend yourself perhaps you would explain how you are supposed to do this on a low income in the knowledge that you won't get a penny back even if you win. Indeed, legal fees now are so exorbitant even those on a good income would struggle to go all the way to trial.
J
The point I was making is that you appeared to criticise the Scottish legal system as you don't get awarded expenses if you win. That is the case - but you don't have to pay prosecution expenses if you lose (or plead guilty? I'm not sure but no doubt someone will advise), which AFAIK you do have to in the majority of English & Welsh casesJ
Edited by matchmaker on Friday 6th January 13:43
Gavia said:
Finlandia said:
Gavia said:
Because they don't. Any comment on the Isle of Man aspect?
Then they shouldn't be taking the licences away from people living in 'other countries'.On that note, why so keen to defend those drinking and driving? The limits should be known and you should honour the laws of the country that you're in.
Either a country imposes their own laws and have the full set of government services to back them up, or then they share the same laws as the union they are in, bloody simple really.
Does that answer your last note as well?
But, as someone already mentioned, it's not worth getting worked up about, especially since I never really go to Scotland or Isle of Man
Finlandia said:
It is utterly bizarre that a country can ban a driver in another country as well as in the country where the offence was made.
Either a country imposes their own laws and have the full set of government services to back them up, or then they share the same laws as the union they are in, bloody simple really.
Does that answer your last note as well?
But, as someone already mentioned, it's not worth getting worked up about, especially since I never really go to Scotland or Isle of Man
That's a good point...stay out of Scotchland. They are stricter on other stuff too, I wouldn't go too fast on any of their roads.Either a country imposes their own laws and have the full set of government services to back them up, or then they share the same laws as the union they are in, bloody simple really.
Does that answer your last note as well?
But, as someone already mentioned, it's not worth getting worked up about, especially since I never really go to Scotland or Isle of Man
Every four weeks I have to drive (for work) from Stockport to Aberdeen and then back a couple of days later....I can never wait to get back into England. My two older colleagues who come with me think Scotchland is 'nice'...I think they are deluded.
xjay1337 said:
Not really, is it.....
Motorways have the same speed limit across the whole country.
But scotland only increased thespeed limit for LGVs on S/c roads in a couple of stretches rather than the blanket increase that E+W saw ... ( recognising that many lorries are driven at 56 mph regardless in 50 and NSL roads if they can get up to speed )Motorways have the same speed limit across the whole country.
V8 Fettler said:
Back to the original post, do the DVLA therefore remove a particular licence solely on the basis of the driving licence number? They must surely have a check facility e.g. home address.
In this case they wouldn't have had a driver number as the accused in the court case didn't produce a licence. The court provided DVLA with a name, date of birth, offence details and address. It's pretty clear to me that DVLA matched up the name and date of birth without checking the address.Gassing Station | Speed, Plod & the Law | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff