Is this legal?
Discussion
cpjitservices said:
The vehicle has to have insurance in its own right to be driven on the road, simply having 3rd party cover via a comprehensive other policy will not cover the vehicle.
My point in case, you say the vehicle is un-insured. If you go to do an MID check, the database will show the vehicle as being uninsured. So you go out and drive with your 3rd party insurance - the vehicle still shows up as uninsured because it doesn't have insurance in its own right, therefore you arent covered.
https://ownvehicle.askmid.com/
Wrong. My point in case, you say the vehicle is un-insured. If you go to do an MID check, the database will show the vehicle as being uninsured. So you go out and drive with your 3rd party insurance - the vehicle still shows up as uninsured because it doesn't have insurance in its own right, therefore you arent covered.
https://ownvehicle.askmid.com/
I stopped a driver driving her sons car as hers was getting repaired. His vehicle didn't have a policy in place due to being at uni and not needed.
Direct line WOULD cover her using the drive other vehicles cover. It depends massively on the insurance company.
Amused2death said:
It's nearly time for the MOT. We take our vehicles to a local guy who'll give it the once over then take it for the MOT
Wouldn't the car need to be taxed under this arrangement, as you are not driving it to a pre booked MOT, you are driving it to someone else who is driving it to a pre booked MOT.It will probably be OK if that's the wording - Aviva, for example, do not require a car to be insured for DOC to cover you driving it - but bear in mind it is true third party only, i.e. she cannot park it anywhere other than on the premises of the MOT garage - not on street, not in a car park - as when it's parked it won't be insured at all and could be clamped/towed etc
Also print a copy of all insurance documentation in case she hits ANPR etc
Also print a copy of all insurance documentation in case she hits ANPR etc
cpjitservices said:
The vehicle has to have insurance in its own right to be driven on the road, simply having 3rd party cover via a comprehensive other policy will not cover the vehicle.
Only if you leave the vehicle unattended. If you remain in the vehicle at all times, it's insured. mcford said:
Amused2death said:
It's nearly time for the MOT. We take our vehicles to a local guy who'll give it the once over then take it for the MOT
Wouldn't the car need to be taxed under this arrangement, as you are not driving it to a pre booked MOT, you are driving it to someone else who is driving it to a pre booked MOT.The VED & MOT exemptions apply when driving to and from a pre-arranged test (or to a place of repair after a failed test). Neither mention taking the vehicle for a pre-test once-over at some other location.
Ki3r said:
Wrong.
I stopped a driver driving her sons car as hers was getting repaired. His vehicle didn't have a policy in place due to being at uni and not needed.
Direct line WOULD cover her using the drive other vehicles cover. It depends massively on the insurance company.
I once had a discussion with a member of DL staff about whether the other car needed it's own Insurance as on a similar forum discussion someone went to the trouble of ringing DL and was incorrectly told that the other car needs it's own Insurance.I stopped a driver driving her sons car as hers was getting repaired. His vehicle didn't have a policy in place due to being at uni and not needed.
Direct line WOULD cover her using the drive other vehicles cover. It depends massively on the insurance company.
I work in Insurance and know that DL at the time (Have not checked recently) did not require the car to be covered.
The DL CS on live chat used urban myth to answer and told me it needed cover, I politely explained the policy did not state this so they cannot invent rules. She went away and spoke to a superviser who also made a guess and told her to tell me it needed cover due to continuous insurance law. I explained that this was also wrong and requested that she check with an underwriter.
She came back after a couple of minutes and confirmed that Direct Line did not need the other car to be covered and that she had made a mistake.
She tagged on that the underwriter mentioned that as soon as you got out of the car it was no longer insured. In my mind this is not a hard and fast rule as there are instances where the courts would still regard you as being in control of the car when you got out of the car if they deemed it part of an overall journey eg you stopped at a petrol station and went in to pay for the fuel. It would depend on exact circumstances and would most probablyn need a higher court than a magistrates to make such a decisiom though.
Direct Line kindly emailed me a transcript of the live chat confirming that (At the time) they did not require the car to be covered by a separate policy.
I was alarmed but not surprised to see one of the traffic officers was impounding DL client's for no insurance when using the DOC and the other car did not hold it's own cover. It's the type of question that's normally only answered correctly by senior members of Insurance staff. Unfortunately the MIB desk at DL did not know their own policy
Chainsaw Rebuild said:
How far away is the garage OP and do you live in a city or out in the sticks. If it's a short distance and not a city centre you will be ok. I live about 1000yrds from the garage for example....
2 miles away on a single track lane, very rural. No anpr. As others have mentioned, I'm not actually taking it to an MOT station so technically it appears like I'm going to be a very naughty boy. However I will ensure it is insured, knowing that no MOT doesn't mean no insurance cover.Chainsaw Rebuild said:
How far away is the garage OP and do you live in a city or out in the sticks. If it's a short distance and not a city centre you will be ok. I live about 1000yrds from the garage for example....
If it's booked in for a MOT the distance doesn't matter as long as you go straight there, I've used a garage 40 miles away for10 years,I stupidly let the MOT expire so rang and asked VOSA as it was then , they told me the above Pretty sure driving 1000yds out in the sticks with no insurance is still illegal though
Yes, distance doesn't matter - Secretary of State for Transport V. Richards (1998) JP 682 QBD
but you need to be going to the test centre, not to another garage.
but you need to be going to the test centre, not to another garage.
TheAbove said:
The Court accepted the submission that it is a question of fact and degree in each case for the court to determine whether the exemption is satisfied. But the court said, it is only if this court is satisfied that no court could reasonably have come to the conclusion that it did that it can interfere. On the facts of this case, it is ridiculous if a driver could not stop to obtain petrol on the way. it would fly in the face of common sense if some short stop cannot be made by the driver, for whatever purpose, providing he is on his way to the test station.
I too thought that driving other cars required the other car to be insured by somebody. It is interestig to see that this is apparently not the case. There does seem to be a lot of confusion about what you can do if it is uninsured, not MoT'd and not taxed.
As I understand it if a car is to be driven on the road:-
a. Every car has to be insured whether through driving other cars and therefore third party cover only or with its own insurance or a motor traders policy. Otherwise off road and SORN declared.
b. If without a MoT then the journey can ONLY be to a prearranged appointment for one (no stopping to go shopping on the way there or on the way back).
c. Every car must be taxed (VED) unless it is waiting for a current MoT in which case it is being driven on the road soley for the purpose of going a to a pre arranged MoT (or on its way back from such). Or it will be declared SORN.
Personally if you are going to get a MoT then you may as well get a years insurance and tax on it as why bother getting the MoT in the first place - ???
The other solution is to just add the car to an existing policy for a few days. Some insurers/underwriters are happy to do this and others not. You can always tell them you are going to sell the other one.
Pip
As I understand it if a car is to be driven on the road:-
a. Every car has to be insured whether through driving other cars and therefore third party cover only or with its own insurance or a motor traders policy. Otherwise off road and SORN declared.
b. If without a MoT then the journey can ONLY be to a prearranged appointment for one (no stopping to go shopping on the way there or on the way back).
c. Every car must be taxed (VED) unless it is waiting for a current MoT in which case it is being driven on the road soley for the purpose of going a to a pre arranged MoT (or on its way back from such). Or it will be declared SORN.
Personally if you are going to get a MoT then you may as well get a years insurance and tax on it as why bother getting the MoT in the first place - ???
The other solution is to just add the car to an existing policy for a few days. Some insurers/underwriters are happy to do this and others not. You can always tell them you are going to sell the other one.
Pip
akirk said:
Sheepshanks said:
I daresay it exists, but I've never seen that in a policy.
However it's a complete red herring these days - since Continuous Insurance Enforcement (CIE) every car on the road has to have its own insurance (or be listed on a fleet policy etc etc).
but not if sorned...However it's a complete red herring these days - since Continuous Insurance Enforcement (CIE) every car on the road has to have its own insurance (or be listed on a fleet policy etc etc).
and a sorned vehicle can be driven to a pre-arranged MOT...
Chainsaw Rebuild said:
It's 2 miles of rural minor c road...
If a tree falls over in a wood but no one hears it fall did it make a sound?
Ask yourself this: Do accidents ever happen over two mile stretches of minor roads???If a tree falls over in a wood but no one hears it fall did it make a sound?
What if the tree falls onto a car and injures the driver??
You are assuming nothing will happen. Insurance guards against it happening or at least putting things right if it does. Is there not some statistic that says most accidents take place within five miles of where you live - ???
This post discusses whether it is legal NOT whether something will happen and the driver gets caught.
Pip
I regularly drive untaxed, unMOTd and uninsured vehicles.
Never have an issue. The occasional ANPR car will pull me and check trade policy and then let me on my way.
They've never mentioned tax once and are happy enough when I say I'm on my way to my garage or MOT station in regards MOT.
Never have an issue. The occasional ANPR car will pull me and check trade policy and then let me on my way.
They've never mentioned tax once and are happy enough when I say I'm on my way to my garage or MOT station in regards MOT.
Ki3r said:
Wrong.
I stopped a driver driving her sons car as hers was getting repaired. His vehicle didn't have a policy in place due to being at uni and not needed.
Direct line WOULD cover her using the drive other vehicles cover. It depends massively on the insurance company.
Oh OK, very badly mis-informed then - or I guess it's just my insurance company.I stopped a driver driving her sons car as hers was getting repaired. His vehicle didn't have a policy in place due to being at uni and not needed.
Direct line WOULD cover her using the drive other vehicles cover. It depends massively on the insurance company.
My bad.
Now I know....
Pip1968 said:
Chainsaw Rebuild said:
It's 2 miles of rural minor c road...
If a tree falls over in a wood but no one hears it fall did it make a sound?
Ask yourself this: Do accidents ever happen over two mile stretches of minor roads???If a tree falls over in a wood but no one hears it fall did it make a sound?
What if the tree falls onto a car and injures the driver??
You are assuming nothing will happen. Insurance guards against it happening or at least putting things right if it does. Is there not some statistic that says most accidents take place within five miles of where you live - ???
This post discusses whether it is legal NOT whether something will happen and the driver gets caught.
Pip
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