Accident Liability

[nikaiyo2]

One of our drivers has had a bit of a prang on a "round about" its a big motorway junction. He was turning left onto the A34 as instructed by the road signs and road markings, woman in 4x4 in the middle lane turns onto the A34. To me that is 100% her fault, our insurers are recommending 50/50, as she is claiming our driver should have anticipated her actions... My gut is its not our fault so to fight, am I on a hiding to nothing? We have dash cam footage, but it only shows our driver in the correct lane moving as the traffic signs.

Also does 50/50 mean we pay our costs and the other party pays theirs? As our van has a bit of a cracked bumper and a scuff / small dent that to be honest does not need repairing, its our old stter "yard" van that is T reg and does not have an un-damaged bit on it!

This is the location of the prang.
https://goo.gl/maps/6DuiDAdejqB2

[Andehh]

So she drifted into his lane? /deviated out of ''her'' middle lane?

(or vice versa, as I'm sure she will tell her insurers he drifted into hers)

[Andehh]

So she drifted into his lane? /deviated out of ''her'' middle lane?

(or vice versa, as I'm sure she will tell her insurers he drifted into hers)

[vonhosen]

The lane markings aren't mandatory they are advisory.
Everybody has a responsibility to look out for everybody else.
Roundabouts are notorious for split liability collisions.
The courts accept that people get into lanes that aren't the best for their intended exit, it happens.
Each case is dealt with on it's merits/facts/evidence.
Independent witnesses, useful video?
50/50 is shared combined costs, not fix your own.
The A34 is a two lane dual carriageway, how did they manage to come together on that exit?
Did she try to go immediately to lane 1 on the A34 or did your driver try to go immediately to lane 2 on the A34?

Edited by vonhosen on Thursday 19th January 11:54

[spikyone]

Without showing the video, you're only going to get guesses as to who should be held accountable. As vonhosen said, the A34 there is two lanes, so it should have been entirely possible for both drivers to get around there unscathed even if the other driver was in the "wrong" M3(N) lane.

[MitchT]

nikaiyo2 said:

... she is claiming our driver should have anticipated her actions...

Woman in "expecting man to be a mind reader" shocker!

That said, to be fair, it's pretty safe to assume that a woman driving an SUV is going to do something that shows an outright lack of situational awareness sooner or later. I've grown to prepare myself for such things.

[TooMany2cvs]

nikaiyo2 said:

One of our drivers has had a bit of a prang on a "round about" its a big motorway junction. He was turning left onto the A34 as instructed by the road signs and road markings, woman in 4x4 in the middle lane turns onto the A34.

our van has a bit of a cracked bumper and a scuff / small dent

Front of the van, or rear of the van...?

[Gavia]

nikaiyo2 said:

One of our drivers has had a bit of a prang on a "round about" its a big motorway junction. He was turning left onto the A34 as instructed by the road signs and road markings, woman in 4x4 in the middle lane turns onto the A34. To me that is 100% her fault, our insurers are recommending 50/50, as she is claiming our driver should have anticipated her actions... My gut is its not our fault so to fight, am I on a hiding to nothing? We have dash cam footage, but it only shows our driver in the correct lane moving as the traffic signs.

Also does 50/50 mean we pay our costs and the other party pays theirs? As our van has a bit of a cracked bumper and a scuff / small dent that to be honest does not need repairing, its our old stter "yard" van that is T reg and does not have an un-damaged bit on it!

This is the location of the prang.
https://goo.gl/maps/6DuiDAdejqB2

Was it actually on the roundabout (nonidea why you've put that in quotation marks) or the dual carriageway just after.

My guess is she's cut the roundabout, but your driver has moved out into the second lane after joining the A34 and they've collided.

Nonidea how insurance will see it though.

[nikaiyo2]

I put round about in "" because in this case no one went round anything, just filtered left.

Our guy went from the left lane at the junction directly into lane 2 of the A34, not expecting someone to come from the M3(N) lane. She hit him rear bumper/ rear quarter panel.

Thanks for the input guys (love the woman mind reading, made me lol) will get onto the brokers in the morning and agree to the 50/50. It's not worth the hassle of fighting, I just wanted to save our guy the excess payment.

[Gavia]

nikaiyo2 said:

I put round about in "" because in this case no one went round anything, just filtered left.

Our guy went from the left lane at the junction directly into lane 2 of the A34, not expecting someone to come from the M3(N) lane. She hit him rear bumper/ rear quarter panel.

Thanks for the input guys (love the woman mind reading, made me lol) will get onto the brokers in the morning and agree to the 50/50. It's not worth the hassle of fighting, I just wanted to save our guy the excess payment.

I'd be happy with the 50/50 then, as he should still look if changing lanes rather than just expecting nobody to be where he wants to be.

[QuickQuack]

nikaiyo2 said:

I put round about in "" because in this case no one went round anything, just filtered left.

Our guy went from the left lane at the junction directly into lane 2 of the A34, not expecting someone to come from the M3(N) lane. She hit him rear bumper/ rear quarter panel.

Thanks for the input guys (love the woman mind reading, made me lol) will get onto the brokers in the morning and agree to the 50/50. It's not worth the hassle of fighting, I just wanted to save our guy the excess payment.

If she hit him on the rear bumper and rear quarter panel, how did she not see the rest of the length of the van in front of her?? Having said that, why didn't your chap go into lane 1? It does sound a bit 50/50 to be honest but if I were you, I'd go with my gut instinct after watching the footage. If he did go into lane 2 unnecessarily, accept the 50/50, if not, then object.

[JM]

Gavia said:

I'd be happy with the 50/50 then, as he should still look if changing lanes rather than just expecting nobody to be where he wants to be.

That.

[Riley Blue]

Having had a look at the aerial view, there are roundabouts near me that are very similar in layout and where it's perfectly OK for her to have turned left from the centre lane.

[anonymous-user]

I know that junction well, it's unfortunately common for people to turn left onto the A34 from the middle lane. It's also common for people to sweep straight out from the left lane into lane 2 of the A34. Neither is very smart.

Both drivers were in the wrong, shared liability.

Don't get me started on the free-for-all that happens a mile up the road where the people who must be in the right hand lane at all costs suddenly need to be in the left hand lane at all costs to continue north up the a34......

[Red Devil]

nikaiyo2 said:

One of our drivers has had a bit of a prang on a "round about" its a big motorway junction. He was turning left onto the A34

This is the location of the prang.
https://goo.gl/maps/6DuiDAdejqB2

How did I guess it would be the 'Winchester Waltzer' without even opening the link?

nikaiyo2 said:

Our guy went from the left lane at the junction directly into lane 2 of the A34, not expecting someone to come from the M3(N) lane. She hit him rear bumper/ rear quarter panel.

Then your original gut instinct was mistaken.

[nikaiyo2]

charltjr said:

I know that junction well, it's unfortunately common for people to turn left onto the A34 from the middle lane. It's also common for people to sweep straight out from the left lane into lane 2 of the A34. Neither is very smart.

Both drivers were in the wrong, shared liability.

Don't get me started on the free-for-all that happens a mile up the road where the people who must be in the right hand lane at all costs suddenly need to be in the left hand lane at all costs to continue north up the a34......

It is a great bit of road planning, my mum lives in Crawley so I often go up there to the 3 Maids Hill junction, she wont use that round about as it scares her!

TBH I thought those lane road markings were instructional, not advisory.

[CYMR0]

nikaiyo2 said:

TBH I thought those lane road markings were instructional, not advisory.

I don't think it matters either way. She shouldn't have been in that bit of road, but he seems to have moved into her lane without looking, based on an equally-negligent, flawed assumption that no one else would do anything negligent. (One negligent person = no accident; two negligent people = accident). 50:50 is a good result for you in those circumstances, though I wouldn't expect her to get 100% against you.

[KevinCamaroSS]

nikaiyo2 said:

OWe have dash cam footage, but it only shows our driver in the correct lane moving as the traffic signs.

That statement is not correct because he actually moved from lane 1 to lane 2. I would be happy with 50/50 because I would say it is your driver at fault.

[llewop]

charltjr said:

I know that junction well, it's unfortunately common for people to turn left onto the A34 from the middle lane. It's also common for people to sweep straight out from the left lane into lane 2 of the A34. Neither is very smart.

Both drivers were in the wrong, shared liability.

Don't get me started on the free-for-all that happens a mile up the road where the people who must be in the right hand lane at all costs suddenly need to be in the left hand lane at all costs to continue north up the a34......

as above
although I know it best from either crossing the M3 to the same point or coming off the M3 northbound to A34. For both of those, regardless of roadmarkings always expect 2 lines of traffic to make for the A34, so your guy going from lane 1 to lane 2 as soon as he turned the corner was perhaps optimistic - Effectively a lane change.

and the split up the road can be traumatic as described - never had an accident there, but seen a few, near misses and at least one car on its roof down a ditch after it didn't go well!

[Marlin45]

nikaiyo2 said:

I put round about in "" because in this case no one went round anything, just filtered left.

Our guy went from the left lane at the junction directly into lane 2 of the A34, not expecting someone to come from the M3(N) lane. She hit him rear bumper/ rear quarter panel.

Thanks for the input guys (love the woman mind reading, made me lol) will get onto the brokers in the morning and agree to the 50/50. It's not worth the hassle of fighting, I just wanted to save our guy the excess payment.

Slightly off topic but are you saying your employees have to pay the excess payment on your insurance for Co. vehicle damage when they are driving?

Edited by Marlin45 on Friday 20th January 12:34