Work related expectations/legalities regarding lunch breaks
Discussion
This could be a bit of a trudge so apologies.
The background is I've worked for a company for around 15 years. 3 years ago we moved to "mobile working". We have always worked from our vans for the most part, although we had a yard with stores, offices, but more importantly lockers, toilets, wash areas, places to dry clothes, a kettle, microwave and basic facilities like this. We could also leave the van there during holidays etc.
Since the change to mobile working we don't have a yard at all. We have mobile devices we can speak to the office which is now elsewhere via email etc. It's much more efficient granted.
My concerns is that we are basically expected to eat our lunches in our vans. Yet have nowhere to freshen up or wash hands. We are told that we can use leisure centres during our breaks. However we only get 30 minutes for lunch and no other breaks. We are often 15-20 minutes from a council leisure centre. We can be at least ten minutes from a shop, yet we have to log off from a job for lunch then take our 30 mins. So management know if we go over. We have also been told that we shouldn't leave the area we are working for lunch. Which could leave us with no access to a toilet all day. We work in residential properties mainly, repairs/maintenance, plumbing/carpentry. There's around 120 tradesmen employed on this basis.
Does anything I've put down seem unfair to anyone? I'm worried we are missing certain aspects of our rights but could be wrong and I've read contradictory things online.
Worth mentioning perhaps that one of the guys is facing disciplinary for peeing in a bucket in the back of the van.
The background is I've worked for a company for around 15 years. 3 years ago we moved to "mobile working". We have always worked from our vans for the most part, although we had a yard with stores, offices, but more importantly lockers, toilets, wash areas, places to dry clothes, a kettle, microwave and basic facilities like this. We could also leave the van there during holidays etc.
Since the change to mobile working we don't have a yard at all. We have mobile devices we can speak to the office which is now elsewhere via email etc. It's much more efficient granted.
My concerns is that we are basically expected to eat our lunches in our vans. Yet have nowhere to freshen up or wash hands. We are told that we can use leisure centres during our breaks. However we only get 30 minutes for lunch and no other breaks. We are often 15-20 minutes from a council leisure centre. We can be at least ten minutes from a shop, yet we have to log off from a job for lunch then take our 30 mins. So management know if we go over. We have also been told that we shouldn't leave the area we are working for lunch. Which could leave us with no access to a toilet all day. We work in residential properties mainly, repairs/maintenance, plumbing/carpentry. There's around 120 tradesmen employed on this basis.
Does anything I've put down seem unfair to anyone? I'm worried we are missing certain aspects of our rights but could be wrong and I've read contradictory things online.
Worth mentioning perhaps that one of the guys is facing disciplinary for peeing in a bucket in the back of the van.
Lopey said:
If you're working in residents properties, why can't you use their facilities? Thousands of tradesmen all over the country manage.
If you're talking about self employed tradesmen they're also able to give themselves time to go grab a sandwich, eat it and find somewhere to clean up. I'm just wondering if the 30 mins is considered enough time. Keen to hear what other employed workers get in similar situations. British Gas, etc etc
rufusgti said:
If you're talking about self employed tradesmen they're also able to give themselves time to go grab a sandwich, eat it and find somewhere to clean up.
I'm just wondering if the 30 mins is considered enough time. Keen to hear what other employed workers get in similar situations. British Gas, etc etc
I'm talking about both employed and self employed. Yes, I am actually employed as a tradesman and have worked in similar conditions as you describe, sometimes worse. It really isn't as difficult as you make out.I'm just wondering if the 30 mins is considered enough time. Keen to hear what other employed workers get in similar situations. British Gas, etc etc
eldar said:
I'm sure you don't mind passing tradesmen calling at your house for a good smelly dump. All credit to you.
What a bizarre comment. The op is working in residents properties. If I had a tradesman working in my property, I would certainly not refuse him use of the bathroom. I normally let them have free reign of the kettle too. Sorry, not trying to make out that it's hard. It's not a hard job by any stretch of the imagination. I'm trying to decipher what my rights are for breaks, toilet stops. We're not aloud to call in Tesco, mac Donald's unless on the area we're working and within our 30 minute breaks. Someone mentioned being a big boy and holding a pee in all day. That's fab, I can't unfortunately.
Skyrat said:
You're entitled to a 30 min break for lunch. How you use it is up to you. It doesn't seem to be a great situation for you, but I've worked in places where you either had to bring lunch or nip to the shop for a quick bite. I don't think your employer is doing anything wrong IMHO.
Thanks. Yes I've started taking my own lunch as it makes things much easier and more relaxing break.
If you have been with them fifteen years as a field worker surely you have worked out the little "wriggles" you can apply to your day? I'm not suggesting truly taking the mickey. I usually start earlier than my official time and eat my lunch on the way to my next job. This means I'm usually home by four and have dodged the rush hour both ends of the day. You can make your job as hard or as easy as you want.
Seems very restrictive when they say you are not allowed to stop at a McDonald's or a shop unless it's in the area. I used to work on the electric meters and used to stop whenever I wanted, they did get a bit stroppy if you sat still for more than 30mims as the handheld used to report it. Are you local authoritiy? Hence the restriction on where you go?
I can bet a pinch salt to a gold brick that the restrictions were thought up by somebody in a comfortable office surrounded by all the facilities they need .
A break from work should be a period of time that you can freely do as you wish .
Do you get paid for this break ?
If not they can Foxtrot Oscar.
A break from work should be a period of time that you can freely do as you wish .
Do you get paid for this break ?
If not they can Foxtrot Oscar.
Edited by grumpy52 on Tuesday 21st February 10:55
I think the problem you'll face will be:
(1) Everyone else gets on with it, all 120 of them, so why are you making it an issue?
(2) People in the office coming up with these ideas having the same view as those replying here, thinking it's no real problem to find somewhere easily to use the facilities and that you should just 'hold it in' until you can.
I don't think the situation is fair, but your half-hour break should be yours to use as you please. So long as you are at your next job on time, they shouldn't have reason to complain that you went 'out of area' on your break. I appreciate that's not always possible and this is where you have to rely on the "kindness of strangers" as it were.
Your employer is not breaking any law, but it's not an ideal situation and you'll have to decide whether this is something you can live with, or whether you'd want to find a different role.
(1) Everyone else gets on with it, all 120 of them, so why are you making it an issue?
(2) People in the office coming up with these ideas having the same view as those replying here, thinking it's no real problem to find somewhere easily to use the facilities and that you should just 'hold it in' until you can.
I don't think the situation is fair, but your half-hour break should be yours to use as you please. So long as you are at your next job on time, they shouldn't have reason to complain that you went 'out of area' on your break. I appreciate that's not always possible and this is where you have to rely on the "kindness of strangers" as it were.
Your employer is not breaking any law, but it's not an ideal situation and you'll have to decide whether this is something you can live with, or whether you'd want to find a different role.
rufusgti said:
Lopey said:
If you're working in residents properties, why can't you use their facilities? Thousands of tradesmen all over the country manage.
If you're talking about self employed tradesmen they're also able to give themselves time to go grab a sandwich, eat it and find somewhere to clean up. I'm just wondering if the 30 mins is considered enough time. Keen to hear what other employed workers get in similar situations. British Gas, etc etc
Health Safety and Workplace Regulations 1992 impose obligations on the employer.
http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/books/l24.htm
The HSE have also issued guidance in their document L24 which is an ACOP.
These are (by necessity) generic, but you may be able to gain an understanding of how the Regulations would apply to your position.
http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/books/l24.htm
The HSE have also issued guidance in their document L24 which is an ACOP.
These are (by necessity) generic, but you may be able to gain an understanding of how the Regulations would apply to your position.
Sounds familiar.
All our depots closed recently after a merger, leaving us with only one room at the stores which is suitable for breaks. The only snag being that it holds a dozen at most and there's 150+ of us
So after many threats from both management and workforce a compromise was reached which is basically the same as we had before the merger.... Your 30 minutes is your lunch break and we get 10 minutes each way for travel/washing/loo breaks etc and we're allowed to go home as long as it's doable within the 10 minutes.
It works and everyone is happy.
All our depots closed recently after a merger, leaving us with only one room at the stores which is suitable for breaks. The only snag being that it holds a dozen at most and there's 150+ of us
So after many threats from both management and workforce a compromise was reached which is basically the same as we had before the merger.... Your 30 minutes is your lunch break and we get 10 minutes each way for travel/washing/loo breaks etc and we're allowed to go home as long as it's doable within the 10 minutes.
It works and everyone is happy.
Edited by MonkeyHanger on Wednesday 22 February 20:14
Gassing Station | Speed, Plod & the Law | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff