1st March - 6points for mobile phone use at the wheel

[BlackLabel]

Thanks for the correction re the 45 degree stuff - nope don't have a better source than the Mirror/Record however one would have assumed even they could get something as simple as this correct. Obviously not.

[VEX]

What does the legislation actually detail?

My phone is always in its cradle in the car, but I do touch it to make phone calls. I dont to receive them.

I also dictate texts to it using siri, but need to press a button to instigate the dictation.

V.

[SS2.]

If it doesn't need to be held whilst you are using it, then you won't shouldn't fall foul of the specific mobile phone legislation.

[pingu393]

VEX said:

What does the legislation actually detail?

My phone is always in its cradle in the car, but I do touch it to make phone calls. I dont to receive them.

I also dictate texts to it using siri, but need to press a button to instigate the dictation.

V.

Until someone points me to something newer, this is the specific legislation that applies...

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2003/2695/regul...

Although, driving with undue care and attention always applies.



Edited to correct url formatting

Edited by pingu393 on Wednesday 1st March 14:06

[speedking31]

Y Y Z said:

speedking31 said:

Maybe a reduction to 3 points if you attend a course, best of both worlds.

There is no option to attend a course, it's 6 points and £200 and tough titty.

There is however, obviously an option to amend the penalty. Could have been 3-6 points with a course offered if 3 points accepted for a first offence. I would like to see phones confiscated for a week, I reckon that would affect these people more than a driving ban.

[pingu393]

speedking31 said:

Y Y Z said:

speedking31 said:

Maybe a reduction to 3 points if you attend a course, best of both worlds.

There is no option to attend a course, it's 6 points and £200 and tough titty.

There is however, obviously an option to amend the penalty. Could have been 3-6 points with a course offered if 3 points accepted for a first offence. I would like to see phones confiscated for a week, I reckon that would affect these people more than a driving ban.

Confiscated and, as it's part of a crime, searched for illegal stuff.

[agtlaw]

SS2. said:

If it doesn't need to be held whilst you are using it, then you won't shouldn't fall foul of the specific mobile phone legislation.

This is spot on. The specific mobile phone offence is only made out if the device is used whilst held in your hand. The fine is anything up to £1000. You can be banned for any length of time, or 6 penalty points may be imposed. Alternatively, you may avoid court proceedings by paying a £200 fixed penalty with 6 points endorsed on your licence.

If your phone is attached to the dashboard / screen and you're texting etc and not in proper control of the vehicle then other offences apply.

[21TonyK]

For clarity, on the Tv this morning they had a PC who said "don't touch your phone if your engine is running". Others have said "in motion".

Now I get the "in motion" bit, that's obvious and maybe sat at the lights but what about parked up, engine running and how does the auto stop-start come in to it? If I stop at the lights the engine stops as well. I'm not in motion and my engine is off?

All a bit hypothetical as I don't use a phone anyway.

[SS2.]

21TonyK said:

Now I get the "in motion" bit, that's obvious and maybe sat at the lights but what about parked up, engine running and how does the auto stop-start come in to it? If I stop at the lights the engine stops as well. I'm not in motion and my engine is off?

Would still be regarded as 'driving', therefore mobile phone restrictions would still apply.

[ukaskew]

Loads of people use their phone as a sat-nav (presumably most in a cradle), so this could be interesting. Waze, for example, only really works because people report traffic build up or incidents. This is done by...tapping the screen. Whilst this wouldn't be covered by this legislation, it is using a screen whilst driving (that happens to be your phone).

I'm also intrigued as to why many modern cars have moved to touch screens to control basic things rather than tactile knobs that you can use without even looking. The very idea of them seems completely at odds with actually driving a car.

Edited by ukaskew on Wednesday 1st March 15:48

[SS2.]

ukaskew said:

Loads of people use their phone as a sat-nav (presumably most in a cradle), so this could be interesting. Waze, for example, only really works because people report traffic build up or incidents. This is done by...tapping the screen.

If it doesn't require to be 'held', then there's no issue as far as the mobile phone legislation is concerned.

[hairyben]

Whats the stance on a cellphone secured in a cradle being used say for satnav, but while stationary at a red light you check a text message? Or swipe the map screen to see where it's leading you? (I use a tablet stuck on the dash for live traffic satnav and I'll often swipe the screen down to see if its leading me on a route/to a junction I don't like.)

I'm aware I need to be in control of vehicle at all times blah blah and nothing changes that, I'm concerned only here about the specific application of this particular rule.

[SS2.]

hairyben said:

Whats the stance on a cellphone secured in a cradle being used say for satnav, but while stationary at a red light you check a text message? Or swipe the map screen to see where it's leading you?

If it doesn't require to be 'held', then there's no issue as far as the mobile phone legislation is concerned.

[Bigends]

Saw two idiots texting on hand-helds between two motorway junctions on the way home this afternoon - they still wont learn!

[Randy Winkman]

ukaskew said:

I'm also intrigued as to why many modern cars have moved to touch screens to control basic things rather than tactile knobs that you can use without even looking. The very idea of them seems completely at odds with actually driving a car.

Edited by ukaskew on Wednesday 1st March 15:48

Because it looks cool in the showroom I guess. An utterly stupid trend that I hope will pass. But I'd give it 20 years.

[pingu393]

21TonyK said:

For clarity, on the Tv this morning they had a PC who said "don't touch your phone if your engine is running". Others have said "in motion".

Now I get the "in motion" bit, that's obvious and maybe sat at the lights but what about parked up, engine running and how does the auto stop-start come in to it? If I stop at the lights the engine stops as well. I'm not in motion and my engine is off?

All a bit hypothetical as I don't use a phone anyway.

You are in control of the vehicle, so legislation applies. Stop-Start is controlled by the driver.


More interesting would be if someone were obviously legally parked, but with the engine running and using a hand-held mobile phone. I suspect the legislation applies. They would be crucified if they didn't have their seat belt on as well .

[limpsfield]

yellowjack said:

I've demonstrated comprehensively that I can listen to two radio sets....and still have control of a vehicle sufficient to avoid hazards (including incoming enemy fire)

Woah woah. Hang on a second. Does this mean you have actually been in the military? I have never seen you mention this before.

If so, thank you for your service.

[Bigends]

limpsfield said:

yellowjack said:

I've demonstrated comprehensively that I can listen to two radio sets....and still have control of a vehicle sufficient to avoid hazards (including incoming enemy fire)

Woah woah. Hang on a second. Does this mean you have actually been in the military? I have never seen you mention this before.

If so, thank you for your service.

Listening is simple - used to have UHF and VHF sets to listen to and respond to. Holding a conversation is more difficult

[pingu393]

Bigends said:

limpsfield said:

yellowjack said:

I've demonstrated comprehensively that I can listen to two radio sets....and still have control of a vehicle sufficient to avoid hazards (including incoming enemy fire)

Woah woah. Hang on a second. Does this mean you have actually been in the military? I have never seen you mention this before.

If so, thank you for your service.

Listening is simple - used to have UHF and VHF sets to listen to and respond to. Holding a conversation is more difficult

I was in a 513 when the commander was on a contact report in one ear (company net) and a bog-roll sitrep on the other (brigade net). Funny now, but not at the time

He would have been done for DWDCA that day = me in the back

[croyde]

Apparently loads caught today including a journalist on his way to cover this very story.