Caught with an Untaxed Vehicle ..

[HantsRat]

Jonno02 said:

It's the most basic sense, it's still a tax. It's a tax to use your car.

Yes and you still need to 'tax' your car even if it has a nil tax value.

Your girlfriend would've been sent reminders to renew.

[mr alan]

A tax

A fine

A penalty

Rather pedantic I suppose, bottom line is though you still have to pay it.

[Jonno02]

HantsRat said:

Yes and you still need to 'tax' your car even if it has a nil tax value.

Your girlfriend would've been sent reminders to renew.

The odd thing is, she wasn't. I'm always in first so get the mail. No reminders, first notice was a debt collection agency letter.

Age old excuse of no letters etc, so I don't expect you to believe it.

[Andrew--Stevenson]

Rang up, had to pay nearly £200, including back-dating the missed tax and admin fee's for processing the legal extortion.

Not trying to start WW3 here, and I know how forums are; I was purely asking for advise to the situation.

Yes, I was wrong and didn't do things in time. No, I wasn't whinging about being caught. My issue here (and one which is not going to change the system one bit), is the immediate prosecution for something which was an honest mistake. I can clearly afford to pay the VED, as I do with my other cars, along with MOT, fuel, Insurance etc - I wouldn't knowingly try to bypass the tax I pay to use my vehicle, I just forgot.

Oh well, lesson learned.

[CABC]

Andrew--Stevenson said:

Rang up, had to pay nearly £200, including back-dating the missed tax and admin fee's for processing the legal extortion.

Not trying to start WW3 here, and I know how forums are; I was purely asking for advise to the situation.

Yes, I was wrong and didn't do things in time. No, I wasn't whinging about being caught. My issue here (and one which is not going to change the system one bit), is the immediate prosecution for something which was an honest mistake. I can clearly afford to pay the VED, as I do with my other cars, along with MOT, fuel, Insurance etc - I wouldn't knowingly try to bypass the tax I pay to use my vehicle, I just forgot.

Oh well, lesson learned.

problem is that many people forget to pay for things without malicious intent. Make it more painful and they often take steps not to forget.

[Soov330e]

Andrew--Stevenson said:

Hi all,

Wondering if anyone can help with this;

We purchased a new car in Nov. 2015, completely forgot to tax it when it came around to 1 year old (I know, silly silly boy). We had moved houses and were in the process of changing V5's, and didn't receive the tax reminder to the house we were living in.

We have all our cars paid via direct debit for Road tax, and don't try to beat the system, it was an honest mistake.

Received a fine for £85. Caught just shy of 2 months after tax due date - shall I just pay the darn fine or is there any way we can appeal for a reduction?

You have zero chance of appealing or getting a reduction.

You got off lightly!

[Stoofa]

cmaguire said:

That's a sad indictment of the state of society if you actually think he 'got off lightly'
If there were any real justice nowadays they would just demand the backtax and a small admin fee if necessary (not £85). But then the State would need to move away from their default position that those 'caught' are all criminals with intent rather than people making honest mistakes. If a few 'with intent' get away with what are realistically minor transgressions in order that the genuine cases are afforded the decency they should be then I'm alright with that. It used to happen.

So what should really happen is that nobody pays any form of tax. If they are lucky, then they get away with it. If they are unlucky, the worst that is going to happen is that they have to back-pay what was owed?
Deciding not to pay tax is a gamble. You get away with it, quids in, if you don't then you pay a fine for very basically, taking the piss.
Why do you feel that there should be no penalty for not paying what is owed at a time when it is due?

[Mikeyplum]

Recently got caught myself.

Hoenst mistake as was driving a few of my cars at the time and set up a DD on the wrong car. However, despite sending off (and receiving) a log book when I moved, the DVLA, in their infinite wisdom, decided to send all correspondence relating to the penalty to a previous address.

I only realise, when I have a Charging Order showing on my payslip for £585. Enquiries with payroll pointed me to HMCTS and that's where I discovered it was a DVLA fine.

I had to attend local Magistrates Court to sign a Statutory Declaration to solemnly swear I had no idea of the proceedings brought against me, then make a plea there and then. They agreed to my Stat Dec and restarted the case, which at least meant the £585 would be refunded. I asked for time to review evidence, which is when I had my "ahhh fking hell" moment, as I realised they had caught me fair and square.

I pled guilty in front of the Magistrate and asked for mitigating circumstances owing to the fact that if DVLA had sent the penalty to the correct address (of which was on the log book, which was part of their evidence) I would have paid the £85. I asked for Out of Court settlement, which I had not had the opportunity to take advantage of, because it was sent to the wrong address. "Sorry - we're in court now so not entitled to out of court settlement". fk sake.

Got fined £266 (which was 2/3s of the original £400 fine due to pleading guilty), had to pay £85 costs and £72.50 back duty.

fking lovely. bds.

[CABC]

Mikeyplum said:

Recently got caught myself.

Hoenst mistake as was driving a few of my cars at the time and set up a DD on the wrong car. However, despite sending off (and receiving) a log book when I moved, the DVLA, in their infinite wisdom, decided to send all correspondence relating to the penalty to a previous address.

I only realise, when I have a Charging Order showing on my payslip for £585. Enquiries with payroll pointed me to HMCTS and that's where I discovered it was a DVLA fine.

I had to attend local Magistrates Court to sign a Statutory Declaration to solemnly swear I had no idea of the proceedings brought against me, then make a plea there and then. They agreed to my Stat Dec and restarted the case, which at least meant the £585 would be refunded. I asked for time to review evidence, which is when I had my "ahhh fking hell" moment, as I realised they had caught me fair and square.

I pled guilty in front of the Magistrate and asked for mitigating circumstances owing to the fact that if DVLA had sent the penalty to the correct address (of which was on the log book, which was part of their evidence) I would have paid the £85. I asked for Out of Court settlement, which I had not had the opportunity to take advantage of, because it was sent to the wrong address. "Sorry - we're in court now so not entitled to out of court settlement". fk sake.

Got fined £266 (which was 2/3s of the original £400 fine due to pleading guilty), had to pay £85 costs and £72.50 back duty.

fking lovely. bds.

this issue is beyond dvla though and relates to many situations. Some entity chases you, at the wrong address, eventually leads to you being in court when they've eventually found you at the correct address. Magistrates then spend the entire day hearing statutory declarations from people. Happened to me (parking fine sent to 23 not 83 xxx St) i vented at the magistrate who suggested i should contact my MP. He was right (and looking very bored at the day's events), as only MPs can change the law.

[Sheepshanks]

Andrew--Stevenson said:

I just forgot.

Someone posted this up the other day: http://www.discybusiness.co.uk

Edited by Sheepshanks on Thursday 30th March 18:05

[Alucidnation]

Sheepshanks said:

rewc said:

Alucidnation said:

What is it then?

The Government call it a fine. They even have a website to allow you to pay it.

https://www.gov.uk/pay-dvla-fine

Interesting. It does go on to refer to it correctly as a penalty though, and if you click through to the next page it changes from "Pay a DVLA fine" to "Pay a DVLA penalty".

Only a court can fine you.

"The minimum penalty for speeding is a £100 fine and 3 penalty points added to your licence."

[MitchT]

£85? I'd just pay it and move on. It's enough to sting a little and encourage you to be more diligent in future, while not being enough to ruin your life.

[frankenstein12]

brrapp said:

frankenstein12 said:

brrapp said:

Andrew--Stevenson said:

We have all our cars paid via direct debit for Road tax

If this is the case then DVLA have made the mistake in not applying the direct debit. Don't pay the 'fine', ask them to apply the direct debit that they have in place. If they do try to refer it to court they'll be laughed out of the building.

Dont waste your time. They WILL NOT remove the penalty. There is no formal appeals process nor is there an independent body to oversee the processes at the DVLA.

I have been through all this. Just pay the fine/fraudsters and move on with life and make damn sure that in future if you pay by direct debit you check any debit order to the DVLA has gone out every month and further more check here https://www.gov.uk/check-vehicle-tax to make sure your car shows as taxed each month.

I now check it every two or three weeks as I simply do not trust those criminals to not try scam me out of more money.

The DVLA can't fine you. They can only impose a penalty which you have every right to refuse to pay. If you refuse to pay a DVLA penalty, they can refer it to the courts which do have the right to fine you if you are found guilty of an offence. There is no way a court would find you guilty in this circumstance.

Wrong. A court may still find you guilty it is not 100% guaranteed they will find in your favour meaning you have the stress and time wasting of going to court to contest something you probably shouldn't have to.

Even if the court finds in your favour the time and hassle spent on going to court to fight it is not really going to be worth it.

[meehaja]

I was certain the wifes car was taxed until feb 14, in march 14 the DVLA clamped it as it expired in october 13. Apparently it was my fault for not reminding her! I tihnk i got a fine, the back dated tax and a years tax upfront.

[Andrew--Stevenson]

The 'fine' ended up at almost £200 in the end, in hindsight I'd have like it to be just £85 ...

As someone up above keeps harping on about; I didn't choose to not pay, we were in the process of moving into our first owned house which needed building works as soon as we got the keys so we were very much focused on other things. I know this issue wouldn't have happened had the reminder gone to the correct (new) address, or the landlady/new tenant had bothered to forward our post .. (Again, Royal mail divert could have helped that one).

All in, we're lucky it wasn't more - moral of the story for us is to ensure that all documents are 100%! It's a shame, its knocked us back on what was an already tight budget having spaffed all our money on the house/move/decorating.

[cmaguire]

Stoofa said:

So what should really happen is that nobody pays any form of tax. If they are lucky, then they get away with it. If they are unlucky, the worst that is going to happen is that they have to back-pay what was owed?
Deciding not to pay tax is a gamble. You get away with it, quids in, if you don't then you pay a fine for very basically, taking the piss.
Why do you feel that there should be no penalty for not paying what is owed at a time when it is due?

Guess what, ultimately you have to pay it anyway, so just perhaps most people would pay it as they should. I would, because how would I gain anything by having them hassle me for it later.
The only people that tend to 'get away' with anything are the scrotes that opt out of the system, the rest of us get screwed to the floor at every opportunity because they know we can pay and if we don't they can make our lives a misery and there's nothing we can do about it.

[Sheepshanks]

Andrew--Stevenson said:

.. its knocked us back on what was an already tight budget having spaffed all our money on the house/move/decorating.

Don't get me wrong, I'd be gutted to have to spunk £200 on this, but against the scale of a house move etc it's surely neither here not there?

[Sheepshanks]

cmaguire said:

Guess what, ultimately you have to pay it anyway, so just perhaps most people would pay it as they should. I would, because how would I gain anything by having them hassle me for it later.

I would say a lot of people don't pay things until the threat of a penalty of some sort is hanging over them. I used to work with a bunch of people who all rejoiced in the odd bill slipping through the net.

[cmaguire]

Sheepshanks said:

I would say a lot of people don't pay things until the threat of a penalty of some sort is hanging over them. I used to work with a bunch of people who all rejoiced in the odd bill slipping through the net.

These people are the minority though, but these days we are all inflicted and affected by rules and regulations that cater for the dregs of society, be that through stupidity or criminality. I object to my freedoms being restricted and my honesty being questioned by these rules and the assumptions that go with them.
In summary, the State can fk off, I'm sick and tired of their interference.

[anth7714]

pay and move on if i were you.

a few years ago my partner at the time sold her car to a family friend she stupidly didn't send the change of ownership form on. Fast forward 6 months the car tax expired as their son who they bought the car for still hadn't passed his test. My ex ended up having to go to court and a fine of £250