Blanket 20mph limit across Wales from 2023
Discussion
ATG said:
I'll keep repeating it until the message cuts through; it is neither hard, labour intensive or expensive to get exemptions and signage in place for 30mph roads. My non-Labour county council managed the change without missing a beat, and we are under enormous financial strain.
When you have some councils facing bankruptcy, the very fact that it requires someone to do something and even the slightest spending of funds... It isn't going to happen. I suspect your local authority is more of an exception, rather than the rule.Some of the authorities I have to deal with, struggle to spend £5.99 on a cable from Amazon and end up spending more in admin costs due to their dithering.
M
camel_landy said:
ATG said:
I'll keep repeating it until the message cuts through; it is neither hard, labour intensive or expensive to get exemptions and signage in place for 30mph roads. My non-Labour county council managed the change without missing a beat, and we are under enormous financial strain.
When you have some councils facing bankruptcy, the very fact that it requires someone to do something and even the slightest spending of funds... It isn't going to happen. I suspect your local authority is more of an exception, rather than the rule.Some of the authorities I have to deal with, struggle to spend £5.99 on a cable from Amazon and end up spending more in admin costs due to their dithering.
M
Gwynedd Council has done a good job. As I have said before, when relatives visit from England to see us in Wales, only the last 100 metres in Wales to our door is 20mph, and that is deservedly so. Our visitors from England have probably traveled through more miles of 20 mph streets in England before they get to our 100 metres of 20mph.
Pica-Pica said:
I am with ATG.
Gwynedd Council has done a good job. As I have said before, when relatives visit from England to see us in Wales, only the last 100 metres in Wales to our door is 20mph, and that is deservedly so. Our visitors from England have probably traveled through more miles of 20 mph streets in England before they get to our 100 metres of 20mph.
Are we talking about the same thing though?Gwynedd Council has done a good job. As I have said before, when relatives visit from England to see us in Wales, only the last 100 metres in Wales to our door is 20mph, and that is deservedly so. Our visitors from England have probably traveled through more miles of 20 mph streets in England before they get to our 100 metres of 20mph.
I don't have an issue with the fact 20mph areas exist. My gripe is the 20 by default approach.
M
Penrhyn said:
I agree Gwynedd Council have indeed done a good job.
But Conwy have not.
They will not budge, we therefore need Vaughan Gethin todo what he promised and review the law.
There's no need to review the law, the guidance allows councils to make all the changes they need to make through exemptions. There's no mechanism for the Senedd to "call in" the councils on their implementation.But Conwy have not.
They will not budge, we therefore need Vaughan Gethin todo what he promised and review the law.
As Camel Lady has said, the question is more of funding to make changes. Funding has been provided for implementation and ongoing to end of this month. So a review will determine if further central funding is required to make further changes.
CoolHands said:
“preventing the likelihood of any such danger arising”
So they failed before they even start. Better make it 10. Or 5. Or ‘don’t leave the house’ speed
Indeed - it's the lack of "fSo they failed before they even start. Better make it 10. Or 5. Or ‘don’t leave the house’ speed
ks" given to justify the changes that is the most worrying. That same argument makes a worldwide 10mph limit much more logical.It’s an odd mentality (obviously why I’m not in local government)…
I’m going to prevent the likelihood of any such danger arising for children at school. No running in the playground for starters - I’ve seen kids fall over god damn it! Bloodied knees aplenty
No lining up in the lunch hall, I’ve seen too much jostling to allow it to continue. Feet HAVE been stood on. PE is henceforth banned, solid cricket balls whizzing about at high speed is clearly a breach of all sensible health and safety standards.
I’m going to prevent the likelihood of any such danger arising for children at school. No running in the playground for starters - I’ve seen kids fall over god damn it! Bloodied knees aplenty
No lining up in the lunch hall, I’ve seen too much jostling to allow it to continue. Feet HAVE been stood on. PE is henceforth banned, solid cricket balls whizzing about at high speed is clearly a breach of all sensible health and safety standards.
Evanivitch said:
Penrhyn said:
I agree Gwynedd Council have indeed done a good job.
But Conwy have not.
They will not budge, we therefore need Vaughan Gethin todo what he promised and review the law.
There's no need to review the law, the guidance allows councils to make all the changes they need to make through exemptions. There's no mechanism for the Senedd to "call in" the councils on their implementation.But Conwy have not.
They will not budge, we therefore need Vaughan Gethin todo what he promised and review the law.
As Camel Lady has said, the question is more of funding to make changes. Funding has been provided for implementation and ongoing to end of this month. So a review will determine if further central funding is required to make further changes.
ingenieur said:
Yes, but the funding won't come and the conditions for reversing limits which have been changed downwards will never be met to revise them back upwards to their original settings. I've never seen as best as I can recall any authority ever raising a speed limit in the UK. Happens a lot across the world but in the UK I can't think of a time when they've been increased.
...and that's the difference between ideology and reality.Throw into the mix the completely 'risk adverse' nature of the WG and you end up with the nanny state we're in today.
Death by Committee
M
camel_landy said:
ingenieur said:
Yes, but the funding won't come and the conditions for reversing limits which have been changed downwards will never be met to revise them back upwards to their original settings. I've never seen as best as I can recall any authority ever raising a speed limit in the UK. Happens a lot across the world but in the UK I can't think of a time when they've been increased.
...and that's the difference between ideology and reality.Throw into the mix the completely 'risk adverse' nature of the WG and you end up with the nanny state we're in today.
Death by Committee
M
Instead of encouraging safer motorbike/bike riding, less jaywalking it is all about getting all vehicles to crawl along the roads. Millions spent with the argument 'if we save one life...'. That's all well and good of course but where does it stop? 10mph blanket speed limits?
ingenieur said:
Yes, but the funding won't come
Why?ingenieur said:
and the conditions for reversing limits which have been changed downwards will never be met to revise them back upwards to their original settings.
Oh what basis?ingenieur said:
I've never seen as best as I can recall any authority ever raising a speed limit in the UK. Happens a lot across the world but in the UK I can't think of a time when they've been increased.
Do we tend to upgrade roads in the UK? Demolish homes and schools?I'm here in South Wales for the long weekend and experiencing the blanket limits for the first time; almost wish I hadnt bothered. Frustratingly slow on most roads and my car is constantly hunting between gears at anything below about 25. Around Swansea the signs change so often youre always braking or accelerating and its unclear what the limit is half the time, evidenced by some crawling along at 15 and others an inch from your bumper at 30+. Won't be in a rush to return as long as the travel is like this.
CLK-GTR said:
I'm here in South Wales for the long weekend and experiencing the blanket limits for the first time; almost wish I hadnt bothered. Frustratingly slow on most roads and my car is constantly hunting between gears at anything below about 25. Around Swansea the signs change so often youre always braking or accelerating and its unclear what the limit is half the time, evidenced by some crawling along at 15 and others an inch from your bumper at 30+. Won't be in a rush to return as long as the travel is like this.
Travelling in South Wales sounds like a nightmare.I'm planning a trip to Builth Wells in the next couple of weeks. Will be interesting to discover what impact 20 zones have there.
Getting to Builth will not be a problem on the main routes. Yes, some speed reduction through localised places on those routes, mainly through some villages. In Builth itself it won’t be a real change from the pre 20 days. Why? The town has a lot of narrow streets with choke points to hold up traffic so it has always been a slow drive through the town. The bridge crossing the river is a major choke point for the obvious reason of it being a river crossing in the town centre and routes converge on it.
Once past the Showground roundabout you have better roads with 40/50 limits or some NSL.
Once past the Showground roundabout you have better roads with 40/50 limits or some NSL.
CLK-GTR said:
I'm here in South Wales for the long weekend and experiencing the blanket limits for the first time; almost wish I hadnt bothered. Frustratingly slow on most roads and my car is constantly hunting between gears at anything below about 25. Around Swansea the signs change so often youre always braking or accelerating and its unclear what the limit is half the time, evidenced by some crawling along at 15 and others an inch from your bumper at 30+. Won't be in a rush to return as long as the travel is like this.
Swansea does have some odd implementations.ingenieur said:
Evanivitch said:
Penrhyn said:
I agree Gwynedd Council have indeed done a good job.
But Conwy have not.
They will not budge, we therefore need Vaughan Gethin todo what he promised and review the law.
There's no need to review the law, the guidance allows councils to make all the changes they need to make through exemptions. There's no mechanism for the Senedd to "call in" the councils on their implementation.But Conwy have not.
They will not budge, we therefore need Vaughan Gethin todo what he promised and review the law.
As Camel Lady has said, the question is more of funding to make changes. Funding has been provided for implementation and ongoing to end of this month. So a review will determine if further central funding is required to make further changes.
No one is going to increase a speed limit in wales or anywhere else. For the simple reason, as soon as a bad accident occurs, it will come straight back to them/ the person who signed it off. Who in their right mind is going to put themselves in that position, never mind a person employed by the council.
Whats done is done.
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