Elderly person had money taken

[Cat]

Bigends said:

Fair enough, dont even bother speaking to him if we already know what he's going to say.

No one has suggested that he shouldn't be spoken with. knock_knock has just explained the reality of what is likely to happen when he is.

Cat

[Bigends]

Cat said:

Bigends said:

Fair enough, dont even bother speaking to him if we already know what he's going to say.

No one has suggested that he shouldn't be spoken with. knock_knock has just explained the reality of what is likely to happen when he is.

Cat

How do we know - he might admit the theft straight off. Some that I dealt with made admissions and some didnt - every case is different. Itll also all depend on what evidence is gathered by the officer dealing prior to interview. There may be sufficient to charge in the event of denials or no comment. There is no 'reality' each case is different

[Rh14n]

Bigends said:

Cat said:

Bigends said:

Fair enough, dont even bother speaking to him if we already know what he's going to say.

No one has suggested that he shouldn't be spoken with. knock_knock has just explained the reality of what is likely to happen when he is.

Cat

How do we know - he might admit the theft straight off. Some that I dealt with made admissions and some didnt - every case is different. Itll also all depend on what evidence is gathered by the officer dealing prior to interview. There may be sufficient to charge in the event of denials or no comment. There is no 'reality' each case is different

This all day. Some of the Police-cynics are now suggesting they know the outcome/the Police will fob-off/won't go anywhere before they've even started. Even if it is her word against his, who is most likely to be believed? Let's just see how it goes. As I and others above have said, it's a despicable offence that any Police officer worth his/her salt will want to get a charge.

[Cat]

Bigends said:

How do we know - he might admit the theft straight off. Some that I dealt with made admissions and some didnt - every case is different. Itll also all depend on what evidence is gathered by the officer dealing prior to interview. There may be sufficient to charge in the event of denials or no comment. There is no 'reality' each case is different

He might admit it straight off, he might not. I know which is more likely from years of experience

Of course each case is different which is why I didn't claim there was a 'reality' that would happen, I pointed out that what knock_knock had posted was 'the reality of what was likely to happen'.

I'm not for one second suggesting it shouldn't be investigated but if you have the background you claim then you are being disingenuous if you are claiming the scenario given by knock_knock is not likely to happen

Cat

[Bigends]

Cat said:

Bigends said:

How do we know - he might admit the theft straight off. Some that I dealt with made admissions and some didnt - every case is different. Itll also all depend on what evidence is gathered by the officer dealing prior to interview. There may be sufficient to charge in the event of denials or no comment. There is no 'reality' each case is different

He might admit it straight off, he might not. I know which is more likely from years of experience

Of course each case is different which is why I didn't claim there was a 'reality' that would happen, I pointed out that what knock_knock had posted was 'the reality of what was likely to happen'.

I'm not for one second suggesting it shouldn't be investigated but if you have the background you claim then you are being disingenuous if you are claiming the scenario given by knock_knock is not likely to happen

Cat

Which is more likely then, and why? I went into every job open minded. Some I thought would open up and admit everything suddenly clammed up with no comment. Others I thought would be hard work - made admissions from the start. Until the introductions are over in interview and the first question posed - theres no way of knowing

Edited by Bigends on Sunday 10th September 21:20

[Cat]

Bigends said:

Which is more likely then, and why? I went into every job open minded. Some I thought would open up and admit everything suddenly clammed up with no comment. Others I thought would be hard work - made admissions from the start. Until the introductions are over in interview and the first question posed - theres no way of knowing

It has nothing to do with open mindedness. You can't know what is going to happen in a particular case. You can know what is likely to happen. The more likely scenario is that there will not be a full and frank admission.

In your experience which happened more often - people admitted offences in interview or said nothing/lied? Be honest.

Cat

Edited by Cat on Sunday 10th September 21:48

[Bigends]

Cat said:

Bigends said:

Which is more likely then, and why? I went into every job open minded. Some I thought would open up and admit everything suddenly clammed up with no comment. Others I thought would be hard work - made admissions from the start. Until the introductions are over in interview and the first question posed - theres no way of knowing

It has nothing to do with open mindedness. You can't know what is going to happen in a particular case. You can know what is likely to happen. The more likely scenario is that there will not be a full and frank admission.

In your experience which happened more oftern - people admitted offences in interview or said nothing/lied? Be honest.

Cat

Absolutely Impossible to generalise - every job/suspect was different. Some no commented - some made admissions. We dont know the background of this bloke or the reasons he had for stealing the funds both may affect his approach to the investigation. Lets wait and see how the Police get on with this one, but I wont hold my breath

[Cat]

Bigends said:

Absolutely Impossible to generalise - every job/suspect was different. Some no commented - some made admissions. We dont know the background of this bloke or the reasons he had for stealing the funds both may affect his approach to the investigation. Lets wait and see how the Police get on with this one, but I wont hold my breath

I'm not asking you to generalise - I'm asking which you experienced more often -an admission or no comment/lies?

The fact that you've chosen not to answer speaks volumes.

Cat

[Knock_knock]

Cat said:

I'm not asking you to generalise - I'm asking which you experienced more often -an admission or no comment/lies?

The fact that you've chosen not to answer speaks volumes.

Cat

I'll answer in his place.

My knowledge is a few years out of date now, as after 15 years service I recognised that the Tories were going to decimate the CJ system and jumped into the private sector. Now I conduct internal investigations for a multinational company, but in the police I went from uniform to CID via a Prisoner Interview Team. I did PIT for nearly four years and loved it, in many ways it was the best role I had. Each day I would interview for a variety of offences, some trivial some very serious. I was damn fine interviewer.

Overwhelmingly people only talked in interview if they were actually innocent, or if they had been advised that admissions to an offence would result in an out of court disposal (caution or similar).

Overall I reckon no more than 10% of people would talk, regardless of how much or how little pre-interview disclosure was given, and how much or how little evidence there was. If they had committed the offence and couldn't get a caution they didn't talk.

Once in a blue moon did I get admissions but with strong defences raised, and if defences were raised it was almost always by Prepared Statement followed by a No Comment interview.

Even more rare was an open account of lies. I loved these as I would let them lie and lie and then disassemble their account step by step. Very satisfying but soooo unusual.

I got to know one of the Defence Solicitors really well. He was excellent and very fair, and we had a very good working relationship. I am still in touch with him now, and were I ever on the "wrong side" of the table I would ask for him by name. He was always very open about why nobody spoke - because they were guilty of the offence and talking could never make things better for them but might make things worse. It was risk management, nothing more. He would only advise talking if you were innocent or if he knew you were eligible for a caution and that a caution was a suitable disposal.

A year or so back we chatted over coffee and I asked if it was true that now even fewer people would speak and he said it was. The reasoning was simply that with few experienced police left, and much greater case loads held by the officers, the risks of speaking were greater as it might provide lines of enquiry that otherwise simply wouldn't exist. By not giving any account he reckoned it improved the chances of the job being NFA'd quite a bit in the current world.

[James6112]

I’m surprised Age Uk were so flippant.
When I found out that my mother was bailing out a relative (who needed money to settle a drug debt…) they were most helpful & stepped in with some solid advice. As in don’t pay the waster/scammer.
Simultaneously he was warned off, didn’t happen again.

[Bigends]

Blimey - apologies for not answering immediately. I retired in 2005 - 18years back, after 30yrs uniform service, the last 4 on a beat crime unit dealing with exactly this type of incident. We were all PEACE trained. I wasnt a bad interviewer either and was always fully prepped before interviewWe'd be allocated most crimes with a named or easily traceable suspect ( on top of all DNA, fingerprint hits prison visits/productions and numerous other jobs. We were a detections machine in the days of home office target setting so were under pressure for detections) I'd be in interview probably 4 - 5 times a week, either with my prisoner or assisting others. I honestly wouldn't have a clue in relation to the proportion of no comment interviews with prepared statement (or not) and those where the suspect chose to answer questions. It di dnt concern me either way whether they spoke or not - i'd either have enough evidence gathered to charge - or not. Sorry cant be any clearer.

Edited by Bigends on Sunday 10th September 23:26

[Zeeky]

Despite the arguments above the vulnerability of the victim in this case ought to persuade the police to investigate despite the low probablity of an admission.

[Dibble]

Bigends said:

Blimey - apologies for not answering immediately. I retired in 2005 - 18years back, after 30yrs uniform service, the last 4 on a beat crime unit dealing with exactly this type of incident. We were all PEACE trained. I wasnt a bad interviewer either and was always fully prepped before interviewWe'd be allocated most crimes with a named or easily traceable suspect ( on top of all DNA, fingerprint hits prison visits/productions and numerous other jobs. We were a detections machine in the days of home office target setting so were under pressure for detections) I'd be in interview probably 4 - 5 times a week, either with my prisoner or assisting others. I honestly wouldn't have a clue in relation to the proportion of no comment interviews with prepared statement (or not) and those where the suspect chose to answer questions. It di dnt concern me either way whether they spoke or not - i'd either have enough evidence gathered to charge - or not. Sorry cant be any clearer.

Edited by Bigends on Sunday 10th September 23:26

Elevenerifer.

[imagineifyeswill]

Something very much the same happened with my mother. We only found out when she went into a home with dementia, at the pont we discovered it he had stolen at least £18,000, the police took it seriously and he was charged, that was 3 years ago and my mother is dead now but it still hasn't got to court.

[Bigends]

Dibble said:

Bigends said:

Blimey - apologies for not answering immediately. I retired in 2005 - 18years back, after 30yrs uniform service, the last 4 on a beat crime unit dealing with exactly this type of incident. We were all PEACE trained. I wasnt a bad interviewer either and was always fully prepped before interviewWe'd be allocated most crimes with a named or easily traceable suspect ( on top of all DNA, fingerprint hits prison visits/productions and numerous other jobs. We were a detections machine in the days of home office target setting so were under pressure for detections) I'd be in interview probably 4 - 5 times a week, either with my prisoner or assisting others. I honestly wouldn't have a clue in relation to the proportion of no comment interviews with prepared statement (or not) and those where the suspect chose to answer questions. It di dnt concern me either way whether they spoke or not - i'd either have enough evidence gathered to charge - or not. Sorry cant be any clearer.

Edited by Bigends on Sunday 10th September 23:26

Elevenerifer.

Not at all, I'm not playing top trumps on who did the most and when - just outlining, I was busy and wouldnt have a clue as to how many spoke in interview or didnt, though do recall the bulk of those arrested on forensic hits were no commenters as were most legal visits - as for the remainder - no ideas

Edited by Bigends on Monday 11th September 14:12

[Roger Irrelevant]

Rh14n said:

blueST said:

I spoke to the police today, very sympathetic, they’ve taken the details and given me a log number. They’ve put it down as a theft and said someone will be in touch.

Absolutely right. Keep us updated Blue.

+1. I can't believe some of the replies on here - 'Don't bother reporting it as the police won't do anything' - well they certainly won't if nobody bothers to report it will they? I can well believe that the chances of getting a conviction are slim but just having the BiB show up at his house asking questions might dissuade the slimeball from pulling a similar stunt in future.

[carinaman]

Given the general topic of the thread, and another in SP&L, I thought it may be of interest to share that:

https://www.lloydsbankinggroup.com/media/press-rel...

I wasn't aware banks could issue cards for trusted 'carers'.

[GoodOlBoy]

Roger Irrelevant said:

+1. I can't believe some of the replies on here - 'Don't bother reporting it as the police won't do anything' - well they certainly won't if nobody bothers to report it will they? I can well believe that the chances of getting a conviction are slim but just having the BiB show up at his house asking questions might dissuade the slimeball from pulling a similar stunt in future.

An elderly lady friend of mine was the subject of an unprovoked attack recently. She was physically assaulted by a younger woman while walking her dog. Woman in question has verbally abused and threatened others on several occasions and clearly has "issues". The location is a popular dog-walkers route.

Friend receive a black eye and a swollen face for her troubles. She told the woman that she was calling the police and did so. Thankfully the woman couldn't continue the assault as she had her own dogs to control.

Police later took a statement (by phone) and also told her that the woman in question had phoned them and admitted that she had "slapped" my friend. Police advised my friend to walk her dog on a different route (she lives there) and said they would look into it. Friend was less than impressed after the call. My friend has managed to find the woman's name and also details of other locals who have been threatened/abused and forwarded them. The woman lives five miles away.

The officer dealing with the case is based at a station 70 miles away from friends location and has now gone on holiday for two weeks. My friend wasn't aware that the officer had gone away until she called her. No one from the local police have spoken to or visited my friend.

Surely a visit from a local officer to the woman who had carried out the assault would have been appropriate in the first instance ?

Woman is now back walking her dogs and my friend is too scared to take her dog out.

It's not difficult to understand why many of us have little or no faith in the police.

[XCP]

70 miles is a fair distance away. What area is this?

[GoodOlBoy]

XCP said:

70 miles is a fair distance away. What area is this?

North Yorkshire