Daftness with bike this afternoon

[The Gauge]

5s Alive said:

JulianHJ said:

That's very subjective. When I used to drive on blue light runs, it was often easier to navigate around stopped vehicles (provided they weren't in the middle of the carriageway or becoming an unnecessary obstruction). Personally I'll indicate and pull over if I think it makes it safer and easier for all involved.

Incidentally, going back to the OP's mistake - when travelling in convoy on blues, the risks of a collision are heightened due to the fact that inattentive drivers would see the first vehicle pass and not be aware of the second one following. I saw this on a number of occasions (thankfully without incident due to my awareness). It's one of the reasons you might hear vehicles in convoy using different siren types in order to help other road users identify and distinguish the two (or more) responding vehicles.

It depends on the circumstances and layout. Usually, slowing and pulling over is enough

Yep, simply moving over to the left and slowing a little, but keep going is the best way for them to pass and prevent mayhem. On a dual carriageway cars moving out to the left and right respectively to create a gap down the middle, but there's always one plonker that does the opposite.

Most people just freeze and come to a sudden stop creating a gridlock, and still don't move even when they can see the emergency vehicle can't get past them. there's seldom any real gain in coming to a stop.

[J__Wood]

nikaiyo2 said:

Ahh ok my bad, did not realise that following a police car at 50% above the speed limit was right.
.

So he was following the Police car at 50% over the limit as he passed you and then from a standing start you caught up with him? How much over the limit did you need to do?

[Solocle]

Ken_Code said:

I thought of this thread as I caught up to a police car in town today. It had its lights and siren on, and was clearly on an emergency call, but traffic being what it is I and a few other bikes ended up behind it.

There were a couple of places where I could have been around it and off while not getting in their way at all, but of course didn’t.

The OP may well have gone across another biker just doing this, catching up a police car and following it at a sensible distance.

Yeah, a while back I was filtering down a jammed dual carriageway on my bike (the unmotorised variety, but same principle). Ambulance approaching behind, pull into an available gap on the right, once they were past I continued filtering. While mindful the gap might narrow, it wasn't an undue concern in the situation.

[Hol]

J__Wood said:

nikaiyo2 said:

Ahh ok my bad, did not realise that following a police car at 50% above the speed limit was right.
.

So he was following the Police car at 50% over the limit as he passed you and then from a standing start you caught up with him? How much over the limit did you need to do?

Are you personally insulted because the general consensus is that people who tailgate blue light vehicles are wkers?

[J__Wood]

Hol said:

J__Wood said:

nikaiyo2 said:

Ahh ok my bad, did not realise that following a police car at 50% above the speed limit was right.
.

So he was following the Police car at 50% over the limit as he passed you and then from a standing start you caught up with him? How much over the limit did you need to do?

Are you personally insulted because the general consensus is that people who tailgate blue light vehicles are wonkers?

Well I am now insulted and rather confused, at any point did I say "people who tailgate blue light vehicles aren't wkers"?

I was trying to understand the OP's apparent outrage when stressing "...50% over the limit"
combined with
"I pulled over"
"I stupidly followed, he tried to get away but struggled, so we were going a bit quick"

Surely just a case of when two idiots almost collide?

[Nibbles_bits]

The Gauge said:

5s Alive said:

JulianHJ said:

That's very subjective. When I used to drive on blue light runs, it was often easier to navigate around stopped vehicles (provided they weren't in the middle of the carriageway or becoming an unnecessary obstruction). Personally I'll indicate and pull over if I think it makes it safer and easier for all involved.

Incidentally, going back to the OP's mistake - when travelling in convoy on blues, the risks of a collision are heightened due to the fact that inattentive drivers would see the first vehicle pass and not be aware of the second one following. I saw this on a number of occasions (thankfully without incident due to my awareness). It's one of the reasons you might hear vehicles in convoy using different siren types in order to help other road users identify and distinguish the two (or more) responding vehicles.

It depends on the circumstances and layout. Usually, slowing and pulling over is enough

Yep, simply moving over to the left and slowing a little, but keep going is the best way for them to pass and prevent mayhem. On a dual carriageway cars moving out to the left and right respectively to create a gap down the middle, but there's always one plonker that does the opposite.

Most people just freeze and come to a sudden stop creating a gridlock, and still don't move even when they can see the emergency vehicle can't get past them. there's seldom any real gain in coming to a stop.

That's not the advice I want people to be given.

If you hear a siren and/or see emergency lighting, stop if it's safe to do so.

If you continue driving, you could be reducing the size of a safe gap that the driver has seen. You may not have seen that gap because you're not looking for it.

From 'Bluelight Aware' (a site that every driver should visit) -

"If you hear a siren or see blue lights, stay calm. Look for somewhere safe to move left and stop. Keep going on the approach to a bend or on the brow of a hill – then pull over when there’s a better view ahead. Stay out of bus lanes, keep off kerbs and pavements, and don’t stop near traffic islands."

"On motorways and dual carriageways, pull over to the left to allow an emergency vehicle to pass in the outside lane if it’s clear. If traffic is slowing or stationary and there is no lane for the emergency vehicle, its position will let you know whether to move to the right or the left. When you’ve let it through, stay where you are as other vehicles are likely to be coming through"

"If you’re approaching a roundabout or a junction and you see an emergency vehicle, look at its position, as this will let you know where it wants you to go. If you’re already at the junction, be patient and wait for it to come past. There may be more than one emergency vehicle, so check before moving off."


It's much easier to navigate around stationary vehicles than those that think their helping by "slowing".

[The Gauge]

Nibbles_bits said:

It's much easier to navigate around stationary vehicles than those that think their helping by "slowing".

Not when they all just suddenly stop and block the road cus they don't know what to do, I find it better for traffic to move over & slow down but keep moving. A sensible driver knows how to do this, a clueless driver just comes to a stop

[Nibbles_bits]

The Gauge said:

Nibbles_bits said:

It's much easier to navigate around stationary vehicles than those that think their helping by "slowing".

Not when they all just suddenly stop and block the road cus they don't know what to do, I find it better for traffic to move over & slow down but keep moving. A sensible driver knows how to do this, a clueless driver just comes to a stop

A sensible driver comes to a stop when it's safe to do so

[The Gauge]

Nibbles_bits said:

A sensible driver comes to a stop when it's safe to do so

That's my point, they aren't usually sensible and just block the road. Some even stop when the emergency vehicle is on the other side of the road driving towards them with no other traffic in sight, such is their panic with not knowing what to do.

[E-bmw]

I too have seen it before when some ingrate has just done an emergency stop in a position where it is impossible to pass & the Ambulance just had to sit there behind them until they eventually realised they were an idiot.

[Hereward]

The Gauge said:

FMOB said:

I suspect a kick in the nuts might get through..

And grabbing hold of the front bottom...

[Biker's Nemesis]

This is how it can go when the Red mist sets in.

[Hungrymc]

The Gauge said:

Nibbles_bits said:

A sensible driver comes to a stop when it's safe to do so

That's my point, they aren't usually sensible and just block the road. Some even stop when the emergency vehicle is on the other side of the road driving towards them with no other traffic in sight, such is their panic with not knowing what to do.

An increasing number of drivers just stop irrespective of the situation. I’ve seen so many recently stop when there is no gap for the blue light vehicle to pass through (oncoming traffic etc). I don’t think the message is very well communicated.

[hidetheelephants]

Narrowly avoiding a SMIDSY with a bike isn't the way to win friends and influence people, the fact the biker is a bellend doesn't mitigate your mistake.

[Nibbles_bits]

Hungrymc said:

The Gauge said:

Nibbles_bits said:

A sensible driver comes to a stop when it's safe to do so

That's my point, they aren't usually sensible and just block the road. Some even stop when the emergency vehicle is on the other side of the road driving towards them with no other traffic in sight, such is their panic with not knowing what to do.

An increasing number of drivers just stop irrespective of the situation. I’ve seen so many recently stop when there is no gap for the blue light vehicle to pass through (oncoming traffic etc). I don’t think the message is very well communicated.

I've nearly had a crash on a Bluelight run because the on both sides of the road wouldn't just stop.

I moved onto the other side of the road and island to overtake. The car I was going to overtake (a marked police car) decided to keep moving rather than stop.
The car coming towards me decided to keep moving rather than stop.
So the two gaps I'd identified were no longer available.

I either ran into the side of the car I was overtaking, have a head on or come to a complete stop before I hit the island (which kind of defeats the purpose of using lights and sirens to make progress).

All 3 outcomes could have been avoided if the other drivers had just stopped (because it was safe to do so).

[Alex@POD]

Nibbles_bits said:

I've nearly had a crash on a Bluelight run because the on both sides of the road wouldn't just stop.

I moved onto the other side of the road and island to overtake. The car I was going to overtake (a marked police car) decided to keep moving rather than stop.
The car coming towards me decided to keep moving rather than stop.
So the two gaps I'd identified were no longer available.

I either ran into the side of the car I was overtaking, have a head on or come to a complete stop before I hit the island (which kind of defeats the purpose of using lights and sirens to make progress).

All 3 outcomes could have been avoided if the other drivers had just stopped (because it was safe to do so).

I think this comes down to specific circumstances, just like it would in every case. If a blue light is coming from behind me, and there are traffic Islands, I'll pull over and stop. If it's a wide road with a hatched separation and no obstructions, I will probably just slow down. If the blue light is ahead of me and their lane is clear, I'll just carry on driving normally.

[The Gauge]

Nibbles_bits said:

I've nearly had a crash on a Bluelight run because the on both sides of the road wouldn't just stop.

I moved onto the other side of the road and island to overtake. The car I was going to overtake (a marked police car) decided to keep moving rather than stop.
The car coming towards me decided to keep moving rather than stop.
So the two gaps I'd identified were no longer available.

I either ran into the side of the car I was overtaking, have a head on or come to a complete stop before I hit the island (which kind of defeats the purpose of using lights and sirens to make progress).

All 3 outcomes could have been avoided if the other drivers had just stopped (because it was safe to do so).

That's just one occasion, but most of the time when cars stop they do so needlessly because they don't know what else to do. When everyone stops needlessly they often block the road whereas if they simply indicated, moved over and slowed down that's usually sufficient to create space for the emergency vehicle to pass. This also shows to the emergency driver that they know they are there and are creating space for them.

There's times when I've had an emergency vehicle behind me with blues & twos when I've actually speeded up to get to an area I can see ahead that allows me to create space for them to pass. Just instantly coming to a stop can be a dumb thing to do.

[FMOB]

The Gauge said:

Nibbles_bits said:

I've nearly had a crash on a Bluelight run because the on both sides of the road wouldn't just stop.

I moved onto the other side of the road and island to overtake. The car I was going to overtake (a marked police car) decided to keep moving rather than stop.
The car coming towards me decided to keep moving rather than stop.
So the two gaps I'd identified were no longer available.

I either ran into the side of the car I was overtaking, have a head on or come to a complete stop before I hit the island (which kind of defeats the purpose of using lights and sirens to make progress).

All 3 outcomes could have been avoided if the other drivers had just stopped (because it was safe to do so).

That's just one occasion, but most of the time when cars stop they do so needlessly because they don't know what else to do. When everyone stops needlessly they often block the road whereas if they simply indicated, moved over and slowed down that's usually sufficient to create space for the emergency vehicle to pass. This also shows to the emergency driver that they know they are there and are creating space for them.

There's times when I've had an emergency vehicle behind me with blues & twos when I've actually speeded up to get to an area I can see ahead that allows me to create space for them to pass. Just instantly coming to a stop can be a dumb thing to do.

I suspect some people just panic in these situations and freeze where they are, not sure what to do. Add in the media stories where people are prosecuted for doing the right thing but doing it the wrong way just adds to any existing worries they might have.

I think the law isn't consistent in this area with the 'make way for' but 'don't break the law doing it' approach.

[The Gauge]

FMOB said:

I suspect some people just panic in these situations and freeze where they are, not sure what to do. Add in the media stories where people are prosecuted for doing the right thing but doing it the wrong way just adds to any existing worries they might have.

I think the law isn't consistent in this area with the 'make way for' but 'don't break the law doing it' approach.

Yes, there are always occasions when stopping is the right thing to do, but just stopping for the sake of it can hold them up if they all block the road.


Certainly cars who are stopped at a red light and then go through to get out of their way can feel the wrath of the law for their troubles, especially if a red light camera flashes them. I know emergency vehicles are supposed to turn their lights & siren off on approach to a red light to prevent folk feeling forced to go through, but that doesn't always happen.

Edited by The Gauge on Saturday 20th April 20:42

[OddCat]

RGG said:

I need a proof reader for a book I'm writing.

Interested?

Good money paid

Random. Or am I due a parrot ?