Discussion
Any advice welcome, stupid situation.
Hope you follow this!....
Party A: Hubby's workmate's daughter.
Party B: Hubby's workmate's daughter's (ex)boyfriend.
The two of them bought a new car (55 reg Golf)
She borrowed the money with an unsecured personal loan
'For insurance purposes' they put his name on the V5 (no, I don't understand that either)
They split up (like you couldn't see THAT coming)
Can she prove any sort of legal ownership, and how would that work? He's taken the car away, so does she have any right to locate it?
I know legally she's pretty much stuffed, but any help will be appreciated.
Hope you follow this!....
Party A: Hubby's workmate's daughter.
Party B: Hubby's workmate's daughter's (ex)boyfriend.
The two of them bought a new car (55 reg Golf)
She borrowed the money with an unsecured personal loan
'For insurance purposes' they put his name on the V5 (no, I don't understand that either)
They split up (like you couldn't see THAT coming)
Can she prove any sort of legal ownership, and how would that work? He's taken the car away, so does she have any right to locate it?
I know legally she's pretty much stuffed, but any help will be appreciated.
All is not lost!
You say that they bought the car together, but it seems that it is the case that she paid for the car in full?
If he has even paid a nominal amount, then the situation is more complex, which I can suggest a way forward if needed.
However, assuming that she paid for the car in full, then she is still the owner of the car. The V5 document shows the name of the registered keeper of the vehicle which does not mean that it belongs to them!
My first point of call would be to contact him in an informal basis, and explain clearly that she is the owner of the car and wants it back.
If that fails I would write a letter by registered post explaining the situation and that he needs to return her property within 7 days or that it will be reported stolen.
If that doesnt work, I would go down to the local police station. She can show that she has asked for the car back, and if he has not responded, it would seem obvious that he has the 'intent to permenantly deprive' her of the car. This co-incidentally is the technical definition of theft. I would have thought that the local police station would either infomally give him a knock on the door to explain the situation. I am not sure how 'informal' the police can be in such a situation but I am sure that Dwight or some of the other friendly BiB will fill in the blanks.
If they cannot do this, I see no reason if she can prove to the police she is the owner (loan agreement, bank statement with money transfer, receipt for car) that she cannot report the car stolen. After that it is only a matter of time until he gets picked up by one of the digital number plate checking cameras and he gets stopped by the police and most likely arrested!
Either way she should get the car back unharmed, or she will have the smugness of finding out he has been arrested...!
Hope this helps.
You say that they bought the car together, but it seems that it is the case that she paid for the car in full?
If he has even paid a nominal amount, then the situation is more complex, which I can suggest a way forward if needed.
However, assuming that she paid for the car in full, then she is still the owner of the car. The V5 document shows the name of the registered keeper of the vehicle which does not mean that it belongs to them!
My first point of call would be to contact him in an informal basis, and explain clearly that she is the owner of the car and wants it back.
If that fails I would write a letter by registered post explaining the situation and that he needs to return her property within 7 days or that it will be reported stolen.
If that doesnt work, I would go down to the local police station. She can show that she has asked for the car back, and if he has not responded, it would seem obvious that he has the 'intent to permenantly deprive' her of the car. This co-incidentally is the technical definition of theft. I would have thought that the local police station would either infomally give him a knock on the door to explain the situation. I am not sure how 'informal' the police can be in such a situation but I am sure that Dwight or some of the other friendly BiB will fill in the blanks.
If they cannot do this, I see no reason if she can prove to the police she is the owner (loan agreement, bank statement with money transfer, receipt for car) that she cannot report the car stolen. After that it is only a matter of time until he gets picked up by one of the digital number plate checking cameras and he gets stopped by the police and most likely arrested!
Either way she should get the car back unharmed, or she will have the smugness of finding out he has been arrested...!
Hope this helps.
Best bet here is reposess car by force if needed. change name on V5 by appling for a new one. Then put car in auction and get rid. Send ex BF cheque for his portion of balance if any after paying off personal loan. All he could do then is claim she did not have good title to the car which is a case he will never win.
MilnerR said:
Why do we have to call it TWOC'd? I rather like the term grand theft auto.... we should use it more!
Because for some bizzare reason taking a car in this country is not considered theft, hence it gets it's own separate piece of legislation. (IIRC it's because you cannot prove that the scumbag didn't intend to return it, or something along those lines).
^Slider^ said:
Report it TWOC'd. The car will be impounded untill ownership can be confirmed.
Then he has to prove he is the owner and she likewise.
He won't have much trouble proving ownership (to the Police's satisfaction) as the V5's in his name.
I would imagine that the Police wouldn't be interested and will say it's a civil matter.
Also, who cares? It's the stupid girls problem, and doesn't sound like she's too bothered.
deva link said:
Report it TWOC'd. The car will be impounded untill ownership can be confirmed.
Then he has to prove he is the owner and she likewise.
He won't have much trouble proving ownership (to the Police's satisfaction) as the V5's in his name.
I would imagine that the Police wouldn't be interested and will say it's a civil matter.
Also, who cares? It's the stupid girls problem, and doesn't sound like she's too bothered.
I disagree. The V5 document is the keeper of the vehicle not the owner. For example, if I were to buy a company car and it was just for me to drive, I would put myself as the registered keeper, yet that would not make the car mine.
If there is no dispute of ownership, ie. who paid for the car, and if he is refusing to give the car back, it is a criminal matter.
The last comment you make I agree with though. She *is* going to have to do the leg work herself and confront him about it if she wants the car back.
justinp1 said:
^Slider^ said:
Report it TWOC'd. The car will be impounded untill ownership can be confirmed.
Then he has to prove he is the owner and she likewise.
He won't have much trouble proving ownership (to the Police's satisfaction) as the V5's in his name.
I would imagine that the Police wouldn't be interested and will say it's a civil matter.
Also, who cares? It's the stupid girls problem, and doesn't sound like she's too bothered.
I disagree. The V5 document is the keeper of the vehicle not the owner. For example, if I were to buy a company car and it was just for me to drive, I would put myself as the registered keeper, yet that would not make the car mine.
If there is no dispute of ownership, ie. who paid for the car, and if he is refusing to give the car back, it is a criminal matter.
Of course you're correct - however the problem I see is getting the Police do anything about it, especially in the absence of any other proof of ownership.
deva link said:
deva link said:
^Slider^ said:
Report it TWOC'd. The car will be impounded untill ownership can be confirmed.
Then he has to prove he is the owner and she likewise.
He won't have much trouble proving ownership (to the Police's satisfaction) as the V5's in his name.
I would imagine that the Police wouldn't be interested and will say it's a civil matter.
Also, who cares? It's the stupid girls problem, and doesn't sound like she's too bothered.
I disagree. The V5 document is the keeper of the vehicle not the owner. For example, if I were to buy a company car and it was just for me to drive, I would put myself as the registered keeper, yet that would not make the car mine.
If there is no dispute of ownership, ie. who paid for the car, and if he is refusing to give the car back, it is a criminal matter.
Of course you're correct - however the problem I see is getting the Police do anything about it, especially in the absence of any other proof of ownership.
If the car is bought from a dealership she will have a receipt?
Do you mind telling us what happened with this?
I've got a friend in the same situation, he took out a personal loan to buy a car, girlfriend's name on the V5 as she was main driver. He caught her cheating, she buggered off with the car.
I'm pretty sure the car is legally his and its certainly morally his (she hasn't paid for any of the car as far as I know), but now she's talked to her parents she is refusing to give it back.
Next stop will have to be the police I expect, hopefully just the threat of that will make her give it back.
Bloody mess anyway...
I've got a friend in the same situation, he took out a personal loan to buy a car, girlfriend's name on the V5 as she was main driver. He caught her cheating, she buggered off with the car.
I'm pretty sure the car is legally his and its certainly morally his (she hasn't paid for any of the car as far as I know), but now she's talked to her parents she is refusing to give it back.
Next stop will have to be the police I expect, hopefully just the threat of that will make her give it back.
Bloody mess anyway...
Has he got a reason to keep the car? Does she owe him something or is she being entirely honest about the deal?
If they bought the car as a couple, regardless of who actualy paid for it, then surely he only needs to give her half the current market value to make a fair settlement. Unless of course there is another reason for him to consider the car his that we haven't been told.
Judging by the number of women who try to blacken their ex's name or try to take the mickey over money after a split I wouldn't be surprised if had a fair claim to the car!
If they bought the car as a couple, regardless of who actualy paid for it, then surely he only needs to give her half the current market value to make a fair settlement. Unless of course there is another reason for him to consider the car his that we haven't been told.
Judging by the number of women who try to blacken their ex's name or try to take the mickey over money after a split I wouldn't be surprised if had a fair claim to the car!
Gassing Station | Speed, Plod & the Law | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff