Speed limit for death crash road
Discussion
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/cu
The speed limit on a stretch of road in Cumbria where six people died in a two-car crash, is to be lowered.
Five members of the same family and an 84-year-old Manchester man were killed on Sunday at a notorious accident black spot on the A6 near Plumpton.
Cumbria County Council now says it is to reduce the speed limit from 60mph to 40mph, and make other changes to improve safety.
Police are continuing to investigate the cause of the crash.
Ricky Stott, 19, from Penrith, Cumbria, was driving a Ford Escort when it collided with a Toyota Prius.
His sisters, Kirsty, 17, and Lindsey, eight, his 21-year-old partner Sarah Wigham and their four-month-old baby son, Luca, were also in the Escort.
The Toyota driver, 84-year-old Stanley Critchley from Northenden, Greater Manchester, also died in the crash, while his 79-year-old wife Elizabeth was taken to hospital with critical injuries.
'Terrible' shock
In a statement, Cumbria County Council said: "We have been shocked and saddened by Sunday's tragic accident on the A6 near Plumpton, which is being investigated by the police.
"In the meantime, we are pressing ahead with existing plans to introduce a new 40mph speed limit in the area.
"The scheme will include interactive "slow down" signs, road markings and lighting. Work is due to start early in August."
Tributes have been placed at the scene of the crash.
Betty and Derek Stott, grandparents of Ricky, Kirsty and Lindsey, described the family as "popular and loving".
Jean Wilson-Jowsey, head teacher of North Lakes primary school in Penrith, where eight-year-old Lindsey was a pupil, added: "This awful news has come as a terrible shock to everyone in the school.
"Lindsey was a very friendly, bubbly and cheerful girl who had many friends at the school.
"We've told all the children in their individual classrooms about Lindsey's death. Our thoughts and prayers are with her family."
The police say "its too early to speculate" on the causes of the crash and they're already pressing for a change in the speed limit. A young driver. An elderly driver. All sorts of possibilities, reasons and things that may or may not make a difference and the first thing they do...
I despair I really do.
bbc said:
The speed limit on a stretch of road in Cumbria where six people died in a two-car crash, is to be lowered.
Five members of the same family and an 84-year-old Manchester man were killed on Sunday at a notorious accident black spot on the A6 near Plumpton.
Cumbria County Council now says it is to reduce the speed limit from 60mph to 40mph, and make other changes to improve safety.
Police are continuing to investigate the cause of the crash.
Ricky Stott, 19, from Penrith, Cumbria, was driving a Ford Escort when it collided with a Toyota Prius.
His sisters, Kirsty, 17, and Lindsey, eight, his 21-year-old partner Sarah Wigham and their four-month-old baby son, Luca, were also in the Escort.
The Toyota driver, 84-year-old Stanley Critchley from Northenden, Greater Manchester, also died in the crash, while his 79-year-old wife Elizabeth was taken to hospital with critical injuries.
'Terrible' shock
In a statement, Cumbria County Council said: "We have been shocked and saddened by Sunday's tragic accident on the A6 near Plumpton, which is being investigated by the police.
"In the meantime, we are pressing ahead with existing plans to introduce a new 40mph speed limit in the area.
"The scheme will include interactive "slow down" signs, road markings and lighting. Work is due to start early in August."
Tributes have been placed at the scene of the crash.
Betty and Derek Stott, grandparents of Ricky, Kirsty and Lindsey, described the family as "popular and loving".
Jean Wilson-Jowsey, head teacher of North Lakes primary school in Penrith, where eight-year-old Lindsey was a pupil, added: "This awful news has come as a terrible shock to everyone in the school.
"Lindsey was a very friendly, bubbly and cheerful girl who had many friends at the school.
"We've told all the children in their individual classrooms about Lindsey's death. Our thoughts and prayers are with her family."
The police say "its too early to speculate" on the causes of the crash and they're already pressing for a change in the speed limit. A young driver. An elderly driver. All sorts of possibilities, reasons and things that may or may not make a difference and the first thing they do...
I despair I really do.
Kerching! Enough deaths on the road = lower speed limit = cash.
Who cares what the cause was. The result is what counts (literally).
Do you remember the old Samaritans strapline? "Suicide? Despair? Call the Samaritans" That's what PH SP&L is here for now. Although sometimes it generates despair as well.
Who cares what the cause was. The result is what counts (literally).
Do you remember the old Samaritans strapline? "Suicide? Despair? Call the Samaritans" That's what PH SP&L is here for now. Although sometimes it generates despair as well.
It also said in todays Telegraph that the 19 year old driving the Escort was a learner on a provisional licence, with L plates - his partner held a full licence.
One does wonder, irrespective of who's fault this was, whether a learner should be allowed to carry any passengers (other than the accompanying driver), especially young children.
One does wonder, irrespective of who's fault this was, whether a learner should be allowed to carry any passengers (other than the accompanying driver), especially young children.
Peter Ward said:
Kerching! Enough deaths on the road = lower speed limit = cash.
Who cares what the cause was. The result is what counts (literally).
Do you remember the old Samaritans strapline? "Suicide? Despair? Call the Samaritans" That's what PH SP&L is here for now. Although sometimes it generates despair as well.
Who cares what the cause was. The result is what counts (literally).
Do you remember the old Samaritans strapline? "Suicide? Despair? Call the Samaritans" That's what PH SP&L is here for now. Although sometimes it generates despair as well.
Lowering the speed limit is again another trigger happy response - whats better....
reduce the speed limit - when the same things will most likely continue to happen (as figures and road death findings backup)
OR
educate drivers properly instead of continuing to dumb them down by saying speed was the cause - when they dont even have the findings yet!
Congratulations police - another good move!
This gives a better perspective: www.newsandstar.co.uk/news/viewarticle.aspx?id=380497
Egbert Nobacon said:
One does wonder, irrespective of who's fault this was, whether a learner should be allowed to carry any passengers (other than the accompanying driver), especially young children.
Indeed, I learnt to drive in Italy, where a learner driver may only drive in a Driving School car accompanied by a qualified instructor.
This was the first bit of news that I heard this morning; pisses me off big-time. The enquiry should yield some result of the cause of the accident. As others have said, it'd be best to wait until then at least. Either way, a camera, more hatched lines, signs, restrictions, and more ticked-off drivers will be inevitable. It's only a matter of time before every single carraigeway NSL will be treated this way. You could have the 'safest' stretch of road in the world but allow idiots down it in their droves and wha'd'ya get?
news and star said:
Highways chiefs at Cumbria County Council later approved a new 40mph speed, down from the current 60mph limit, covering a half mile stretch of the road either side of the crossroads at Plumpton.
That seems quite sensible to me tbh, but I do wonder if the plethora of road signage and paint is making drivers ignorant of the most important signage, junctions, crossings, etc. Not to mention that somebody may well have been driving so fast they couldn't stop in time.
What is the cause of the accident?
Oh wait, we don't know. So how can we say that reducing the speed limit will help?
The old man could have fallen asleep or driven across the lines and head on into the other car for sheer incompetence. At 30mph. The learner could have lost control (I dunno, sneezed or something) and also moved over the line...
Oh wait, we don't know. So how can we say that reducing the speed limit will help?
The old man could have fallen asleep or driven across the lines and head on into the other car for sheer incompetence. At 30mph. The learner could have lost control (I dunno, sneezed or something) and also moved over the line...
It's possible that the inclusion of 40mph signs may improve safety but only if used as a guide that the bend may demand some caution.
But this has not been a knee-jerk reaction. It has been planned for some time.
In the last year there have been 3 fatal collisions on that stretch of road causing 13 fatalities. Each one caused by loss of control on a bend.
There are other plans for the risk zones on this road, VAS signs, more on-road signage, and the introduction of phantom centre islands to reduce lane width.
But having attended the collision in question as a collision investigator, it was the most sombre scene I have attended in a very long time. Such a tragic pointless waste of young blameless life.
But this has not been a knee-jerk reaction. It has been planned for some time.
In the last year there have been 3 fatal collisions on that stretch of road causing 13 fatalities. Each one caused by loss of control on a bend.
There are other plans for the risk zones on this road, VAS signs, more on-road signage, and the introduction of phantom centre islands to reduce lane width.
But having attended the collision in question as a collision investigator, it was the most sombre scene I have attended in a very long time. Such a tragic pointless waste of young blameless life.
IaHa said:
In the last year there have been 3 fatal collisions on that stretch of road causing 13 fatalities. Each one caused by loss of control on a bend.
That is absolutely awful, Ian. I can barely imagine the distress of the families concerned and it must be horrible to deal with for you and your colleagues.
What is it about this stretch that induces the loss of control? Bend severity? Adverse camber? Road surface? Have there been other non-KSI offs?
UncleDave said:
in fact we can now hand out driving licenses like sweets,
IMO the driving test is more stringent than it was when i took my test just before the war (Falklands, not the WW2), it does`nt do anything to further the discussion making comments like this.
I`ve told you 2 million times not too exaggerate............
IaHa said:
It's possible that the inclusion of 40mph signs may improve safety but only if used as a guide that the bend may demand some caution.
But this has not been a knee-jerk reaction. It has been planned for some time.
In the last year there have been 3 fatal collisions on that stretch of road causing 13 fatalities. Each one caused by loss of control on a bend.
There are other plans for the risk zones on this road, VAS signs, more on-road signage, and the introduction of phantom centre islands to reduce lane width.
But having attended the collision in question as a collision investigator, it was the most sombre scene I have attended in a very long time. Such a tragic pointless waste of young blameless life.
But this has not been a knee-jerk reaction. It has been planned for some time.
In the last year there have been 3 fatal collisions on that stretch of road causing 13 fatalities. Each one caused by loss of control on a bend.
There are other plans for the risk zones on this road, VAS signs, more on-road signage, and the introduction of phantom centre islands to reduce lane width.
But having attended the collision in question as a collision investigator, it was the most sombre scene I have attended in a very long time. Such a tragic pointless waste of young blameless life.
Very sad indeed, it must be hard to deal with such scenes, could you suggest a possible cause to produce so many accidents? even here speed is being automatically held to blame it seems
One thing I have noticed on these roads, too many "slow dangerous bend!" or Curve in road signs where they are not needed. Hence when you do get to one where the bend is tight the driver ignores them. It's known as the "Cry Wolf" syndrome.
Edited by telecat on Tuesday 20th June 15:08
IaHa said:
But having attended the collision in question as a collision investigator, it was the most sombre scene I have attended in a very long time.
In which case, what would you suggest the council do to reduce accidents on this stretch of road? You are going to be the best person to make that judgment call.
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