Biker Claims Only Doing 90 and not 150mph
Discussion
http://www.thisisplymouth.co.uk/news/VERDICT/artic...
Retrial for accused biker as jury fail to reach verdict
Saturday, April 17, 2010, 06:59
A BIKER accused of dangerous driving at 150mph on the A38 is to face a retrial after a jury at Plymouth Crown Court failed to reach a verdict.
The High Court judge, the Hon Mr Justice Field, offered to accept a 10-2 majority verdict when it became clear that the eight-man, four-woman jury could not agree unanimously.
But after more than five hours of deliberations, the foreman told the judge there was no likelihood of their reaching a verdict.
The judge said the case against Oliver Marriott was a relatively straightforward one, but added that the jury had conscientiously tried to get to grips with it. He then discharged the jury and ordered a retrial after prosecutor David Gittins asked for one.
Mr Gittins had claimed that Marriott, 21, put lives at risk when he was caught on camera 'racing' out of Plymouth at 150mph.
Marriott, who denied a single charge of dangerous driving, claimed the speed gun reading was inaccurate and that he reached just 90mph when he sped up the A38 towards Plympton on December 20, 2008.
Marriott (pictured), from Pillaton, near Saltash, was on his way to meet a friend when he rode his Kawasaki ZX636 past a police van carrying out speed enforcement.
PC David Williams told the court he was parked in a layby on the westbound A38 between Marsh Mills and Plympton when he heard the high-performance, six-speed bike approaching on the other carriageway.
He told the court it was the fastest vehicle he had ever recorded and at that time he thought Marriott was going to collide with the rear of the vehicle in front.
Mr Gittins told the court Marriott was 'racing into the distance', crouched low over the bike's petrol tank to maximise his speed, when he was forced to brake.
He described the green Kawasaki, which can reach speeds of up to 162mph, as a powerful machine.
He added: "He was not only putting other people's lives at risk but putting his own life at risk as well. It could have been a disaster for anyone else on the road."
Marriott initially denied riding the bike when police went to his house on Christmas Eve, but admitted it was him when shown stills from the video, the trial was told.
He also accepted holding only a licence for motorcycles with up to 25kw of power – well under the 87kw of his Kawasaki.
Speed gun specialist Stephen Langdon insisted the readings were accurate, describing how the Home Office-approved Lastec LTI 20-20 device threw out 43 invisible infra-red laser beams within a third of a second.
They each bounced back showing the object's speed and distance.
But defence witness David Burgess, a consultant forensic collision investigator, told the jury: "There is scope for error with this device."
He said the laser beam could have fallen on nearby vehicles, giving a warped reading – and estimated Marriott's braking time was consistent with a speed of about 89mph.
Marriott was released by the court but will face a retrial before a fresh jury on a date to be fixed.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/cornwall/862040...
http://www.thisisplymouth.co.uk/news/Speed-gun-acc...
Biker 'was caught speeding at 150mph near Plymouth'
Mr Marriott denies the charge of dangerous driving
A biker was caught driving at 150mph on a Devon road after being filmed by a speed measuring device so accurate it is used by Nasa, a court was told.
Oliver Marriott, 21, from Saltash, was stopped by police on the A38 near Plymouth in December 2008, Plymouth Crown Court heard.
A traffic officer told the jury he was convinced there would be an accident.
Mr Marriott denies dangerous driving, claiming the speed device produced a false reading.
The jury were shown video which they were told was of Mr Marriott, a pasty factory worker, on his green 636cc Kawasaki ZX motorcycle.
They were told traffic enforcement officer Pc David Williams had to use his specialist training as a police marksman in order to line up the speed measuring device on the motorbike's number plate long enough to get a reading.
'Fastest vehicle'
Pc Williams said: "I looked through the lens and when he came into view I pressed the trigger and recorded a speed of 150mph at a distance of 265m.
"As he approached a van... I thought he was going to collide with the rear of the vehicle.
"In 13 years as a traffic officer it was the fastest vehicle I have ever recorded."
Mr Marriott admitted being the bike's rider when he was stopped by police, but said he had only been driving at around 90mph.
He claimed the police equipment was calibrated wrongly or produced a false reading.
But Steven Langdon, a retired police officer, told the court that the device used to record Mr Marriott's speed, known as a Speedscope, was also used by Nasa to dock its space stations.
He said the Speedscope in question was calibrated in the correct way and gave accurate readings up to a distance of 1,000m.
The trial continues.
Retrial for accused biker as jury fail to reach verdict
Saturday, April 17, 2010, 06:59
A BIKER accused of dangerous driving at 150mph on the A38 is to face a retrial after a jury at Plymouth Crown Court failed to reach a verdict.
The High Court judge, the Hon Mr Justice Field, offered to accept a 10-2 majority verdict when it became clear that the eight-man, four-woman jury could not agree unanimously.
But after more than five hours of deliberations, the foreman told the judge there was no likelihood of their reaching a verdict.
The judge said the case against Oliver Marriott was a relatively straightforward one, but added that the jury had conscientiously tried to get to grips with it. He then discharged the jury and ordered a retrial after prosecutor David Gittins asked for one.
Mr Gittins had claimed that Marriott, 21, put lives at risk when he was caught on camera 'racing' out of Plymouth at 150mph.
Marriott, who denied a single charge of dangerous driving, claimed the speed gun reading was inaccurate and that he reached just 90mph when he sped up the A38 towards Plympton on December 20, 2008.
Marriott (pictured), from Pillaton, near Saltash, was on his way to meet a friend when he rode his Kawasaki ZX636 past a police van carrying out speed enforcement.
PC David Williams told the court he was parked in a layby on the westbound A38 between Marsh Mills and Plympton when he heard the high-performance, six-speed bike approaching on the other carriageway.
He told the court it was the fastest vehicle he had ever recorded and at that time he thought Marriott was going to collide with the rear of the vehicle in front.
Mr Gittins told the court Marriott was 'racing into the distance', crouched low over the bike's petrol tank to maximise his speed, when he was forced to brake.
He described the green Kawasaki, which can reach speeds of up to 162mph, as a powerful machine.
He added: "He was not only putting other people's lives at risk but putting his own life at risk as well. It could have been a disaster for anyone else on the road."
Marriott initially denied riding the bike when police went to his house on Christmas Eve, but admitted it was him when shown stills from the video, the trial was told.
He also accepted holding only a licence for motorcycles with up to 25kw of power – well under the 87kw of his Kawasaki.
Speed gun specialist Stephen Langdon insisted the readings were accurate, describing how the Home Office-approved Lastec LTI 20-20 device threw out 43 invisible infra-red laser beams within a third of a second.
They each bounced back showing the object's speed and distance.
But defence witness David Burgess, a consultant forensic collision investigator, told the jury: "There is scope for error with this device."
He said the laser beam could have fallen on nearby vehicles, giving a warped reading – and estimated Marriott's braking time was consistent with a speed of about 89mph.
Marriott was released by the court but will face a retrial before a fresh jury on a date to be fixed.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/cornwall/862040...
http://www.thisisplymouth.co.uk/news/Speed-gun-acc...
Biker 'was caught speeding at 150mph near Plymouth'
Mr Marriott denies the charge of dangerous driving
A biker was caught driving at 150mph on a Devon road after being filmed by a speed measuring device so accurate it is used by Nasa, a court was told.
Oliver Marriott, 21, from Saltash, was stopped by police on the A38 near Plymouth in December 2008, Plymouth Crown Court heard.
A traffic officer told the jury he was convinced there would be an accident.
Mr Marriott denies dangerous driving, claiming the speed device produced a false reading.
The jury were shown video which they were told was of Mr Marriott, a pasty factory worker, on his green 636cc Kawasaki ZX motorcycle.
They were told traffic enforcement officer Pc David Williams had to use his specialist training as a police marksman in order to line up the speed measuring device on the motorbike's number plate long enough to get a reading.
'Fastest vehicle'
Pc Williams said: "I looked through the lens and when he came into view I pressed the trigger and recorded a speed of 150mph at a distance of 265m.
"As he approached a van... I thought he was going to collide with the rear of the vehicle.
"In 13 years as a traffic officer it was the fastest vehicle I have ever recorded."
Mr Marriott admitted being the bike's rider when he was stopped by police, but said he had only been driving at around 90mph.
He claimed the police equipment was calibrated wrongly or produced a false reading.
But Steven Langdon, a retired police officer, told the court that the device used to record Mr Marriott's speed, known as a Speedscope, was also used by Nasa to dock its space stations.
He said the Speedscope in question was calibrated in the correct way and gave accurate readings up to a distance of 1,000m.
The trial continues.
Edited by shuvitupya on Saturday 17th April 10:05
What he said.
shuvitupya said:
...to line up the speed measuring device on the motorbike's number plate long enough to get a reading.
....
Pc Williams said: "I looked through the lens and when he came into view I pressed the trigger and recorded a speed of 150mph at a distance of 265m.
.....
"As he approached a van... I thought he was going to collide with the rear of the vehicle.
How can you be targeting a bikes plate when its approaching you?....
Pc Williams said: "I looked through the lens and when he came into view I pressed the trigger and recorded a speed of 150mph at a distance of 265m.
.....
"As he approached a van... I thought he was going to collide with the rear of the vehicle.
can you really get to 150mph on a 636cc bike 
ETA
yes
http://www.motorbikestoday.com/reviews/Articles/ZX...
150mph
ETA
yes
http://www.motorbikestoday.com/reviews/Articles/ZX...
150mph
Edited by saaby93 on Wednesday 14th April 22:53
Someone tell me how the NASA argument works?
Surely if they're docking space stations (do they do that or do they dock a shuttle with a space station?) isnt it one object approaching another object in direct line of sight in a huge clear space without many other objects around eg armco, tree, cars motorbikes, asteroids
Is it at all similar or tenuously similar
Surely if they're docking space stations (do they do that or do they dock a shuttle with a space station?) isnt it one object approaching another object in direct line of sight in a huge clear space without many other objects around eg armco, tree, cars motorbikes, asteroids
Is it at all similar or tenuously similar
colonel c said:
The guy is a biker and therefore guilty as hell.
Excellent quote of the normal police attitude there. It was sure the attitude I got as the victim of roadrage when I got arrested for being a biker. At least that was the only excuse for it I could see after some retard had tried to knock me off twice without reason.WTF has the NASA business got to do with anything?
Doesn't matter who else uses the kit, it doesn't affect the possibility of this particular unit being faulty, incorrectly calibrated or used in such a way as to fail to obtain an accurate reading.
It's nothing but irrelevant, emotive b
ks designed to influence the court's decision on irrational grounds, and therefore should not be allowed in the court at all.
Doesn't matter who else uses the kit, it doesn't affect the possibility of this particular unit being faulty, incorrectly calibrated or used in such a way as to fail to obtain an accurate reading.
It's nothing but irrelevant, emotive b
ks designed to influence the court's decision on irrational grounds, and therefore should not be allowed in the court at all.Mojocvh said:
Why is ANY speed considered "dangerous"?
20 in a 30 can kill. If you hit someone.
70 in a 70 will kill. If you hit someone.
So why does this speed be classed as dangerous if he didn't hit anyone?
Cue usual PH SP&L BS.
Dangerous refers to there being danger of either injury to any person or serious damage to property.20 in a 30 can kill. If you hit someone.
70 in a 70 will kill. If you hit someone.
So why does this speed be classed as dangerous if he didn't hit anyone?
Cue usual PH SP&L BS.
With that the standard of driving/riding has to fall 'far below' the standard expected of a (notional) competent & careful driver AND it would have been obvious to such a driver that it would.
It would appear that in this case someone who regards themselves as a careful competent driver considered the riding fell far below the standard expected, that should have been obvious to the rider that the riding was unacceptable & as a result there was a danger of injury or serious damage (even if luckily for him he didn't occur).
shuvitupya said:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/cornwall/862040...
They were told traffic enforcement officer Pc David Williams had to use his specialist training as a police marksman in order to line up the speed measuring device on the motorbike's number plate long enough to get a reading.
Another irrelevance?They were told traffic enforcement officer Pc David Williams had to use his specialist training as a police marksman in order to line up the speed measuring device on the motorbike's number plate long enough to get a reading.
Good job he wasn’t a Brazilian electrician!
It is a rather spurious argument. NASA is of no relevance to the chap's defence. It's the user who is being challenged and on the assumption that he wasn't designed and built as part of the space program it would seem that the prosecution is struggling a bit.
It's a classic defence. He's admitting to speeding but not the figure shown on the reading. A sort of: Yeah, I'm dead straight, guv. I'll have the 90 but 150, well, that's a fit-up. Of all those available to him it is probably, at least in my eyes and probably those of his brief, the best one to take down off the shelf. Any experienced bench will realise it is a cough to the full offence.
Mind you, PC Williams has provided the defence with its own bit of ammunition. By suggesting only because of specialist, non-traffic officer type traiing, was he able to get a fix on the bike's number plate he opens a can of worms. Perhpas he shouldn't have watched Top Gun before going into court.
In six years as a trained firearms officer, for 30 months as part of the lead pair, I was never, ever trained to hit a target going at 150mph. Whilst we were taught deflection it was at the speed a (probably depserate) man would run.
Odd thing to say all in all.
It's a classic defence. He's admitting to speeding but not the figure shown on the reading. A sort of: Yeah, I'm dead straight, guv. I'll have the 90 but 150, well, that's a fit-up. Of all those available to him it is probably, at least in my eyes and probably those of his brief, the best one to take down off the shelf. Any experienced bench will realise it is a cough to the full offence.
Mind you, PC Williams has provided the defence with its own bit of ammunition. By suggesting only because of specialist, non-traffic officer type traiing, was he able to get a fix on the bike's number plate he opens a can of worms. Perhpas he shouldn't have watched Top Gun before going into court.
In six years as a trained firearms officer, for 30 months as part of the lead pair, I was never, ever trained to hit a target going at 150mph. Whilst we were taught deflection it was at the speed a (probably depserate) man would run.
Odd thing to say all in all.
Derek Smith said:
Mind you, PC Williams has provided the defence with its own bit of ammunition. By suggesting only because of specialist, non-traffic officer type traiing, was he able to get a fix on the bike's number plate he opens a can of worms.
Very much so. "So, you're saying it's really difficult to do, then?"How long could you stay on a motorcycle numberplate if it is 236 metres away and travelling away from you at 75 metres a second?
It may be accurate on something the size of a spacecraft but it doesn't necessarily follow that it's any good at targeting motorbikes. There MUST have been reflection from something else.
It may be accurate on something the size of a spacecraft but it doesn't necessarily follow that it's any good at targeting motorbikes. There MUST have been reflection from something else.
BliarOut said:
How long could you stay on a motorcycle numberplate if it is 236 metres away and travelling away from you at 75 metres a second?
Especially given that a bike numberplate is not at 90 degrees to the bike, it will be facing the sky to some extent and a bike traveling at 150mph or 90mph (or less) will be bouncing around due to the road surface/suspension etc so the angle will be constantly changing and getting very rapidly smaller.One hell of a marksman, his talents are wasted as a trafpol...
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