CRB checks

[V8LM]

Dontlift said:

Silent1 said:

For someone convicted under 18 it's, for anyone over 18 double the rehab times(except the first):

Sentence	Rehabilitation period
Absolute discharge	6 months
Fines, community service / punishment orders, combination and curfew orders	2.5 years
Prison sentences of less than 6 months	3.5 years
Prison sentences of between 6 months and 2½ years	5 years
Prison sentence of over 2½ Years	Never spent

The age of conviction is irrelevant for the following sentences:

Borstal (abolished 1983)
7 Years

Detention centres (abolished 1988)
3 Years

The following sentences have variable rehabilitation periods that do not vary with age:

Probation, supervision or care orders, conditional discharge or bind-over
The greater of 1 year, or until the order expires

Attendance centre orders
1 year after the order expires

Hospital orders (with or without restriction orders)
The greater of 5 years, or 2 years after the order expires

Edited by Silent1 on Wednesday 9th June 00:32

Edited by Silent1 on Wednesday 9th June 00:32

Out of intrest how long does a caution remain in play and would this show up in CRB?

Yes, cautions do show up and "remain in play" indefinitely, contrary to what many PCs say when they are issued. Never a good idea to accept a caution for this reason.

[Echo66]

I am involved with CRB checks through work with contractors etc undertaking work in schools of all types. We regularly have blokes who have had a dust up in the past & been nicked for assault, ABH, breach of the peace etc etc including stuff within a few years. No problems with them being allowed to contiue working. The headmaster/mistress/senior governor may want a chat with them but never had anyone refused entry to any sites.

[saaby93]

Gareth79 said:

saaby93 said:

cuneus said:

Largely irrelevant as enhanced CRB allows disclosure of any other relevant information at the discretion of the CC

Do they ask every CC?
All that seems to happen is that you disclose everything you think relevant on the CRB form (i.e. OP puts nothing), CRB dept do *something* retype it up and issue it as your CRB.
What is the *something*?

They will check paper files held locally, this will be information not added to the PNC in the past, usually because there was no way of adding it at the time.

AFAIK an enhanced CRB will produce records of any police action which had a result, ie. not arrests with NFA.

edit: I'm not sure what "local" is, probably forces where the applicant has ever lived, plus the location of the requestor.

Won't most people have forgotten something that long ago too?
Now he's remembered it depends on the question on the form but if it's not registered on a computer, and is spent years ago what's the point of adding it?
Is there a way of asking for the info that is known first and then confirming/denying signing it off?

[GT03ROB]

skymaster said:

She knows... we have discussed it all on the phone this evening... the issue is the school..... they might be reasonable... see it was 16 years ago and the offences are nothing to do with sex etc etc... and just file the forms .... but they could ... if they want... be really difficult

This being the case, if she doesn't have a problem with it, surely it can't spell the end for the relationship if the school get arsey about it?? Whats wrong with your place after all?

Anyhow hope the school sees sense over it.

[cs02rm0]

I don't really see it being an issue, but there's only one way to find out.

[V8LM]

As said above, context is everything. At worst they may want to chat.

[2 5HAN]

I think you have done the right thing talk it through with the Mrs to be.

All establishments whether they be schools, community centres, youth clubs, care homes, hospitals etc have guidance on what to do in the event of someone having offences disclosed on their CRB checks.

You will be amazed at what you are allowed to have on a CRB and still enter these environments.

I am a signatory for CRB checks and see all sorts of offences come through. You simply follow the guidance and common sense.

Most Managers, Governors etc won’t be looking to make your life hell they will be looking to meet their statutory requirements and that means following guidance and procedure.

Good luck

[Gareth79]

saaby93 said:

Won't most people have forgotten something that long ago too?
Now he's remembered it depends on the question on the form but if it's not registered on a computer, and is spent years ago what's the point of adding it?
Is there a way of asking for the info that is known first and then confirming/denying signing it off?

Somebody might have "forgotten about" it in day-to-day life, but surely if asked specifically a person could remember the number and type of offences (which resulted in action) that they had committed in the past, plus roughly the year? You aren't going to say "no, never been in trouble with the police" when clearly you had been.

[Engineer1]

saaby93 said:

Gareth79 said:

saaby93 said:

cuneus said:

Largely irrelevant as enhanced CRB allows disclosure of any other relevant information at the discretion of the CC

Do they ask every CC?
All that seems to happen is that you disclose everything you think relevant on the CRB form (i.e. OP puts nothing), CRB dept do *something* retype it up and issue it as your CRB.
What is the *something*?

They will check paper files held locally, this will be information not added to the PNC in the past, usually because there was no way of adding it at the time.

AFAIK an enhanced CRB will produce records of any police action which had a result, ie. not arrests with NFA.

edit: I'm not sure what "local" is, probably forces where the applicant has ever lived, plus the location of the requestor.

Won't most people have forgotten something that long ago too?
Now he's remembered it depends on the question on the form but if it's not registered on a computer, and is spent years ago what's the point of adding it?
Is there a way of asking for the info that is known first and then confirming/denying signing it off?

Because which looks better, it being on the form which the school will see prior to sending or the first they know of it being when it is revealed in the CRB check?
One shows you are owning upto your past and being responsible, the other puts you as a shifty liar who has hidden one thing so what else is being hidden.

[saaby93]

Without knowing how the questions are phrased on the form what about a covering letter?
If the form says within the last ten years the answer's easy.
If it doesnt then its easy to write not within last ten years
and then covering letter says conviction 16 years ago but it's spent and youd prefer they no longer consider it but ask what they do.

Is this something else that could now be killed off by newgov without affecting anything?

[Danny S]

CRB checks can go on for months, so don't get too excited about going to hers at the weekend !

[Road2Ruin]

A lot of people are misinformed or just plain don't understand about CRB checks. Firstly a having criminal record on a CRB doesn't preclude you form doing any type of work, the CRB is just a document to help the person or compant (in this case school) to make an educated decission on your suitability for something. Secondly a CRB check is only necessary if you are in a position where, in this case, you have access to the children or property unsupervised. Thirdly you can only have an enhanced CRB done if you are in certain catergories for example looking after children or vulnerable adults. It is against the law to have an enhanced CRB check done on someone who does not meet the minimum citeria (can't remember exact details). The problem I can see is that the school may insist that you have a basic CRB done because you have access to their property after hours but unless you have access to the children I can't see how they can get and enhanced CRB check done.

[cs02rm0]

If she lives in a boarding house, which is quite likely, then I suspect he would have access to the children.

[FunkyGibbon]

cs02rm0 said:

If she lives in a boarding house, which is quite likely, then I suspect he would have access to the children.

But not necessarily un-supervised access - so (as someone who processes List 99 and CRB frequently) this seems overkill and unnecessary.

A list99 (just in case) and a sensible risk assessment (stating rules of access or rather no access to students) would suffice.

ETA

I lived on a school site with my partner for 5 years - no CRB required - they just took the pragmatic risk assessment approach.

Edited by FunkyGibbon on Wednesday 9th June 15:15

[TVR1]

Dontlift said:

Out of intrest how long does a caution remain in play and would this show up in CRB?

Basic CRB, rehabilitation of offenders Act applies. Enhanced CRB, all arrests, cautions, convictions until you have reached the age of 100 or are deceased. See ACPO 'step down model'.

[skymaster]

Thanks for all the comments. I think the step down model has been torn up now... well thats what my investigations seem to have suggested today. It was used until last year though. It seemed to suggest that after certain periods of time the record would step down to a situation where the police would retain it, but only share it with the police, not outside bodies.

Now however it seems they will never step it down to the 'non sharing' status, so the CRB will have access to everything at all times.

I spoke to a good friend who recently applied for a job as a courier driver, and was going to be CRB checked for that. Which seems insane! Does every employer now feel they are exempt from the rehabilitation of offenders Act?

[Silent1]

skymaster said:

Thanks for all the comments. I think the step down model has been torn up now... well thats what my investigations seem to have suggested today. It was used until last year though. It seemed to suggest that after certain periods of time the record would step down to a situation where the police would retain it, but only share it with the police, not outside bodies.

Now however it seems they will never step it down to the 'non sharing' status, so the CRB will have access to everything at all times.

I spoke to a good friend who recently applied for a job as a courier driver, and was going to be CRB checked for that. Which seems insane! Does every employer now feel they are exempt from the rehabilitation of offenders Act?

A CRB check doesn't ignore the Rehabilitation of Offenders Act, only an enhanced CRB does.
IIRC a company also has to have good reason to request one.

[skymaster]

Well... if I am lucky.. they might only do me a basic check... given that I am not applying for a job there... and not asking them if I can live there... Ironically the site is National Trust... so any one of us could stroll onto the grounds if we wanted to! Assuming your NT membership is up to date of course ;-)

[Silent1]

The way a CRB check works, you will be aware of what check they are doing when they ask you, as IIRC you have to sign a form.

I suspect sadly though as they are a school they will do an Enhanced check as a catch all.