R500 k purchase - help needed pls!

[Ducati07]

Chaps,

Advice needed please to help me make a decision so i can actually get some sleep... Thinking about pressing the button on this car - anyone know the car? Hopefully the link below will work - its the mango yellow r500 at sevenandclasics, i think its chassis 005.

http://www.sevensandclassics.com/showroom/caterham...

Have had a few caterhams before over the years but never an R. Have obviously done a ton of reading around the engine refrsh / rebuild issues and of course its on my mind as i dont want to buy a car and then it spend more time in the garage than on the road / track (its even going through my mind to consider an r400d instead) but my love of classic cars means heart is set on the legendary k series)!

Many thanks in advance!

[bobdylan]

Look at it !!!!!
If it never works you can hang it in your front room and just drool over it !
Buy it , follow ya heart not us head I say

[nigelpugh7]

Ducati07 said:

Chaps,

Advice needed please to help me make a decision so i can actually get some sleep... Thinking about pressing the button on this car - anyone know the car? Hopefully the link below will work - its the mango yellow r500 at sevenandclasics, i think its chassis 005.

http://www.sevensandclassics.com/showroom/caterham...

Have had a few caterhams before over the years but never an R. Have obviously done a ton of reading around the engine refrsh / rebuild issues and of course its on my mind as i dont want to buy a car and then it spend more time in the garage than on the road / track (its even going through my mind to consider an r400d instead) but my love of classic cars means heart is set on the legendary k series)!

Many thanks in advance!

It does look a great car.

FYI I built my R400 k series back in 2003 and I chose to have the same Mango Yellow as this car.

I still,think that with those MB wheels and that colour combo its one of the best Looking sevens.,

As has been said, just buy it and go out and thrash the nuts of it, you will never regret it.,

[rubystone]

It's not chassis number 5.

[nigelpugh7]

rubystone said:

It's not chassis number 5.

The dashboard plaque says No 6!

[MikeO996]

It looks more expensive than most but if it's as good as it sounds then I guess it's worth it.
I'm assuming you've looked carefully at its maintainance history.
I'm also assuming that you've driven it, the early R500s could be pretty tricky in normal traffic conditions, i.e. on part throttle, but my understanding is that the ECU can be updated or replaced with a more flexible map.

[Shropcat]

Having been through your dilemma I, like you wanted to own one of the 'iconic' R500 K's and jumped at the chance last summer and have not regretted it. I had the same worries regarding the engine but mine has just been checked and re-mapped to make it more tractable and its everything that you would expect from such a ground breaking car. I think they are going up in value currently and I am sure will be a real classic as so few were made.

[Ducati07]

Chaps thanks for the encouragement - I've put down a deposit!! And thanks for the correction on the chassis number, it is number 006 as you correctly pointed out.

What a beauty! Its going to be a long 2 weeks!!

[Haroldude]

Hi,
I was recently looking for a mint condition R500 K for over a year without any luck, they don't come along very often . In the end I purchased a car which required a bit of a general tidy up, the combined cost was a lot more than the asking price of this car . If it looks as good close up as it does in the pictures , with good history I'd say go for it, you will love it.

[nigelpugh7]

Ducati07 said:

Chaps thanks for the encouragement - I've put down a deposit!! And thanks for the correction on the chassis number, it is number 006 as you correctly pointed out.

What a beauty! Its going to be a long 2 weeks!!

Well done that man!

Make sure you join us on Facebook owners group page too!

Enjoy!

[IBDAET]

I wonder if this was the car thatr once belonged to Richard Ince or the one Jason Krebs had...

[Shropcat]

Great decision....

[rubystone]

IBDAET said:

I wonder if this was the car thatr once belonged to Richard Ince or the one Jason Krebs had...

I was trying to search Blatchat because there was a thread from the early days where the pioneers related their experiences with the cars, including mine. But 'New' Blatchat isn't so amenable.

Clearly if the car is ex Ince, it'll have been ragged. But more importantly, the engine won't be the original with the car. And a non-matching numbers car is a risk. ISTR that Jason had a fair few issues too. By contrast, mine was relatively reliable by all accounts.

So my advice to the OP is to contact Caterham Cars to ensure the engine number in the car now matches that which it left the factory with. But then I presume Andy Noble will be up front with you about that fact? He was there when the car was built.

[SidewaysSi]

Why is a non engine numbers matching car a problem? I can understand in the classic Porsche world but these are kit cars. I am sure any Caterham Fireblade/Blackbird owner would see it as a positive!!

[rubystone]

SidewaysSi said:

Why is a non engine numbers matching car a problem? I can understand in the classic Porsche world but these are kit cars. I am sure any Caterham Fireblade/Blackbird owner would see it as a positive!!

one contributor on this thread has already alluded to the future value of the car. Anyone investing £26k in this car (not the £12k that a BEC fetches) must have one eye on the future value, surely? Otherwise there's a chunk of big bhp options out there for cheaper money in other 'kit cars'

[SidewaysSi]

rubystone said:

SidewaysSi said:

Why is a non engine numbers matching car a problem? I can understand in the classic Porsche world but these are kit cars. I am sure any Caterham Fireblade/Blackbird owner would see it as a positive!!

one contributor on this thread has already alluded to the future value of the car. Anyone investing £26k in this car (not the £12k that a BEC fetches) must have one eye on the future value, surely? Otherwise there's a chunk of big bhp options out there for cheaper money in other 'kit cars'

I think for many, myself included, a Caterham is the ultimate and as a result they do not consider another kit car to be in the same league. The R500 like the original Superlight, Superlight R and even HPC - they are key models in the car's history, however I don't think they are really going to go up in value like some other cars out there.

If you want a motoring investment, there are much better places to put £26k. You buy an R500 or any Caterham because of what it is rather than worrying about future values.

Personally I wouldn't care if the engine was original or not, particularly given how fragile a big powered K Series engine can be.

[rubystone]

SidewaysSi said:

I think for many, myself included, a Caterham is the ultimate and as a result they do not consider another kit car to be in the same league. The R500 like the original Superlight, Superlight R and even HPC - they are key models in the car's history, however I don't think they are really going to go up in value like some other cars out there.

If you want a motoring investment, there are much better places to put £26k. You buy an R500 or any Caterham because of what it is rather than worrying about future values.

Personally I wouldn't care if the engine was original or not, particularly given how fragile a big powered K Series engine can be.

Why do you think a big bhp 7 is fragile?

If you saw what the JPE goes for nowadays, I think you'd change your mind on the future values of 7s. I'm assuming that your SL isn't running the original engine then?

I see you're after a 911. Which of those would you consider would satisfy your requirements?

[SidewaysSi]

rubystone said:

SidewaysSi said:

I think for many, myself included, a Caterham is the ultimate and as a result they do not consider another kit car to be in the same league. The R500 like the original Superlight, Superlight R and even HPC - they are key models in the car's history, however I don't think they are really going to go up in value like some other cars out there.

If you want a motoring investment, there are much better places to put £26k. You buy an R500 or any Caterham because of what it is rather than worrying about future values.

Personally I wouldn't care if the engine was original or not, particularly given how fragile a big powered K Series engine can be.

Why do you think a big bhp 7 is fragile?

If you saw what the JPE goes for nowadays, I think you'd change your mind on the future values of 7s. I'm assuming that your SL isn't running the original engine then?

I see you're after a 911. Which of those would you consider would satisfy your requirements?

A big BHP K can be fragile though probably more down to user error to be honest. If the car was tracked hard and the owner didn't keep en eye on things then yes, I believe they had more of a propensity to go bang.

Some sevens may go up in value, however they do not see the big increases of other marques as you can still buy a new one that is 90% the same as any other. Granted, an original JPE is worth a fair bit but build numbers were tiny (a lot less will be left given the exports) which obviously helps.

£26k is not a large amount when looking at specialist cars and if it were an investment, there are better machines out there that will net a higher return IMO - an aircooled 911, Clio V6, E30 M3, M635CSi, CSL, and 205GTi immediately come to mind.

My Superlight does have its original engine but if it was a newer engine than what it left the factory with, I honestly wouldn't be bothered. Likewise, if a car has been DVA'd, I see it as a positive rather than having lost its originality.

As for a 911, I haven't yet chosen what I am after. At the moment it includes a 996/997 C2, SC, 964,993, GT3, ex race cars etc. Like all my purchases, I want something I can enjoy on the road - not necessarily the fastest but the most enjoyable and something I can push hard without losing my licence. I am not looking for an investment but something I can use, run, enjoy and grow with. Not sure what it will be but it will be bought at some point this year...

[evotell]

Congrats on your purchase, I'm sure you will have no issues with Andy, he's a cosha guy. I guess in the end its all about what your looking for. I've owned 7s since 1975 Lotus 7 S2, had a plethora of them over the years particularly now as we are a Used Caterham Dealer here in Canada, but for me my favourite Caterham is my present 1.4 SS. no power to speak of, but a real joy to drive.

Enjoy

[Ducati07]

I'm not obsessed with the value going up, although it would be a bonus if it didnt depreciate! As people have rightly pointed out, there are plenty of better investments out there. However, appreciation or not, there's just something about having the provenance of a numbered car, albeit rather intangible!

Out of interest, anyone know how may k series r500's were made? I really wouldnt know where to start guessing.