RE: Caterham Levante Sold Out
Discussion
thanks for the warning have heard of it goding riders and drivers before. the caterham has a deep growl like a v8 in town it then sounds like two r1 engines with sports exhausts with a super charger screaming in the front on full chat ( no maybe i could just here myself breathing inside my lid)you know the feeling. rubystone - russell wont even let me have it in my garage he thinks its his
Having had the good fortune to meet, and talk to Russell about his engines,I can confirm he has put a massive amount of time energy, money, research, and testing into developing this engine. (not least trying to find a transmission which can actually cope with it)
The video is interesting, but to see what the thing does for real is quite staggering.
Russel was giving rides in his demonstrator some time back, and it can only be described as unreal. one second the car is on the tarmac in front of you, and in what seems like, just a couple of seconds, it turns itself into a tiny speck in the distance, really has to be seen to be believed!
As for workmanship, you could put that engine in an art gallery, as a work of art. You find yourself looking at every detail, and thinking, that just could not be done better.
The video is interesting, but to see what the thing does for real is quite staggering.
Russel was giving rides in his demonstrator some time back, and it can only be described as unreal. one second the car is on the tarmac in front of you, and in what seems like, just a couple of seconds, it turns itself into a tiny speck in the distance, really has to be seen to be believed!
As for workmanship, you could put that engine in an art gallery, as a work of art. You find yourself looking at every detail, and thinking, that just could not be done better.
Video on youtube : http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=NTWi1-LnANY
We went along to see Russell today and what a brilliant morning it was
If anyone doubted the quality, attention to detail and brilliance of the Levante and how it has been developed, they should try and arrange a similar session with Russell themselves.
After being a little sceptical about the car and its pricetag when I originally saw it at Autosport 08, I now think it offers incredible value and represents a brilliant achievement for British engineering. Russell is a massive source of information and you can tell that the Levante and its V8 is the culmination of a serious amount of effort.
T
We went along to see Russell today and what a brilliant morning it was
If anyone doubted the quality, attention to detail and brilliance of the Levante and how it has been developed, they should try and arrange a similar session with Russell themselves.
After being a little sceptical about the car and its pricetag when I originally saw it at Autosport 08, I now think it offers incredible value and represents a brilliant achievement for British engineering. Russell is a massive source of information and you can tell that the Levante and its V8 is the culmination of a serious amount of effort.
T
Tango7 said:
Video on youtube : http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=NTWi1-LnANY
We went along to see Russell today and what a brilliant morning it was
If anyone doubted the quality, attention to detail and brilliance of the Levante and how it has been developed, they should try and arrange a similar session with Russell themselves.
After being a little sceptical about the car and its pricetag when I originally saw it at Autosport 08, I now think it offers incredible value and represents a brilliant achievement for British engineering. Russell is a massive source of information and you can tell that the Levante and its V8 is the culmination of a serious amount of effort.
T
You may say that, but that engine? Just a couple of bike engines bolted together...and that front wing, it's gonna fall off at speed isn't it?We went along to see Russell today and what a brilliant morning it was
If anyone doubted the quality, attention to detail and brilliance of the Levante and how it has been developed, they should try and arrange a similar session with Russell themselves.
After being a little sceptical about the car and its pricetag when I originally saw it at Autosport 08, I now think it offers incredible value and represents a brilliant achievement for British engineering. Russell is a massive source of information and you can tell that the Levante and its V8 is the culmination of a serious amount of effort.
T
And that video - they just speeded it up didn't they.
rubystone said:
Tango7 said:
Video on youtube : http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=NTWi1-LnANY
We went along to see Russell today and what a brilliant morning it was
If anyone doubted the quality, attention to detail and brilliance of the Levante and how it has been developed, they should try and arrange a similar session with Russell themselves.
After being a little sceptical about the car and its pricetag when I originally saw it at Autosport 08, I now think it offers incredible value and represents a brilliant achievement for British engineering. Russell is a massive source of information and you can tell that the Levante and its V8 is the culmination of a serious amount of effort.
T
You may say that, but that engine? Just a couple of bike engines bolted together...and that front wing, it's gonna fall off at speed isn't it?We went along to see Russell today and what a brilliant morning it was
If anyone doubted the quality, attention to detail and brilliance of the Levante and how it has been developed, they should try and arrange a similar session with Russell themselves.
After being a little sceptical about the car and its pricetag when I originally saw it at Autosport 08, I now think it offers incredible value and represents a brilliant achievement for British engineering. Russell is a massive source of information and you can tell that the Levante and its V8 is the culmination of a serious amount of effort.
T
And that video - they just speeded it up didn't they.
Video - speeded up! LOL
I don't frequent this forum very much any more, mostly because of the quantity of misinformed crap that gets stated by prize plums who've read two issues of kit car weekly and think they're going to be the next McLaren F1 designer!
"Building one yourself for 30k", "BECs" blah blah. Gents, you really need to stop taking "what the bloke down the pub said" as gospel (whether he has an ARDS badge or not) and get out into the world to find things out for yourselves (it's part of the fun). And if you can't be bothered to do that, it might be better if you quit posting things as fact that you know nothing at all about.
I have nothing to do with RST, but have visited Russell (who's a thoroughly nice chap and probably has more experience in this field than the rest of us on here put together. Unless Gordon Murray's posted). I also own a Caterham that I have spent my own money on to upgrade over the last 12yrs or so, and have managed to crash one at high speed (on track, and something I'm not especially proud of). So...
Engineering - I very much doubt you will ever see any form of engineering exceeding the quality that Russell puts out. The detail of the parts that go into that engine are quite simply second to none and have been carefully considered over a fair while.
The original idea may well have started out with bike based origins, but then you could say that we all started out as monkeys (it would seem some have yet to progress from this stage!).
If you ever get to see the internals, you will know what you're dealing with and will simply wish you had more money to spend on such things rather than doubt its worth.
Cost - it's very easy to spend a lot of money on upgrades to any car, especially if you use top quality components. Phone around and ask how much things like Pectel ECUs, Quaife gearboxes and the like cost.
You might also want to give Ferrari a call and ask how much they'd charge you for one of their 4.3l V8s (and then note how big and heavy it is in comparison - but it would at least give you some sort of benchmark.
And if you've ever tried to purchase *good* quality carbon parts off the shelf, let alone have bespoke items made, you'll appreciate that it's probably going to cost you a fair bit more than a few tubs of P38 and some sandpaper.
Safety - as others have mentioned, the main area that a Caterham is seriously exposed is side impact. But then the driver is usually that much more alert in a 7, and the car is more able to get out of the way. I'm not sure I've heard of one being t-boned...which isn't to say it's never happened, but I would expect it to happen far less than in cars which encourage the driver to doze off.
I hit a tyre wall in mine front on at pretty high speed. Not a scratch on me or the passenger. The car needed a long front and a bit of cash spending on it, but afterwards it was better than new. I very much doubt *any* other car would have fared quite so well in the same circumstances. And I couldn't have been any less "hut" (because I wasn't).
"Active saftey" (avoiding the accident in the first place) in the 7 is, IMO, much better in a 7 than most other cars due to the way it drives and the nature of the car (doesn't help when show boating on a track though!). Passive safety isn't bad because its chassis is much, much stronger than it might look to someone who safety is measured in size and weight.
Would I have a Levante? No. On public roads I honestly think something around R400 type capability is more than can safely be deployed for all but the briefest of times, so being Northern I'd probably question the value too much. The looks of it are also not to my taste.
But to call the car pointless is pretty much to dismiss any and every car costing over 40k that isn't (say) a BMW 335d.
If it gives the owner pleasure (which it most obviously does), and the cost is not a concern to the owner (which it obviously is not), then the car is obviously worth every penny. And the fact that all are sold during times when even the big boys are struggling to divest themselves of their own limited editions speaks volumes IMO.
"Building one yourself for 30k", "BECs" blah blah. Gents, you really need to stop taking "what the bloke down the pub said" as gospel (whether he has an ARDS badge or not) and get out into the world to find things out for yourselves (it's part of the fun). And if you can't be bothered to do that, it might be better if you quit posting things as fact that you know nothing at all about.
I have nothing to do with RST, but have visited Russell (who's a thoroughly nice chap and probably has more experience in this field than the rest of us on here put together. Unless Gordon Murray's posted). I also own a Caterham that I have spent my own money on to upgrade over the last 12yrs or so, and have managed to crash one at high speed (on track, and something I'm not especially proud of). So...
Engineering - I very much doubt you will ever see any form of engineering exceeding the quality that Russell puts out. The detail of the parts that go into that engine are quite simply second to none and have been carefully considered over a fair while.
The original idea may well have started out with bike based origins, but then you could say that we all started out as monkeys (it would seem some have yet to progress from this stage!).
If you ever get to see the internals, you will know what you're dealing with and will simply wish you had more money to spend on such things rather than doubt its worth.
Cost - it's very easy to spend a lot of money on upgrades to any car, especially if you use top quality components. Phone around and ask how much things like Pectel ECUs, Quaife gearboxes and the like cost.
You might also want to give Ferrari a call and ask how much they'd charge you for one of their 4.3l V8s (and then note how big and heavy it is in comparison - but it would at least give you some sort of benchmark.
And if you've ever tried to purchase *good* quality carbon parts off the shelf, let alone have bespoke items made, you'll appreciate that it's probably going to cost you a fair bit more than a few tubs of P38 and some sandpaper.
Safety - as others have mentioned, the main area that a Caterham is seriously exposed is side impact. But then the driver is usually that much more alert in a 7, and the car is more able to get out of the way. I'm not sure I've heard of one being t-boned...which isn't to say it's never happened, but I would expect it to happen far less than in cars which encourage the driver to doze off.
I hit a tyre wall in mine front on at pretty high speed. Not a scratch on me or the passenger. The car needed a long front and a bit of cash spending on it, but afterwards it was better than new. I very much doubt *any* other car would have fared quite so well in the same circumstances. And I couldn't have been any less "hut" (because I wasn't).
"Active saftey" (avoiding the accident in the first place) in the 7 is, IMO, much better in a 7 than most other cars due to the way it drives and the nature of the car (doesn't help when show boating on a track though!). Passive safety isn't bad because its chassis is much, much stronger than it might look to someone who safety is measured in size and weight.
Would I have a Levante? No. On public roads I honestly think something around R400 type capability is more than can safely be deployed for all but the briefest of times, so being Northern I'd probably question the value too much. The looks of it are also not to my taste.
But to call the car pointless is pretty much to dismiss any and every car costing over 40k that isn't (say) a BMW 335d.
If it gives the owner pleasure (which it most obviously does), and the cost is not a concern to the owner (which it obviously is not), then the car is obviously worth every penny. And the fact that all are sold during times when even the big boys are struggling to divest themselves of their own limited editions speaks volumes IMO.
Murph7355 said:
Engineering - I very much doubt you will ever see any form of engineering exceeding the quality that Russell puts out. The detail of the parts that go into that engine are quite simply second to none and have been carefully considered over a fair while.
Cost - it's very easy to spend a lot of money on upgrades to any car, especially if you use top quality components. Phone around and ask how much things like Pectel ECUs, Quaife gearboxes and the like cost.
Very true - visit RS Performance at the Autosport International and have a nose under both sides of the dash to check out the engineering quality of just the paddle shift system on Wiler's car. Everything has been thought through to the minutest level of detail and the tactile pleasure of the paddles is a delight....Cost - it's very easy to spend a lot of money on upgrades to any car, especially if you use top quality components. Phone around and ask how much things like Pectel ECUs, Quaife gearboxes and the like cost.
ANyone'd think you were after a discount on one of those engines, Andy
Sorry to be slightly pedant here, but the paddle shift is not made by Russ, its made by Neil Wallace at Geartronics. Just like the engine is made by Mountune.
Anyone can pay brilliant engineers to make stuff, I am also guilty of this very charge!
I personally did not see anything on the RS Levante which made me think "if I had a surplus £115k, this is the above all must have item!
That said, I've probably spend that amount getting may car where it is now, but at least it was spread over 15 years, 3 rebuilds and one major crash.
For a focussed car at £115k, its got to get round the top gear in a time to split the £70k Ultima (1:12.8)from the Carparo T1 (1:10.6) It will be interesting to see. I've been told its pretty uncontrollable! But then that could have been a similar numpty driving like Clarkson when he drove the T1.
Lets face it, its still a Caterham, and people will still think of you strangely for owning one.
Anyone can pay brilliant engineers to make stuff, I am also guilty of this very charge!
I personally did not see anything on the RS Levante which made me think "if I had a surplus £115k, this is the above all must have item!
That said, I've probably spend that amount getting may car where it is now, but at least it was spread over 15 years, 3 rebuilds and one major crash.
For a focussed car at £115k, its got to get round the top gear in a time to split the £70k Ultima (1:12.8)from the Carparo T1 (1:10.6) It will be interesting to see. I've been told its pretty uncontrollable! But then that could have been a similar numpty driving like Clarkson when he drove the T1.
Lets face it, its still a Caterham, and people will still think of you strangely for owning one.
Edited by Fat Arnie on Sunday 2nd November 12:41
Fat Arnie said:
Sorry to be slightly pendant here, but the paddle shift is not made by Russ, its made by Neil Wallace at Geartronics. Just like the engine is made by Mountune.
Anyone can pay brilliant engineers to make stuff, I am also guilty of this very charge!
You're not wrong on count 1 Arnie - doesn't stop it being a well resolved installation though does it? Equally we should give credit where credit is due on your "brilliant engineers" comment - as you know, Russell conceived, designed and built that engine, handing it over to Mountune/Rousch to "productionise". That engine is of course to be seen in the back of the Atom 500 as well. I'm looking forward to his stand at Autosport International - should be some nice toys on display there Anyone can pay brilliant engineers to make stuff, I am also guilty of this very charge!
Fat Arnie said:
Rubystone, I am concerned your admiration for Russ may extend beyond his engine.....
At least he doesn't seem to dislike everyone, mock anything not thought of by himself and then have a bit of a personal snipe at people like someone else that frequents these forums.Why are you always so negative? Can't we just celebrate this bonkers fast car for being built in the first place?
Are you just annoyed because despite owning a mega fast seven yourself, you can no longer claim to own "the fastest Caterham in the world"?
I for one can't wait to see how the Levante does on track against the clock and hope it succeeds!
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