Superlight Standard or SV Chassis?
Discussion
I am thinking of making the move to Caterham ownership, I need some more excitement! I have had a look around a couple of cars and am certain I want a Superlight (R300 or R400, but that is another discussion, on which I would be happy to hear your views as well) but am not sure about the chassis.
I sat in a standard R400 and the pedal box was very tight, I would definitely have to wear racing boots to operate the pedals properly. I am pretty average in size, 6’2”, about 80Kg and size 10 feet. I also sat in an SV chassis and it was of course a bit roomier.
To clarify, I will be using the car approximately 50/50 road and track, with occasional long journeys, Le Mans 24hrs, Nurburgring 24hrs, some European summer touring perhaps etc. Ultimately, the car is something for me to enjoy, I want the performance on track to excite and the road manners to be ‘liveable’.
So the exam question, standard chassis or SV chassis. Will it make a huge difference? I am no racing driver, but do enjoy some ‘spirited’ driving.
The purist in me says standard, the logical side says SV, what do you say?
I sat in a standard R400 and the pedal box was very tight, I would definitely have to wear racing boots to operate the pedals properly. I am pretty average in size, 6’2”, about 80Kg and size 10 feet. I also sat in an SV chassis and it was of course a bit roomier.
To clarify, I will be using the car approximately 50/50 road and track, with occasional long journeys, Le Mans 24hrs, Nurburgring 24hrs, some European summer touring perhaps etc. Ultimately, the car is something for me to enjoy, I want the performance on track to excite and the road manners to be ‘liveable’.
So the exam question, standard chassis or SV chassis. Will it make a huge difference? I am no racing driver, but do enjoy some ‘spirited’ driving.
The purist in me says standard, the logical side says SV, what do you say?
The other option is an SV with the Series 3 seat (narrow chassis) if you have a narrow Tillet (the GRP Superlight seats) in an SV, then you get the extra legroom, boot space, fuel tank capacity and feet space, but you will be held in much better by the narrower seat. As CptSidways mentions, you really don't want to be rattling around in a Caterham on track, hanging onto the steering wheel while cornering is not ideal technique!
I'm 6'5' and 105kgs with size 13 feet and have raced narrow body cars for 4 years. Also have had a go in a few SV's.
Agree 100% With the rattling around inside it part, your arms WILL get tired quickly on a track day, but if you find the narrow body car tight (as I do) then the wide body is far more comfortable, especially for road use. Much wider footwells, more space to move about and heat soak is much reduced which especially important in the high powered cars, I regularly burn my left leg (through 2 layers of Nomex) on the tunnel of my C400.
Most will say 'go for the narrow body it fits around you and feels better', but I believe one develops this opinion the first time you sit in one. If you've sat in both and haven't decided it's worth contemplating further (if that makes sense!)
If you can get the seat right, then go for the SV. If not then stick with the narrow body.
Agree 100% With the rattling around inside it part, your arms WILL get tired quickly on a track day, but if you find the narrow body car tight (as I do) then the wide body is far more comfortable, especially for road use. Much wider footwells, more space to move about and heat soak is much reduced which especially important in the high powered cars, I regularly burn my left leg (through 2 layers of Nomex) on the tunnel of my C400.
Most will say 'go for the narrow body it fits around you and feels better', but I believe one develops this opinion the first time you sit in one. If you've sat in both and haven't decided it's worth contemplating further (if that makes sense!)
If you can get the seat right, then go for the SV. If not then stick with the narrow body.
Thanks very much for the replies so far, I will have to see how I get on with each of the chassis options on a test drive. I suppose it comes down to which is most important, track or road use. Track, I suppose, otherwise why a Caterham!
Are there any differences in handling characteristics between the chassis? I have heard some talk about the natural tendency of the SV to understeer more, but I presume this can be countered by set-up or driving style?
Are there any differences in handling characteristics between the chassis? I have heard some talk about the natural tendency of the SV to understeer more, but I presume this can be countered by set-up or driving style?
I'm a fair bit shorter than you, but a good deal heavier (I go about 92Kg). I've got a narrow bodied Superlight, which I bought this past summer. Slotting into the (tillet) seats is a little bit tight, but once i'm in I feel pretty comfortable. I've done a couple of fairly long (100mile+)trips to and from track days with no problems, and the car's on track capabilities are excellent. I agree with your comments about the narrow pedal box. i can't drive mine properly unless I wear quite narrow, slip on trainers, or racing boots. If your main aim is a track car, then look no further. they are a brilliant tool, and loads of fun.
I'm 100kg, 6'2, and fit snugly in a R400 narrow bodied race car - it's got a moulded race seat, which I think saves some space but I find it very comfortable being wedged in the car for track work. Not sure I'd find it so comfortable for road use, though...
I guess if you're intending to do more road driving then the wide body may be better - you can wear a big jacket with stuff in your pockets, but if you're more track focussed, I'd suggest the narrow bodied!
I guess if you're intending to do more road driving then the wide body may be better - you can wear a big jacket with stuff in your pockets, but if you're more track focussed, I'd suggest the narrow bodied!
I'm a bit shorter than you 5'11 and weigh quite a bit more than you and also have larger feet @ 11.
I find the SV feels too big, its chassis does not feel as tight and the frenetics of the whole driving experience are diluted. Road or track, this should be the main reason you are buying a Caterham, so I'd suggest going with the standard chassis. The SV is really only for those with a compelling urge for Ginsters.
Your extra 2" are easily accommodated by seat positioning if you use the Tillet seats.
I find the SV feels too big, its chassis does not feel as tight and the frenetics of the whole driving experience are diluted. Road or track, this should be the main reason you are buying a Caterham, so I'd suggest going with the standard chassis. The SV is really only for those with a compelling urge for Ginsters.
Your extra 2" are easily accommodated by seat positioning if you use the Tillet seats.
Thanks very much for the replies so far, I am now leaning heavily towards the standard chassis, but a test drive in both will probably cement the decision for me.
As a follow on to my original post I alluded to the fact I would have to decide between an R300 and R400, any views on the relative merits of both. I probably intend to buy either a lightly used R400 or possibly a new R300.
I have some fast car experience, but not much fast and lightweight (in Caterham terms). Which is going to suit my requirements best? Is the R400 too much for the road?
As a follow on to my original post I alluded to the fact I would have to decide between an R300 and R400, any views on the relative merits of both. I probably intend to buy either a lightly used R400 or possibly a new R300.
I have some fast car experience, but not much fast and lightweight (in Caterham terms). Which is going to suit my requirements best? Is the R400 too much for the road?
If you have experience in fast cars, the R300 will initialy feel great (down to the weight mainly) but you'll soon get used to it! I'd go the R400 route - not difficult on the road and fantastic for your circuit work. Difficult choice re the chassis. I've now had both (I'm only 75kgs and 5'8) and at the mo I'm impressed with the SV. YES it's not quite as intimate but I have tillet seats and it's set up well for track work so no "rattling around" issues - it's still a fantastic, well balanced chassis that I can drive really hard on circuit but is comfortable 2up driving across to Spa and the 'Ring. If I was only doing circuit work on my own the S3 (standard) would be the better bet but for a mix of fast road/circuit work and long distance all with a passenger the SV is better than I expected. Oh, and no it doesn't bloody understeer!! Quite the opposite in fact 
Have a good think about what you are going to use the car for, go along and have a sit/drive in both and go for what ever feels right. Either way you'll love it. The R400 SV that is.
Have a good think about what you are going to use the car for, go along and have a sit/drive in both and go for what ever feels right. Either way you'll love it. The R400 SV that is.
I'd agree with the above - I went from a 1.6 Roadsport to an R400 so I skipped the Superlight/R300 stage, though I did drive an R300 and a Superlight. I realised that I would be looking to upgrade again if I bought either, so I decided the extra £ required for the R400 was worth it.
I think the R400 is the perfect combination road/track car, as quick as you'll ever need on the road and as quick as cars costing five times as much round the track. It has that genuine kick-in-the-back acceleration which I found lacking in the 1.6 (even though it's a quick car). The R400 really is astonishingly fast! Add low running costs and insurance, plus low depreciation, and it's hard to beat. Which is why I'm struggling to come up with a car to replace mine as and when (if!) I sell it!
I think the R400 is the perfect combination road/track car, as quick as you'll ever need on the road and as quick as cars costing five times as much round the track. It has that genuine kick-in-the-back acceleration which I found lacking in the 1.6 (even though it's a quick car). The R400 really is astonishingly fast! Add low running costs and insurance, plus low depreciation, and it's hard to beat. Which is why I'm struggling to come up with a car to replace mine as and when (if!) I sell it!
Edited by will_ on Thursday 30th October 09:14
TheDeadPrussian said:
Are there any differences in handling characteristics between the chassis? I have heard some talk about the natural tendency of the SV to understeer more, but I presume this can be countered by set-up or driving style?
I can barely tell the difference. I'd say the main difference is how it 'feels' with more space around you. OJ said:
TheDeadPrussian said:
Are there any differences in handling characteristics between the chassis? I have heard some talk about the natural tendency of the SV to understeer more, but I presume this can be countered by set-up or driving style?
I can barely tell the difference. I'd say the main difference is how it 'feels' with more space around you. Edited by cptsideways on Friday 31st October 09:59
we have had a SV for almost 6 years now, and were i to buy a Caterham again, i'd still go for the SV. i'm 6' and about 95kg and have wide shoulders. my decision point as cost wasn't an issue when we bought was based on comfort, and to be frank, having my thighs in semi contact with certain steering wheel activities put me right off. we've got a 6-spd box, LSD, VHPD engine, Brantz rallye computer + Peltor intecom system in it.
we have comfortably traveled all over Europe / the world in our SV:
having driven both a properly setup R500 and our SV there is little perceptible difference providing the car is setup and corner-weighted properly.
we have also been able to grab 2 cases of Barolo in the NW of Italy, 2 cases of Champagne, and may other goodies along the way. load wise, we have learned that the SV affords you a better ability to carry more, when needs must.
were i to buy a new SV now i would put the more narrow seats instead of the S leather, but that would be it. otherwise there's absolutely no reason not to spring the small amount of £'s and get the bigger chassis.
we have comfortably traveled all over Europe / the world in our SV:
- loop all around the whole of Ireland
- several Targa-Liege rallyes (4-6,000 km)
- Rome and back from Londonium
- USA2005 ( 4,000 miles driving)
having driven both a properly setup R500 and our SV there is little perceptible difference providing the car is setup and corner-weighted properly.
we have also been able to grab 2 cases of Barolo in the NW of Italy, 2 cases of Champagne, and may other goodies along the way. load wise, we have learned that the SV affords you a better ability to carry more, when needs must.
were i to buy a new SV now i would put the more narrow seats instead of the S leather, but that would be it. otherwise there's absolutely no reason not to spring the small amount of £'s and get the bigger chassis.
Gassing Station | Caterham | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff