anyone know this R500?
Discussion
BertBert said:
fergus said:
...however, do agree that Minister do have a cult following amongst R500 owners....
You really don't like Minister do you? Have they offended in the past?BErt
So did I!
However when I viewed it, it was not the car I was hoping for and a few things were described incorrectly. It didn't have the airbox for example.
The guy selling it is a really nice chap and I hope someone will be really happy with the car.
However, I sold my MNR R1 powered BEC on sunday and that R500 was not as quick as it or as good at braking as it. As it was the first R500 I viewed I need to do more homework.
However when I viewed it, it was not the car I was hoping for and a few things were described incorrectly. It didn't have the airbox for example.
The guy selling it is a really nice chap and I hope someone will be really happy with the car.
However, I sold my MNR R1 powered BEC on sunday and that R500 was not as quick as it or as good at braking as it. As it was the first R500 I viewed I need to do more homework.
bitsilly said:
So did I!
However when I viewed it, it was not the car I was hoping for and a few things were described incorrectly. It didn't have the airbox for example.
The guy selling it is a really nice chap and I hope someone will be really happy with the car.
However, I sold my MNR R1 powered BEC on sunday and that R500 was not as quick as it or as good at braking as it. As it was the first R500 I viewed I need to do more homework.
That's a bit confusing after...However when I viewed it, it was not the car I was hoping for and a few things were described incorrectly. It didn't have the airbox for example.
The guy selling it is a really nice chap and I hope someone will be really happy with the car.
However, I sold my MNR R1 powered BEC on sunday and that R500 was not as quick as it or as good at braking as it. As it was the first R500 I viewed I need to do more homework.
bitsilly said:
I have bought said car.
BertBert,
initially the car was sold subject to the discussions between me and the dealer. Initially it was not available for viewing or testdrive. I was over optimistic saying I had bought it.
James,
I really hope you have driven a few lightweight bike engined track cars as I was hoping the R500 would be a leap forward in performance and you lol-ing seems to support that this would normally be true. It gives me hope that perhaps normally they are, because my choice is test another one or two or go back to BEC's.
Fair point about the sensations of the cars being different.
initially the car was sold subject to the discussions between me and the dealer. Initially it was not available for viewing or testdrive. I was over optimistic saying I had bought it.
James,
I really hope you have driven a few lightweight bike engined track cars as I was hoping the R500 would be a leap forward in performance and you lol-ing seems to support that this would normally be true. It gives me hope that perhaps normally they are, because my choice is test another one or two or go back to BEC's.
Fair point about the sensations of the cars being different.
The interesting things is what you are looking for in a performance road or track car. It would be a surprise to me if one could really want a faster road car of that form factor (small open two seater). It must come down to the experience. On the road a CEC and a BEC will feel differnt, but I would reach for different paradigm to describe that rather than acceleration or breaking.
What are you looking for having sold your BEC?
Bert
What are you looking for having sold your BEC?
Bert
I have a Caterham Busa with a full house 1397cc race tuned motor & Fireblade seven / Did have a Blackbird engined one last year & having started out with a standard R400 that I had turned into a 1.9k with 257bhp, so I feel reasonably able to comment with a degree of authority on the relative merits of the two types!
Basically the standard 230bhp R500 would be roughly equivalent in performance terms to a new standard 1340cc Busa seven upto 100mph or so & just a bit faster than a old style standard busa engine. A fully tuned 1.9k with 250bhp ish is on a virtual performance par with my tuned 1400cc Busa, posting identical quater mile times to within less than 0.1 of a second but the bike engine car having a higher speed over the line by a good few miles per hour.
So as I said if you genuinely think that your R1 powered thingy-a-mejig was faster than the R500 you drove there was something amiss for sure.
As for the braking not being as good, that could be down to a number of things starting with the car having its original old hardened tyres on still / brakes needing bleeding through / corner weights not set up / glazed or hard pads etc etc. Properly done no road car without proper downforce can brake later or stop quicker than a Caterham!
Basically the standard 230bhp R500 would be roughly equivalent in performance terms to a new standard 1340cc Busa seven upto 100mph or so & just a bit faster than a old style standard busa engine. A fully tuned 1.9k with 250bhp ish is on a virtual performance par with my tuned 1400cc Busa, posting identical quater mile times to within less than 0.1 of a second but the bike engine car having a higher speed over the line by a good few miles per hour.
So as I said if you genuinely think that your R1 powered thingy-a-mejig was faster than the R500 you drove there was something amiss for sure.
As for the braking not being as good, that could be down to a number of things starting with the car having its original old hardened tyres on still / brakes needing bleeding through / corner weights not set up / glazed or hard pads etc etc. Properly done no road car without proper downforce can brake later or stop quicker than a Caterham!
CSR is tempting!
Bert,
I had a tuned John Eales V8 Westfield which had grunt from any speed or gear, I loved that grunt but it was a cumbersome beast and fairly lazy driving.
I loved the lightweight lack of inertia feel of the BEC but you had to catch it rust right to find the performance and it had little top end grunt. Highly chuckable though.
I'd like the best of both those worlds! Another way of looking at it is I'd like to see passengers scream.
The priority is to have easy fun at the track (the BEC required a full tool kit and trailer at all times) but if it has a hood or tonneau it would be used up the mountains and around the lakes.
One idea would be a CSR and if it didn't work, sell it an a couple of years and then go for a Duratec R500.
I would also like to get into drifting a bit, it is allowed at Llandow usually in the afternoon. Oh and to have fun! And lose weight and grow more hair! And....
Bert,
I had a tuned John Eales V8 Westfield which had grunt from any speed or gear, I loved that grunt but it was a cumbersome beast and fairly lazy driving.
I loved the lightweight lack of inertia feel of the BEC but you had to catch it rust right to find the performance and it had little top end grunt. Highly chuckable though.
I'd like the best of both those worlds! Another way of looking at it is I'd like to see passengers scream.
The priority is to have easy fun at the track (the BEC required a full tool kit and trailer at all times) but if it has a hood or tonneau it would be used up the mountains and around the lakes.
One idea would be a CSR and if it didn't work, sell it an a couple of years and then go for a Duratec R500.
I would also like to get into drifting a bit, it is allowed at Llandow usually in the afternoon. Oh and to have fun! And lose weight and grow more hair! And....
So that sounds like a you have a bracket for your performance characteristics...
Westy V8 too torquey and lazy
BEC fun, chuckable, manic but too much effort to get the performance
So your choices (having decided that a caterham has or can have the right handling feel) mostly lie in the engine:
k-series - old R500 or similar (1800, or R101 or DVA type 1900 scholar build)
Tuned or turbo Busa
Duratec 2.3 - a la CSR 200 or 260
Duratec 2.0 - a la R300/400/500
So there's the test drive menu! I suspect that optimum for you would be new R500 with seq box. I wonder how much of your poor view of the R500 was down to the lack of seq. box?
One question is going to be how your budget matches.
So from low to high:
(old) R500 type or more probably one of the bigger output k's
Tuned busa
CSR 260
(new) R500
Easy really. Make DSL an offer he cant refuse for his tuned buserham!
Bert
Westy V8 too torquey and lazy
BEC fun, chuckable, manic but too much effort to get the performance
So your choices (having decided that a caterham has or can have the right handling feel) mostly lie in the engine:
k-series - old R500 or similar (1800, or R101 or DVA type 1900 scholar build)
Tuned or turbo Busa
Duratec 2.3 - a la CSR 200 or 260
Duratec 2.0 - a la R300/400/500
So there's the test drive menu! I suspect that optimum for you would be new R500 with seq box. I wonder how much of your poor view of the R500 was down to the lack of seq. box?
One question is going to be how your budget matches.
So from low to high:
(old) R500 type or more probably one of the bigger output k's
Tuned busa
CSR 260
(new) R500
Easy really. Make DSL an offer he cant refuse for his tuned buserham!
Bert
Bert thanks for taking the time,
what you said rings true.
The sequential box on a new R500 would be a hoot but is beyond the budget unless I hold off and keep saving.
The busa power is not something I had considered but would make a lot of sense. I guess they are like hens teeth as I have never seen one for sale??
I will add BEC caterhams to my wanted ad! Are any of them factory built?
DSL, are you planning on selling any time soon?
Thanks a million for the help and feedback gents.
Ed
what you said rings true.
The sequential box on a new R500 would be a hoot but is beyond the budget unless I hold off and keep saving.
The busa power is not something I had considered but would make a lot of sense. I guess they are like hens teeth as I have never seen one for sale??
I will add BEC caterhams to my wanted ad! Are any of them factory built?
DSL, are you planning on selling any time soon?
Thanks a million for the help and feedback gents.
Ed
Gassing Station | Caterham | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff