Does anyone know the history of this caterham?
Discussion
Chris71 said:
I don't know much about the longevity of the K-Series at high outputs, but the only one I looked at with circa 200bhp had receipts for numerous engine repairs (several head gaskets for example), so it's definitely worth reading into.
If the liners are not set at the correct height (0.004" proud) or the fire ring lands peened, it may well continue to eat through head gaskets. Do the job once properly and warm the car up slowly and you're not likely to have a problem... Speak to DVA if in doubt
casbar said:
My R300's clutch/gearbox sounds like a bag of nails when the engine is running and out of gear, nothing to worry about. Well if it is, mines been like it for 4 years 
Fine mist of oil - would say they all do that, and I'd guess not an issue to sort out, could be coming from anywhere, but again, mine tends to have some oil underneath, probably from the gearbox I'd guess.
Thanks, thats good to know.Fine mist of oil - would say they all do that, and I'd guess not an issue to sort out, could be coming from anywhere, but again, mine tends to have some oil underneath, probably from the gearbox I'd guess.
Chris71 said:
Yep, Caterham powertrains can be quite vocal, don't forget the plate type limited slip diffs can be very noisy and that sometimes carries forwards to sound like a gearbox fault. The best thing is to go and have a look at cars of similar spec to the sort of thing you're hoping to buy and get an idea of what's normal. They do vary quite a lot and - assuming you're not already familiar with Caterhams - it would be good to get a feel for them.
Mine's not up to the sort of spec you're looking at, but you're welcome to come and kick some tyres if that's any help. Likewise, heading over to the local Lotus Seven Club meet would be a wise idea.
I don't know much about the longevity of the K-Series at high outputs, but the only one I looked at with circa 200bhp had receipts for numerous engine repairs (several head gaskets for example), so it's definitely worth reading into.
Thanks for the offer Chris, where abouts are you based?Mine's not up to the sort of spec you're looking at, but you're welcome to come and kick some tyres if that's any help. Likewise, heading over to the local Lotus Seven Club meet would be a wise idea.
I don't know much about the longevity of the K-Series at high outputs, but the only one I looked at with circa 200bhp had receipts for numerous engine repairs (several head gaskets for example), so it's definitely worth reading into.
fergus said:
Nerra said:
He said there is fine misting of oil on the sump and a slight rattle from a release bearing at the top of the clutch? I presume he's talking about the thrust bearing?..... got a quote from their specialist to carry out the work and it came to £900.....
So the garage has turned round and said that if they do carry this work out that they will be adding it on to the price.
In my experience of thrust bearings, if thats what he's on about, they tend to rattle a bit anyway and the fine misting of oil is not a biggy, what do you guys think?
The thrust/clutch release bearing (CRB) is MAX £300 to do (even though the part is only circa £10). The source of the mist needs investigating, and I'd be surprised if it cost more than £50 to put right. Ask who provided the quote!So the garage has turned round and said that if they do carry this work out that they will be adding it on to the price.
In my experience of thrust bearings, if thats what he's on about, they tend to rattle a bit anyway and the fine misting of oil is not a biggy, what do you guys think?
The guy never got back to me (surprise, surprise) with the details of the garage who carried out the conversion so I'll have to get on the phone and hassle him again tomorrow
The most important thing about this car is the engine. A that bhp it has to have had a proper and expensive job done to get there.
Also it has a high cost risk going forward- that's top end power for a k.
From a buying pov, do you have a rationale for wanting that much power? It will give it a specific driving experience.
Many work on the more is better ethos. More is actually different. For me I'd rather run 160 ish hp. 245 is not my bag at all on the road.
Bert
Also it has a high cost risk going forward- that's top end power for a k.
From a buying pov, do you have a rationale for wanting that much power? It will give it a specific driving experience.
Many work on the more is better ethos. More is actually different. For me I'd rather run 160 ish hp. 245 is not my bag at all on the road.
Bert
BertBert said:
The most important thing about this car is the engine. A that bhp it has to have had a proper and expensive job done to get there.
Also it has a high cost risk going forward- that's top end power for a k.
DVA has done a 257hp K Also it has a high cost risk going forward- that's top end power for a k.
PS doesn't necesseriliy mean Minister expensive, but granted, you'd want to see a ream of invoices!
Nerra said:
Thanks for the offer Chris, where abouts are you based?
Enfield, just off the top of the M25 (J24/25 type area).Wherever you are you'll probably find loads of people ready to lend advice and happy to let you take a look (most of whom know a lot more than me - if it's not already abudantly clear I should point I'm quite new to this too!)
That's the great thing about Caterham ownership though - it's full of people who really know their stuff and there's no shortage of them. They're a very hands on and remarkably helpful bunch that I'm already much in-debted to.
BertBert said:
The most important thing about this car is the engine. A that bhp it has to have had a proper and expensive job done to get there.
Also it has a high cost risk going forward- that's top end power for a k.
From a buying pov, do you have a rationale for wanting that much power? It will give it a specific driving experience.
Many work on the more is better ethos. More is actually different. For me I'd rather run 160 ish hp. 245 is not my bag at all on the road.
Bert
I'm not looking for the most powerful caterham out there, I would be happy with 190bhp. I fully agree with you that more is definitely not always better. If this particular Caterham was making 190bhp I would still be interested as I like the spec, condition and colourAlso it has a high cost risk going forward- that's top end power for a k.
From a buying pov, do you have a rationale for wanting that much power? It will give it a specific driving experience.
Many work on the more is better ethos. More is actually different. For me I'd rather run 160 ish hp. 245 is not my bag at all on the road.
Bert
I imagine that an engine like this gets all its power through revving like hell in other words right at the top of the rev range. That would make it a lot more usable than an engine with a big turbo on for instance which could easily bite you in the arse if you're not careful.
So my thinking is that day to day I would simply not be taking it to 9000rpm (or where ever it redlines at) and so the engine would generally have a pretty easy life but then come the odd track day there would be a bit more range to play with.
From my bike engine experience, I know that engines tend to go pop when they are constantly over revved (valves start to stretch etc)and this almost always happens when racing as opposed to on the road. It was very common when riders switched from a 2 stroke over to a 4 stroke. If you short shift and keep well within the rev range then the engine would stay rock solid.
I appreciate the questions and the feedback. I'm here to learn and all your advice is greatly appreciated.
fergus said:
BertBert said:
The most important thing about this car is the engine. A that bhp it has to have had a proper and expensive job done to get there.
Also it has a high cost risk going forward- that's top end power for a k.
DVA has done a 257hp K Also it has a high cost risk going forward- that's top end power for a k.
PS doesn't necesseriliy mean Minister expensive, but granted, you'd want to see a ream of invoices!
Chris71 said:
That's the great thing about Caterham ownership though - it's full of people who really know their stuff and there's no shortage of them. They're a very hands on and remarkably helpful bunch that I'm already much in-debted to.
Thats the impression I get and definitely one of the big reasons I want to own one. fergus said:
Chris71 said:
They're a very hands on and remarkably helpful bunch that I'm already much in-debted to.
Nerra said:
I would be happy with 190bhp.
The tweaked one I drove was still remarkably tractable - far more so than the BECs I've sampled.It may be worth trying a few standard Supersports as well. You've obviously driven lightweights before if you're a BEC man, but you might still be surprised just how far a mere 138bhp will go with an extra slug of torque. If nothing else it'll give you a baseline. I'd try and get passenger rides or better still drives in everything you can. That way when a good one crops up for sale you'll be confident in handing over the cash.
If you're looking at the high performance end of the spectrum it might be worth looking at ex-race cars too. They will get used more, but I'm a firm believer that enthusiastic owners are more likely to notice problems with the car and sort them out. The most knowledgeable people I've come across are all ex-racers and the few sellers who didn't inspire confidence when I was looking were firmly in the 'polisher' camp. Believe it or not you do get people selling 500kg's of stripped out road racer Caterham and proudly advertising that it's never been on track as if that's a good thing. One guy I spoke to entrusted the whole thing to "my mechanic" and didn't even know if it had seen an oil change during his ownership at all.
Chris71 said:
One guy I spoke to entrusted the whole thing to "my mechanic" and didn't even know if it had seen an oil change during his ownership at all.
...yes but I bet it had every bolt on extra that the great and the good of BC had collectively recommended in their sheep like wisdom...... 
Right, I spoke to the guy at the garage and he has informed me that a chap named Simon Erland did the conversion. He was happy to pass on his contact details.
A quick google of the name brought this up...
http://www.elise-r.co.uk/category/king_k/
...which doesn't fill me with confidence. I also asked if the V5 showed it as being a 1.6 or a 1.8 and its still registered as a 1.6.
A quick google of the name brought this up...
http://www.elise-r.co.uk/category/king_k/
...which doesn't fill me with confidence. I also asked if the V5 showed it as being a 1.6 or a 1.8 and its still registered as a 1.6.
Nerra said:
Right, I spoke to the guy at the garage and he has informed me that a chap named Simon Erland did the conversion. He was happy to pass on his contact details.
A quick google of the name brought this up...
http://www.elise-r.co.uk/category/king_k/
...which doesn't fill me with confidence. I also asked if the V5 showed it as being a 1.6 or a 1.8 and its still registered as a 1.6.
I think you may be wise to walk away from this car/engine combo. I don't think an Erland 245hp will be as reliable as a minister/DVA 245hp car.....A quick google of the name brought this up...
http://www.elise-r.co.uk/category/king_k/
...which doesn't fill me with confidence. I also asked if the V5 showed it as being a 1.6 or a 1.8 and its still registered as a 1.6.
Do your homework prior to parting with any cash. If the engine goes pop, due to the likely hood of running non standard parts at that power, the cost of putting it right is likely to be higher!
fergus said:
Nerra said:
Right, I spoke to the guy at the garage and he has informed me that a chap named Simon Erland did the conversion. He was happy to pass on his contact details.
A quick google of the name brought this up...
http://www.elise-r.co.uk/category/king_k/
...which doesn't fill me with confidence. I also asked if the V5 showed it as being a 1.6 or a 1.8 and its still registered as a 1.6.
I think you may be wise to walk away from this car/engine combo. I don't think an Erland 245hp will be as reliable as a minister/DVA 245hp car.....A quick google of the name brought this up...
http://www.elise-r.co.uk/category/king_k/
...which doesn't fill me with confidence. I also asked if the V5 showed it as being a 1.6 or a 1.8 and its still registered as a 1.6.
Do your homework prior to parting with any cash. If the engine goes pop, due to the likely hood of running non standard parts at that power, the cost of putting it right is likely to be higher!
fergus said:
Mark, surely there's 'good provenance', then 'very heavy tuning input' to move from an R400 race car engine (circa 210hp?) to a claimed 245hp?
Personally, I'd want to see an invoice for the work done to the car and a recent dyno plot on a reputable, known dyno.
LOL missed that Fergus! That's a hell of a lot of power!Personally, I'd want to see an invoice for the work done to the car and a recent dyno plot on a reputable, known dyno.
Nerra said:
I imagine that an engine like this gets all its power through revving like hell in other words right at the top of the rev range. That would make it a lot more usable than an engine with a big turbo on for instance which could easily bite you in the arse if you're not careful.
....surely they both deliver the same effect - a sudden rush of power????? depends on what cams have been used, how well it has been mapped, etc etc
If Tango 7 can vouch for the provenance of the car, I'd say it was a good car. Whose car was it Nick? Not Jue's or Nigel's? Neither of them was yellow was it?
Nerra said:
Right, I spoke to the guy at the garage and he has informed me that a chap named Simon Erland did the conversion. He was happy to pass on his contact details.
Hey, Simon is a spot on guy - done some clever stuff with cranks - a mate has a development engine in his Motorsport Elise that Simon built....it has...ermmm...a little more power than standard 
He's also a perfectionist.rubystone said:
If Tango 7 can vouch for the provenance of the car, I'd say it was a good car. Whose car was it Nick? Not Jue's or Nigel's? Neither of them was yellow was it?
Hi Ruby,No, it belonged to a chap I met a couple of years ago and bought some bits off - in fact i have the original engine from this car sitting in my garage! I kept in touch as he asked for my opinion on the S2 Exiges and the toyota lump.
Cheers
Nick
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