Star Photography

[rxtx]

It's a satellite.

[The Tea Boy]

by far my favorite thread on PH in ages,
Im off to the serra nevada mountains in spain in just over a week and hoping to get some star pics, although ive never done it before, guessing essentials will be; tripod and remote interval timer (of which i have both|)
will be taking the laptop with me so will hopfully have time to play, although there will be lot of driving to do during the day and also some 'other' things in the evenings as its my honeymoon
gotta make the mosy whilst it lasts


Matt

[threeglasgows]

Bob_Defly said:

I've had a look at some of the pics and threads on here about astro photography, but still just can't seem to get it right.

Basically what I'm after is two different type of shots:

Star trails like this:



And just stars/milky way, like this:



I see there is a lot of settings to consider, so some trial and error, but if anyone could answer these questions I would be grateful.

Trails:
1. For trails why do people use ISO's from 800-1600? Surely a lower ISO would enable a longer shutter speed, and a longer trail?
2. Can you stack the images in PS, or do you need dedicated software? If PS is OK, is there a tutorial or action that anyone on here has used?
3. I tried getting some trails last night, but the sky was coming out very bright, do you rally have to be miles from anywhere to try this? The thing is, I see a lot of star trail images with buildings and things in the foreground (which I would also like to do), how do you stop them from lighting up the rest of the frame on a long exposure?
4. Any help with ISO/shutter speed/aperture would be useful.

Static night sky:
1. I also tried this last night, high ISO, faster shutter etc. Got nothing. I think it was too bright. Has anyone has any success at these type of shots within say 50 miles of a city? I don't know how far out in the sticks I have to be to be able to see this?
2. Does a wide aperture and high ISO cause any issues? I imagine you have to get the focus just right otherwise everything will come out soft.
3. Anything else to help would be great!

Also for either shot, do I need to know moon cycles, light polution maps etc.? I live in Waterloo, Ontario BTW.

I have the time to experiment, but with two young toddlers and a demanding job, I can't be out all night every night, so anything that would speed up my learning would be greatly appreciated, thanks!



P.S. There is a building near me (in the city) that I would love to have as the foreground, but I fear the light polution might not make it possible.

Hey small world I'm in Guelph. Just getting in to photography again and star trails look like a good challenge. If you are ever looking for someone to tag along P.M. me.

[XKjimmy]

Had ago tonight, after all the rain we had I was surprised by how clear it was.

One is trying to get a clearer picture of the Milkyway.


Milkyway by 635djimmy, on Flickr


And this is another star trail..... sorry.. Quite pleased how it turned out though. The Milkyway and stars were accompanied by an RAF hercules. this was 71 photos stacked with StarStax


New star trail by 635djimmy, on Flickr

[HoHoHo]

Thought I'd give Worthing a go but too foggy, so I wandered up to the top of the hill past Amberley and whilst mixing it with couples up to god knows what in the car park, I had another go.

Aside from the fact the bloody camera fogged up again, I did look rather odd with a camera whilst the rest were humping!


19 November 2011 by Martin_Bennett, on Flickr

Any tips to help stop the fogging issue?

[ben_h100]

This is one of my first attempts a startrails; trying to get the actual trail technique nailed before moving onto composition, etc.


1st attempt by benhphotos, on Flickr

I set the camera to manual with a 30 sec exposure, ISO 200 and F8. I manually focused for what I thought was infinity (18-55mm kit lens).

I'm wondering why the trails appear grainy, any tips/ideas? Would a wide angle lens help?

Cheers

[AndWhyNot]

HoHoHo said:

Any tips to help stop the fogging issue?

Some nights are just like that. Face your camera away from any wind and give it lots of time to adopt the ambient temperature before commencing shooting. I always keep mine in the boot rather than main car compartment and stick it outside as soon as i arrive on location whilst i'm setting stuff up.

ben_h100 said:

This is one of my first attempts a startrails; trying to get the actual trail technique nailed before moving onto composition, etc.

I set the camera to manual with a 30 sec exposure, ISO 200 and F8. I manually focused for what I thought was infinity (18-55mm kit lens).

I'm wondering why the trails appear grainy, any tips/ideas? Would a wide angle lens help?

Cheers

Looks to me like your tripod wasn't steady.

IMO if you're shooting star trails then f/8 is too narrow an aperture. If the trails are incidental to another subject that requires such a setting then fair enough. Shooting with a wider aperture requires more accurate focusing so I always autofocus on something - usually the most distant light I can see, whether that's a streetlamp or the moon. It helps to have an understanding of DoF and how it changes not just with aperture but focal length and focal range.

[HoHoHo]

Reflecting on the fact I've been busy abroad and when home had limited time to drive in the evening, I thought I'd have another play with settings and created the following:

f/5
19mm
30 seconds
ISO 100


Startrail 27th November 2011 by Martin_Bennett, on Flickr

No fogging tonight which was a bonus!

I'm now thinking I should stick a low ND filter on the bottom third in an instance such as this to reduce the light from rooms, lights outside etc.?

C & C welcome

[AndWhyNot]

HoHoHo said:

I'm now thinking I should stick a low ND filter on the bottom third in an instance such as this to reduce the light from rooms, lights outside etc.?

In theory the filter idea is sound but in practice they flare so badly IME.

When I shot this to try the concept I had to position the telegraph pole in front of a streetlamp to prevent godawful flaring. Not just shards through the frame but inverted reflections. Don't let me stop you trying but with such limited flexibility over composition, I'd look for other ways around the issue.

[midgeman]

Had a go the other night wh no joy, its clearer again tonight so was going to give it a go, any suggested settings to try?

Was playing around with high ISO and low aperature which worked but think ISO was too high really. Maybe it was too dark as suggested above.

[HoHoHo]

I try and have the ISO as low as possible.

The recent shot has Exif shown, 30 second exposure, f/5. Then simply stacked in Starstax and sharpened a bit.

The man to ask is Andwhynot, he's the master of the night

[XKjimmy]

All clear (and cold...) tonight so I thought I would have another go at a trail. I wanted to practice focusing on an object in the fore ground. This was made from 20 photographs, 30 second exposure. ISO 400 F2.8 and
I quite like the clock in it thats stopped showing time stopping.


Clock star trail by 635djimmy, on Flickr

[XKjimmy]

Sorry.... another one, this was was trying to locate the northern star and capture that, quite pleased with it, much prefer it to the closer up images.


Northern star by 635djimmy, on Flickr

[dxbtiger]

Right, clear skies forecast in Dubai tonight so I am heading away from the urban sprawl armed with my MC-DC2 to try my hand at this.

Just checking the idiots guide I have prepared for myself is going to yield some sort of result.

- Don't forget tripod
- Will use either 50mm 1.8 or 25-702 2.8 dependant on 'foreground interest'
- Shoot in JPG fine
- Shoot as wide open, low ISO as possible, 30 seconds (check test shots)
- Camera on H shooting mode (Nikon lingo)
- MC-DC2 wired remote locked on.
- Read PH on blackberry for as long as I can be bothered to wait for, minimum an hour
- Stack in Starstax when i get home whilst watching my boys get hammered by Arsenal.

Aim South for long trails
Aim towards Polaris for the circular effect around it.

Have I missed anything?

Assume the camera will continue to shoot on those settings as long as there is space on the card and battery. I have a higher milliamp one charged and ready to go.

[AndWhyNot]

Generally you want to avoid shooting startrails under a full moon (as tonight). If you find somewhere to shoot at f/2.8 you'll have to resort to very short frames to control the ambient light, probably 15sec or less. The plus side of the bright moon is that it can do a good job of fill light on the foreground.

[dxbtiger]

AndWhyNot said:

Generally you want to avoid shooting startrails under a full moon (as tonight). If you find somewhere to shoot at f/2.8 you'll have to resort to very short frames to control the ambient light, probably 15sec or less. The plus side of the bright moon is that it can do a good job of fill light on the foreground.

Hmmm, ok, hadn't factored the moon into my thinking at all....

TBH I am going to head out into the desert with a friend and see if we come across anything for foreground, if not I will use the 'Stang as a last resort so can be flexible with where the moon is in relation to the camera and can use it as a fill.

That all told, assume I can amend my instructions in the post above to a shorter time frame and just let her rip?

Thanks in advance.

[AndWhyNot]

dxbtiger said:

AndWhyNot said:

Generally you want to avoid shooting startrails under a full moon (as tonight). If you find somewhere to shoot at f/2.8 you'll have to resort to very short frames to control the ambient light, probably 15sec or less. The plus side of the bright moon is that it can do a good job of fill light on the foreground.

Hmmm, ok, hadn't factored the moon into my thinking at all....

TBH I am going to head out into the desert with a friend and see if we come across anything for foreground, if not I will use the 'Stang as a last resort so can be flexible with where the moon is in relation to the camera and can use it as a fill.

That all told, assume I can amend my instructions in the post above to a shorter time frame and just let her rip?

Thanks in advance.

Pretty much.

Might not need an hour. Longer lenses amplify the movement relative to frame size so the trails appear to move further.

Depending which Nikon you're using, the maximum consecutive frame releases might be limited to 100. Calculate how long it'll take to do 80 releases then, in the middle of a frame, unlock your release to let the button assume it's resting position, then relock - all within a couple of seconds. This resets the counter. Repeat as necessary.

Switch Long Exposure Noise Reduction off. Set your WB manually so it doesn't shift mid-stack - start around 3570K under a full moon and adjust as appropriate. RAW gives you a safety net but you're unlikely to process and stack 60(mins) x4(per min) RAW frames so get the foreground captured in RAW then save the card space and shoot JPG only.

[dxbtiger]

AndWhyNot said:

Pretty much.

Might not need an hour. Longer lenses amplify the movement relative to frame size so the trails appear to move further.

Depending which Nikon you're using, the maximum consecutive frame releases might be limited to 100. Calculate how long it'll take to do 80 releases then, in the middle of a frame, unlock your release to let the button assume it's resting position, then relock - all within a couple of seconds. This resets the counter. Repeat as necessary.

Switch Long Exposure Noise Reduction off. Set your WB manually so it doesn't shift mid-stack - start around 3570K under a full moon and adjust as appropriate. RAW gives you a safety net but you're unlikely to process and stack 60(mins) x4(per min) RAW frames so get the foreground captured in RAW then save the card space and shoot JPG only.

Superstar, thanks.

Shooting with a D90, I can find reference to D80 having maximum 100 consecutive JPG's but nothing on the Nikon site for D90, may consult the manual when home unless anyone knows? have also asked on the D90 page but unsure if that will get an answer by the time I leave home. Friend who is coming along for the ride has a d7000 which is 999 apparently so more than enough.

[dibbly dobbler]

Not saying necessarily that you want to produce anything like my recent efforts but I've been shooting quite wide angle (say 10-15mm) and still getting decent trails after about 30-40 minutes.

Only other tip would be to prefocus your lens on something before you go out into the dark (check hyperfocal distances) and then stick it on manual focus - reason being it can be hard to get it to autofocus if everything around you is dark.

Double and triple check your test shot before kicking off the sequence as it's a nightmare if you discover later that it's soft or not quite correctly composed or whatever. Good luck!

[dxbtiger]

dibbly dobbler said:

Not saying necessarily that you want to produce anything like my recent efforts but I've been shooting quite wide angle (say 10-15mm) and still getting decent trails after about 30-40 minutes.

Only other tip would be to prefocus your lens on something before you go out into the dark (check hyperfocal distances) and then stick it on manual focus - reason being it can be hard to get it to autofocus if everything around you is dark.

Double and triple check your test shot before kicking off the sequence as it's a nightmare if you discover later that it's soft or not quite correctly composed or whatever. Good luck!

All advice gladly received, if I can approach anything like your recent work tonight I'll be a happy chap.

Just printed the Hyperfocal chart from DOFmaster which will come with us and should help.

Just need to think of a location now!